DrumCorpsFan27 Posted March 6, 2007 Author Share Posted March 6, 2007 "Age-appropriate" comes to mind. And...the kids don't stop learning how to write at that point..it's an entry point to what comes after.Year in and year out of the same sort of thing...it's not like the instructor ever progressed beyond what I mentioned...the next year, with most of the same players...it was again...learn to play that year's music by rote. Don't forget, they had weekly rehearsals all winter long...time to do more than what was done. I later was a percussion arranger and instructor for the same corps. I made darn sure my timpani line could 1) read bass clef and 2) understand pitch. We worked all winter on ear training, and I insisted they memorize their music from the printed page, not by rote. The same brass person was still teaching by rote to any kids who did not know how to read music coming into the corps. Kindergarten teachers also stop at a certain point. Others then take over and teach them more. Same happened for you. The instructor stopped at a certain point and you learned more from others. Year after year the instructor had new people to teach from step one. You may not like his approach and certainly a more dynamic instructor may have helped those who new it already to learn more, but he did teach something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nex Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 I have already discussed those issues. Those terms are part of academia. Corps trying to present themselves as such is inappropriate in my opinion. I think language, and the words we choose to convey messages are important. Now you have a response, although you won't like it. You're right; I don't like it. I don't like it because you did not really address those issues. You say they are part of academia, but those definitions are straight out of Merriam-Webster. They don't mention strictly academia. You're trying to put your own perception on the words that don't have to necessarily be there. It's like the Florida senator who is trying to keep legislators from using the term "illegal alien" because she thinks it is offensive and that "alien" should only be used for extraterrestrials. It's not the sole definition, and it's not even the primary one. You're taking one particular definition and trying to say that's the only way the word can be used, and that's just not correct. You're also right in that our word choices are important, but you have to include every definition in your vocabulary, not just the ones you think should be there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtgpercussion Posted March 7, 2007 Share Posted March 7, 2007 (edited) Some of this may of been talked about awhile ago. http://www.drumcorpsplanet.com/forums/inde...c=71264&hl= http://www.drumcorpsplanet.com/forums/inde...71264&st=10 Edited March 7, 2007 by mtgpercussion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrumCorpsFan27 Posted March 7, 2007 Author Share Posted March 7, 2007 You're right; I don't like it. I don't like it because you did not really address those issues. You say they are part of academia, but those definitions are straight out of Merriam-Webster. They don't mention strictly academia. You're trying to put your own perception on the words that don't have to necessarily be there. It's like the Florida senator who is trying to keep legislators from using the term "illegal alien" because she thinks it is offensive and that "alien" should only be used for extraterrestrials. It's not the sole definition, and it's not even the primary one. You're taking one particular definition and trying to say that's the only way the word can be used, and that's just not correct. You're also right in that our word choices are important, but you have to include every definition in your vocabulary, not just the ones you think should be there. Drum corps is a competitive performance activity. One must learn in order to be successful at it. Do Olympic skaters call their coaches teachers? Do their coaches call the skaters students? Yet learning is occuring. Teaching is being done. Students have learning goals measured by standard criteria. Drum corps has competitve goals measured by placement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrumCorpsFan27 Posted March 7, 2007 Author Share Posted March 7, 2007 Some of this may of been talked about awhile ago.http://www.drumcorpsplanet.com/forums/inde...c=71264&hl= http://www.drumcorpsplanet.com/forums/inde...71264&st=10 I couldn't open the first link but the second link shows I am consitent in my position. There are those who agree with me and those who don't, just as there are in this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nex Posted March 8, 2007 Share Posted March 8, 2007 (edited) Drum corps is a competitive performance activity. One must learn in order to be successful at it. Do Olympic skaters call their coaches teachers? Do their coaches call the skaters students? Yet learning is occuring. Teaching is being done. Students have learning goals measured by standard criteria. Drum corps has competitve goals measured by placement. Well . . . there are standard criteria on the scoring sheets, however I realize that's not what you mean. Regardless, you are still trying to say that "They cannot be called students because no other competitive sport does" despite the fact that the use of "student" here (or in skating) would be legitimate. As I said before, just because it's not what you would use does not mean it is less correct and it does not mean that it is wrong. And using a word that is legitimate is not being pretentious. Edited March 8, 2007 by Nex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted March 8, 2007 Share Posted March 8, 2007 Drum corps is a competitive performance activity. One must learn in order to be successful at it. Do Olympic skaters call their coaches teachers? Do their coaches call the skaters students? Yet learning is occuring. Teaching is being done. Students have learning goals measured by standard criteria. Drum corps has competitve goals measured by placement. Some of the top skating and gymnastic coaches open schools (Bela Karoli comes to mind) and they refer to their students as...students. I don't see drum corps goals being measured by placement either. Placement is derived from meeting performance-oriented goals; I don't see it as a goal. There are too many variables outside the control of the corps to actually have 'placement' as a goal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunchyTenor Posted March 8, 2007 Share Posted March 8, 2007 SCATS Gymnastics in Orange County, CA, calls their's students, too, but still refer to staff as "coaches and staff". I guess it's anyone's choice how they do it, but i still associate "student" and "faculty" with academia, too. I guess that's my choice! Garry in Vegas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrumCorpsFan27 Posted March 8, 2007 Author Share Posted March 8, 2007 Well . . . there are standard criteria on the scoring sheets, however I realize that's not what you mean. Regardless, you are still trying to say that "They cannot be called students because no other competitive sport does" despite the fact that the use of "student" here (or in skating) would be legitimate. As I said before, just because it's not what you would use does not mean it is less correct and it does not mean that it is wrong. And using a word that is legitimate is not being pretentious. So, anytime someone learns something from someone else, they should be considered a student, formally? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrumCorpsFan27 Posted March 8, 2007 Author Share Posted March 8, 2007 Some of the top skating and gymnastic coaches open schools (Bela Karoli comes to mind) and they refer to their students as...students. I don't see drum corps goals being measured by placement either. Placement is derived from meeting performance-oriented goals; I don't see it as a goal. There are too many variables outside the control of the corps to actually have 'placement' as a goal. "Open schools." Placement is not a goal? Are you telling me that Cavaliers, Phantom Regiment, Cadets, Blue Coats, Blue Devils and the rest have no interest in winning? Are you telling me that when they design their shows, their is no consideration of what the judges are looking for? How do the drum corps schools (oh wait, they don't call themselves schools, do they) measure the learning goals of their students then? How do they know if the lesson plans have met their objectives? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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