What are the chances of HD DVD's of DCA?

[ContraRich77]

"What are the chances of HD DVD's of DCA?"

About as likely as BVP giving ANY kind of a crap about the quality of their product........as even the selection menus look like they were designed by a mentally challenged blind three year old.

[Jeff DeMello]

About as likely as BVP giving ANY kind of a crap about the quality of their product........as even the selection menus look like they were designed by a mentally challenged blind three year old.

Rich,

I know you're a quiet guy ... tell us what you really think!

[JohnZ]

Well, I can offer this much . . .

The prior DCA video contract I was aware of was a multi-year agreement. If the current contract is the same, it simply must be honored through its conclusion.

The BVP owner is a decent fellow who IS doing his best within the budget, as he sees it......

I've written a reply to your post several times now, Fred, and every time it always comes out condescending - apologies if this still sends the wrong message.

But - business is business. In all my years of contract negotiations I have never signed a contract for any service that did not have performance expectations clearly spelled out, and certainly never EVER signed one without a mutually protective separation/cancellation clause.

the DCA board and members are smart folks, and I am sure they have individual or collective contract experience that exceeds my own which is why I find it very hard to believe they would not have included those common and substantive protective provisions in a member/patron beneficial service contract. If they are there, the contract does not have to be "simply honored to conclusion". if they aren't and there is a 'contract', or (Heaven forbid) we are talking about a gentlemen's agreement, shame on us/them.

And I am sure the BVP owner is a decent fellow, great guy, church going family man, etc......but we are talking about a product here, and by the sounds of things, a product that is not satisfying to a number (avoiding but could be inferring 'majority', 'most', 'all') of the buying public. Business is business.

[Fred Windish]

Hello, John!

Well, what I saw WAS a written agreement, but not a lengthy, detailed document. It pretty much said "BVP will do this, in exchange for DCA receiving that." I don't recall seeing any description of what constitutes a "quality" product, acceptable to all (if there ever is such a thing).

Always remember, the effort does NOT bring in a million dollars, not even a few hundred thousand dollars. The market for the product is still too small to justify serious expenses for equipment and talent. Both parties DO come out on the plus side, however. Also understand, I have not worked for DCA since 2006, so I could be describing what is long past.

My only problem is with the apparent post-production result. Geez, we even had someone on here who claims all editing is done on site, in B roll form. I surely hope that's not the case, because with today's technology, even inexpensive software suites provide many more bells and whistles to easily utilize.

I DO believe contracts MUST be respected. If any contract does not lead to the result either party desired, that can only be addressed on the NEXT contract.

Your message is much appreciated, John.

[Scerpella]

Ok, I asked the thread question originally on May 13th and now with the benefit of the events of the 2009 DCA season behind us, I want to re-pose my question. First of all my understanding is that DCI's product is now HD. Secondly it appears from their website anyway that BVP is a healthy company producing videos for a large number of organizations. About 500 events according to their own site. It strikes me almost impossible that DCA would be the first organization to request their even be done in HD. Interestingly enough, there is a quote on their homepage stating, "The video clarity is one of, if not the best ever of a DCA event!" http://www.bandvideos.com/# A funny coincidence! But surely they are not trying to fool people into accepting that their current format is equal to HD? There are a number of tabs which I tried to use to find out if they offer HD for anyone else but when I tried them they weren't working.

I rejoined my old corps the Kilties in mid July to fill a spot that had become empty. Our marketing people arranged to have a semi uniformed runthrough (Kilts and spats and black shirts) filmed in HD. I can say unequivocally that that recording is superior to any DCI or DCA video I have ever owned or viewed, even though it was simply a hi cam vantage point done mainly as an instructional tool. I was able to obtain a copy which I played on a PS3 on my 42" HD TV and the sharpness and clarity was as we have come to expect from HD, in a word as close to perfect as the technology allows. I have also seen the video of our prelims performance provided the corps at DCA right after prelims and the difference is not even close.

So I ask my question again, maybe this time someone from DCA can weigh in, will the DCA nationals next year or anytime soon be done in HD? Is this something that has been discussed with BVP or another vendor? At what point will it be decided to dispense with dated technology?

[Shadow_7]

So I got my HD camcorder in May. I've used it on two shows this summer. I've gotten a post flow setup and running. It's not rocket science, but it is time consuming. More than double the time to edit HD than SD. Since BVP does many events I can see where they don't have the time to bundle the package nicely. From my individual perspective, I pretty much have to stick to high cam shots because there's just too much going on, and I'm not familiar enough with a corps show to know what to focus on. Having the corps troop the stands afterwards, would afford an opportunity to zoom in and get a closeup of everyones faces, but we apparently don't do that anymore. So all that I can do is zoom in on the performers backside as they exit the stadium. Or zoom in on their backside while they do their warmups. Unless they're doing a standstill. With just one camcorder, I kind of have to stay high cam. Which isn't always the best shot. Oh look that trumpet just got pegged by that tuba. Oh look that baritone got tripped by that guards foot. Stuff which I might not even notice until the 20th viewing.

As far as bluray players. Playstation 3 for $299 does that job for a lot of folks. Although a decent computer with bluray reader can too. I saw some bluray readers for about $100 at Frys half a year ago. Bluray burners on the other hand... And I'm still not convinced that bluray the medium is here to stay. Can anyone say laserdisc? Betamax? 8 track? wax cylinder? There's a few better, but more costly per unit options. On the plus side 1TB HDDs are about $100 these days.

As far as the format. I still haven't figured out HD DVD, but like many I don't have an HD DVD player yet. But I do have an HDTV, and the camcorder plugs into it nicely. And it can double as a computer monitor (720p or 1776x1000 at best). HD is doable, but it takes more time and more storage than standard definition. As far as the technology, it's really not quite there yet. Most affordable camcorders only resolve slighly more than 720 lines aka 720p. Sensor limitations, even though they record to a 1080p format, of 1080 lines of resolution. We're probably looking at another 2 years until sub $10K cameras resolve 1080 lines or more. HD is a bit more sensitive to other things too. You can get away with things in SD, that you can't in HD. Stabilization is key. Any sort of zooming and the tap of single finger on the tripod translates into the image that gets recorded. So you really need the best in accessories to get minimal acceptable results. $40 tripods and $10 minipods don't cut it.

Even though we have the technology now, it is probably another two years until it's more mainstream. Although if DCA would find a venue outfitted with HD capabilites and use that to their advantage it is doable now. Even with an HDTV, about the only truly HD content that I get is News and Sports, and some things on PBS. Plus some late night talk shows. Most everything else is still standard definition on my HDTV. Or some grainy upscaled version of SD. It is nice, but I don't think that we're quite there yet. But unlike a lot of things it is getting better everyday. This time next year.....

[skek64]

My problem with the current vendor is:

They previewed the videos at Rochester on 9x15 TV's, stretching the picture to fill the screen.

This gives the impression, to the unwary, that these videos are in wide screen.

When called on this, they hemed n hawed, but finally admitted their ruse.

I ordered the full audio package for 2007.

Of all the corps, only 4 would play.

I complained and was sent a new set.

The same thing happened, only different corps would play.

I gave up. They told me they checked the cd's before they sent them.

They lied!

I tried them on 3 different CD players and 2 different DVD players.

SAME PROBLEM!

I'll never buy anything from them again!

[Diceman]

My problem with the current vendor is:

They previewed the videos at Rochester on 9x15 TV's, stretching the picture to fill the screen.

This gives the impression, to the unwary, that these videos are in wide screen.

When called on this, they hemed n hawed, but finally admitted their ruse.

I ordered the full audio package for 2007.

Of all the corps, only 4 would play.

I complained and was sent a new set.

The same thing happened, only different corps would play.

I gave up. They told me they checked the cd's before they sent them.

They lied!

I tried them on 3 different CD players and 2 different DVD players.

SAME PROBLEM!

I'll never buy anything from them again!

I've been buying them since the VHS/Don Moran days and never had a problem...

(Shrug)

But I highly doubt there will be HD versions of DCA videos in the near future. It's just not worth the $$ to produce them, unless they start charging what DCI does.

I'd rather have the affordability - although I would prefer a little more time was spent on editing!

[bill]

I've personally never had a problem or issue at anytime.

Typically I purchase the entire prelim show event.

The only thing I do question are the actual end zone shots from time to time in every corps' performance; no corps whatsoever comes off quite as flattering in those shots no matter who the corps may be.

[Shadow_7]

My prelims disc from 2006 doesn't play Frontier. They did send a replacement that did play Frontier for a while, but now doesn't play anything. I tried to get BVP to send a replacement for that and they never responded to my emails. I really don't know if the finals DVD plays, I can never finish watching them knowing how good they look compared to the prelims discs. The 2005 DVD was much better IMO. Although I wonder if it still plays now too. No need to get any of the other years, not my memories to preserve.