euponitone Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 The nerve! Oh, those selfish fans, buying tickets and $upporting the DCI tour. How dare they! And then, those arrogant volunteers, feeding the kids, driving the corps vehicles, fixing uniforms and equipment. And those self-centered donors who give to corps during fundraising drives, and sponsor members by paying their tour fees....the world would be a better place without them. Oh, wait.... And the nerve to think that all those people hold the same view as you is even more astounding,,, Lol, there is no way to determine whether all those people you just mentioned are for or against electronics - so you basically just presented a non-argument Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Bari Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 Spirit of selfishness/arrogance? That's the people who want DCI to stand still and stay what is was because THEY want it that way...or even take away some of the new options. THOSE are the selfish ones, not the corps designers and admins who want to keep DCI moving forward into the 21st centiry. Selfishness? Yes: "We want the new toys because we want them! You others don't matter!" Arrogance? Yes: "Who are you to say that we shouldn't have them? WE decide what DCI is!" Orwellian NewSpeak is alive and well: "Forward" means the direction MikeD wants to go. (presumably, "backward" is any other direction.) "Arrogant" means people expressing a different opinion. "Selfishness" means liking something that pleases and wanting more of it. Interesting Freudian slip: "who want DCI to stand still and stay what [it] WAS" (emphasis added). Well, the more conservative ones were warning of changing DCI to something new. When the actual debate was taking place, the change hadn't occurred yet. The correct statement should say "stay what it IS". This attitude is compounded in the next clause: "or even take away some of the new options." There would be nothing to take away or revert back to, if DCI hadn't made the change in the first place. Therefore, you're justifying the change by saying that one can't take away the change after it's been instituted, ie the existence of the change is the reason for not repealing the change. If, by some miracle, the DCI BoD had another vote, and said they changed their minds on electronics, since the corps have never used them yet, is THAT taking away a new option? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 And the nerve to think that all those people hold the same view as you is even more astounding,,, I never said that was my viewpoint. Lol, there is no way to determine whether all those people you just mentioned are for or against electronics - so you basically just presented a non-argument I never said "all", either. I do know there are some people in each of those categories that hold those views, though. And I wouldn't be as quick to demonize them as MikeD is, given the extent to which DCI relies on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euponitone Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 I never said "all", either. I do know there are some people in each of those categories that hold those views, though. And I wouldn't be as quick to demonize them as MikeD is, given the extent to which DCI relies on them. Well it seemed like you were making the old 'entitlement' argument and generalizing with it. maybe not...i dont feel like debating it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triple Forte Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 A 'few' as compared to the totality of the DCI audience. No, I have not mis-stated anything. As compared to any measure of the total DCI audience, DCP complainers are not even a drop in the bucket. And of coarse you have some hard numbers to back that up........right? I don't have the exact numbers.....but I know for a fact that it is much more that a "Few" I guess we'll have to wait and see if DCI show attendance is impacted, and if it can be determined that recent changes played a role, if that is even possible to determine. Of coarse you know I feel that more changes to transform DCI corps in to marching bands WILL have a negative impact on attendance. And if I am right, you know the designers and admins won't admit that it was because of any of choices/changes to the activity they have made or pushed. Spirit of selfishness/arrogance? That's the people who want DCI to stand still and stay what is was because THEY want it that way...or even take away some of the new options. THOSE are the selfish ones, not the corps designers and admins who want to keep DCI moving forward into the 21st centiry. This is the crux of the argument. This is where the big divide in thought is between the folks who want every change and those of us who support "Some" change. Folks like me get painted as someone who doesn't support ANY change and that is simply not true. I am glad there have been changes to DCI through the years. I (And many others) don't support any further changes to the instrumentation......PERIOD. I also don't see how some of the recent rule changes (Bb, amps, narrration, electronics...) are moving the DCI activity forward. These items have been used in the marching music arena for DECADES. Nothing new.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tank Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 I got a new sig! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 I guess we'll have to wait and see if DCI show attendance is impacted, Already has been. and if it can be determined that recent changes played a role, if that is even possible to determine. It can be determined....or ignored, depending on the mindset of who you ask. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 And of coarse you have some hard numbers to back that up........right? I don't have the exact numbers.....but I know for a fact that it is much more that a "Few" Well, with attendance in the hundreds of thousands, DCP is a 'few'. Just MHO of course. Of coarse you know I feel that more changes to transform DCI corps in to marching bands WILL have a negative impact on attendance. And if I am right, you know the designers and admins won't admit that it was because of any of choices/changes to the activity they have made or pushed. And I don't think it will a negative impact at all. If attendance remains strong with the changes, what then? This is the crux of the argument. This is where the big divide in thought is between the folks who want every change and those of us who support "Some" change. Folks like me get painted as someone who doesn't support ANY change and that is simply not true. I am glad there have been changes to DCI through the years. I (And many others) don't support any further changes to the instrumentation......PERIOD. I also don't see how some of the recent rule changes (Bb, amps, narrration, electronics...) are moving the DCI activity forward. These items have been used in the marching music arena for DECADES. Nothing new.......... You (and a few others) may not want any more instrumentation changes. That has been an attitude of some as far back as you want to go. IMO the recent changes have helped a lot...multi-key, amps, micced voice. Next year electronics will be added, far later than they should have been, IMO. Just about every change made to corps instrumentation has been to move the equipment along the route of band instruments, so IMO that's not an issue at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tank Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 And I don't think it will a negative impact at all. If attendance remains strong with the changes, what then? Then we (the pro-acoustic side) lose. In reality, this whole transformation is one big gamble: Can the butts of the "kids" they put in the seats physically and financially make up for (AND SURPASS) the contributions of the "geezers" (this geezer being all of 26). The funny thing is, if we're right, we still lose, 'cause if it does cause DCI's downfall, then it'll probably be too late to do anything about it by the time anyone important realizes it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkbrass Posted March 1, 2008 Share Posted March 1, 2008 Drum corps is dead.....it died when dues for membership rose to over $2000 a season. It, by definition, died for horns when 3 valved horns were legalized in 1987. Since then drum corps have played instruments that could play a full chromatic scale, thus removing the "bugle" from drum and bugle corps. Yes, modern drum corps is marching band, and that open minded-ness is what will someday allow woodwinds on the field. I attended DCI semifinals this year, and I was outraged by the narration and the weak, pitiful sounds Bb hornlines produced. Im young, my first year in drum corps was the year Bb horns were legalized. But I beleive in 2 valvers and piston rotors, and all this whining to DCI wont fix anything. People who really CARE about drum corps should search out those old bugles, wipe the dust off of them, oil them up and play them again. There are THOUSANDS of old 2 valved and piston rotor bugles that have been abaondoned out there. The one and only way GEORGE HOPKINS will even notice how the traditionalists feel is if they show it to him by shearing chrome at him. Get your bugles out, get some groups together and organize something. If you have the time, why not organize a hornline to play parades or gigs? in other words...DO SOMETHING that will restore the activity, not point figers about how it all went wrong as the drum corps activity fades away....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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