Cleveland1

Ah, i didn't see that

You make fair points jwillis35, but how often are there caption ties? Arent they discouraged from giving ties? I do believe if a 5th place SCV throws down the percussion performance of the year, that they will be rewarded. But any of BD, Cadets, or Bloo could also beat them in percussion. Giving a 19.9 with 3 other top percussion sections left is risky since 3 tenths could be a big difference. Typically i believe judges get it right though.

Yeah. All i have is a video i took of a part of a show on tge dci live webcast. Its annoying because many people who are turning to things like periscoping shows or youtube recordings and ripping them before the corps or dci takes it down or "message me if you want a video of x show", would rather pay a small amount for access to the show and to listen to it in high quality. Typically i download my favorite shows the first chance i can, and then i keep that and listen to it during the week. Then watch weekend webcasts to see/hear changes. Now i have nothing! If dci doesn't want people downloading content illegally, then they shouldnt make it so hard to do it legally. And if many people would pay tbe small price to do it legally, maybe dci would not have become more restrictive of its content.

First time the Academy will be facing off with OC and Cascades right? Should be interesting to see where they stack up. Assuming that they will be above them, but how much? They were narrowly above PC and Mandarins in their meeting in SOCAL.

Placement at prelims is definitely a major influencer on whether a corps can really move up. And the prelims order is determined by regional scores right? So if, for example, SCV is 5th at prelims. They will unlikely be awarded anything higher than a 19.7 in percussion because it would limit BD, Cadets, and Bluecoats ability to outscore fairly. Unless the judge is okay with being forced to award a 20 in percussion. An example, in 2010 Phantom was 6th overall and their percussion was first with a 19.6. Everyone else was below, but the judge likely had to give himself room in the event that other corps were deserving of a better score. I am not sure how much this sort of thing matters during the season, in between regionals.

#1 for best, in my opinion, the ball.

Oh definitely. I found it funny too. But its just going to show that people are pretty open about criticizing other corps shows and elements of the show. I think saying things like "Little Geoffery should play in traffic" is a bit harsh, but i still chuckled when i heard it. And i don't think anyone intended that the person who played him should die, at least i hope not. But it was clear that the folks in the merch truck were not a fan of the cadets production the year before or SCV's that year. So it goes. I also doubt they thought of it themselves (they could have) but it was likely a shared sentiment by other volunteers and staff members, maybe MMs too. I do wonder how much, or little, different corps hear of other corps shows during the season. I think people just like DCI to be a positive space for designers and performers, and let the judges to their jobs and the fans do their jobs, and the mms do their jobs, and the designers do their jobs. Our job, as fans, is to enjoy the show (i know that not everyone on here is just a fan). the staff's job is to be critical and so is the judge's jobs, and the designers need to take the judge's opinions to heart, not our's. But about SCV's 2011 show. I think its a great example of a show that is essentially a percussion show with brass. I think the best shows are ones that balance all sides of the DCI performance triangle together (brass, percussion, guard). Meanwhile Crown has had shows which are Brass at the expense of the others. Blue Knights have had shows that are Guard at the expense of the others. And i've liked each of these shows, but its just examples of this point.

i was not the biggest geoffery supporter (to put that lightly) i do remember talking with the merch staff of another corps (who will remain nameless) who said that Vanguard's 2011 show, the devil's staircase, was a story about little geoffery going to hell. or heck, if hell is bleeped out on dcp. Its strange how split the people were about that show. But i do remember that he played it well, even if i found the character to be over the top annoying. In one way, that was the point. in another, maybe i shouldn't take it so personally when parts of a show annoy me. But i suppose having strong feelings about a show or a part of a show is better than no feelings at all.

I wasn't around DCP in the time of little geoffery, or if i was i was just a lurker without an account. But were people really criticizing the person playing geoffery and not the character geoffery in the show? because that is a very crucial difference that goes from being an a-hole to being critical.

There are two things which grind my gears. One is insulting the talent of a player because they messed up a very exposed part of a show, like a solo. The other is booing the performance after the show. Im as competitive as they come, but DCI is more than just the score. At the very worst i will be neutral at a show and not clap. This happens fron time to time, but thats because of the design not the performers. But people do criticize specific members, on here and social media. Alums that bully current members for having a beard, alums that go on tyraids on facebook posts about specific people in the pictures. People who criticize a singer as being marginal at best and only getting the gig because she is related to the designer. Criticism should be made when timely. I remember a few years ago when the blue stars were in TOC, they had a low brass feature that was a bunch of runs. This is the first show of the season. It sounded awful, but its a very difficult part. The staff shouldn't have put that part out there in that condition, and my criticism was of the staff choosing to do that, not the MMs for flubbing their notes.

This gap between OC and Cascades... What happened? When OC moved up to World Class 2 years ago, there was a 9 point gap between these corps at prelims. (78.45 to 69.85) Last year it was still about the same (81.05 to 72.25) But this year the cascades are just 10 points under their prelims score last season, and we havent even gotten a month into the season. And have been as close as 9 tenths under oregon, even without a full panel. I know the Cascades made some changes and took their lumps the last few years in order to create a sustainable corps, but wow. I didn't think we would be seeing the effects so soon. Also i thought OC would take the momentum theyve had and keep moving up. Hopefully, for them, this isn't a sign of a plateau. Fresh blood is great, its why i want to see Academy and Colts make finals. Anyway, i know its early in the season. But i did not in my wildest dreams think Cascades would be going toe to toe with OC.

Thats fair.

I remember shaw being interviewed in 2012 talking about how the music for that show is stuff he has wanted to do with phantom but has been denied. Its definitely possible, and likely, that phantom has relaxed restrictions but i do believe it was a part of Shaw's leaving.

Rennick was definitely a big loss. Phantom went from 1st in percussion in 2010 (despite a middling score overall) to 7th in 2011. 2012 they placed 3rd overall, but also 7th in percussion. Having a consistently top performing caption was a great thing for Phantom, and has been holding them back since they left.

Rennick and shaw are gone, and are hard to replace. Strengths became weaknesses. Also phantom is restrictive of what music they can perform right? Isn't that why, in part, why shaw left? Anyway, they are better off than i thought they would be. They hired the glassmen brass arranger to replace shaw, which in my opinion wasn't their strongest feature. As far as i know he has not been replaced. I do prefer this arrangement to swan lake last season though. They are moving in a positive direction methinks. They will likely finish top 8 again.

The Cadets thread was just 15 pages away from being double the next most popular corps thread (crown) but after an explosion in that thread (not surprisingly about the cadets) this thread is now almost 30 pages away from double thar one.

Hm, why? The panel? SCV has been consistently over a point behind BD. Cadets were less than a point behind BD. Bluecoats were rather neck and neck with Cadets. So BD would beat Bloo by about a point, at most. So SCV should be about a half point behind Bloo just based on spreads between shows.

If SCV beat Bloo, we will have an interesting battle on our hands.

While i dont doubt this is how it was, there also hasn't been a dci show on the 4th since 2007. And it doesn't seem like an accident that the day hasnt been used for competitions.

Why is there a show on july 4th? Didn't recently DCI say that corps should not compete on july 4th and just do parades and celebrate the day and stuff? Anyway. Another crown vs cadets show, always a good time. My prediction? One corps is going to win, and crown will be #### close.

Did channel3 really use the bluecoats as an example of poor design when they placed second and reached their highest placement in corps history? Sometimes a show doesn't need depth to have success. Did 1930 have "depth" to the concept? Remember, this show broke 99 and was, at the time, the highest BD score ever (or at least at finals). I wonder if the MMs complained enough about the chairs that the designers would have gotten rid of the chair feature, and we would have missed out on the opportunity to have "BD break 99 while sitting down" I agree that sone things in dci make me roll my eyes, or i find it silly. But its the responsibility of the members to buy into the corps and the concept. Scores arent everything.

We are not in the cadet thread, we are in a thread that is about the cadets and innovation.

I was just playing devil's advocate. If you are used to winning, when you don't for a while you begin to wonder what is wrong? Especially if many of the same people are still around. Personally i am of the philosophy that its more impressive to be at the top consistently rather than a title now and then but most seasons of not really competing. I live by this in more ways than just DCI too. But to approach your question directly.. SCV is moving up after a stretch of not being competitive at the top, largely by improving the staff. Crown 14 years ago was competing just to make finals, now they havent finished below 5th since 2007. Bluecoats 14 gears ago began their consistent reign in the top 8 and have now achieved their highest point in their history. Phantom have had to deal with losing two tremendous arrangers in Shaw and Rennick, but overall haven't been that consistent anyway, their placement varies a great deal. Cavaliers have won more championships than the cadets have in the last 14 seasons.

Just because there was a stage doesn't mean that they staged well. Staging is how the designers utilize the entire field as a stage, how the members interact with one another, and how they interact with props.

But think of it this way. In the last 14 seasons the Cadets have won 2 championships. Their longest championship draught was between their 2005 and 2011 championships, and if this show doesnt win this year then it will match their second longest draught between 2000 and 2005 championships. So i can understand alums and fans discussing how to change things to bring back the 80s and 90s success. Even though the cadets are competitive in most seasons.