supersop Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 Totally disagree and this is the problem with the judging today. It's not about clean per se, but about the "what" versus the "how". Why do I love that Scouts 88 won? Because they were nowhere near as clean as BD or SCV, but man, they brought it at finals. ( hope that doesn't offend you Scout guys, but it's the truth). In the judges eyes, the balance of "what" they brought outweighed the little bit of "how" it was achieved from an execution standpoint. I'm guessing you want us to go back to a 55 pt GE system? I will say this, A little dirt with superior writing and performed with a ton a FIRE = WIN It rarely wins a title, but to me it's more enjoyable and awe inspiring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trumpetcam Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 Ya. I see what your saying. Idk, I guess I just see it as, if you put hard stuff in your show, and on finals day, its clean, then you get lots of points. You know? I do see what your saying though. I just feel that the judging can be unbalanced some times, but none of us can control that. You got it. To be fair to the judges, when you get to the top 5 and all the shows are rally good with difficulty in different areas, it gets really tough to separate. They do their best and are human and we will always disagree, so it's a lose for them regardless. You have good points, it's just such a fine line at the top and once they have seen the shows 5 or 6 times each, they have a pretty good idea of the difficulty and we just have to put faith in that they will do their best to be fair and call it like they see it. All the members of every corps bust their butt on their show, so we just hope its fair at the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 Totally disagree and this is the problem with the judging today. It's not about clean per se, but about the "what" versus the "how". Why do I love that Scouts 88 won? Because they were nowhere near as clean as BD or SCV, but man, they brought it at finals. ( hope that doesn't offend you Scout guys, but it's the truth). In the judges eyes, the balance of "what" they brought outweighed the little bit of "how" it was achieved from an execution standpoint.I am close friends with many of the top 12 Brass Caption Heads and one thing they all complain about is that every year the brass trophy often comes down to who is playing the cleanest finals week. It should not alway be this way, unless all corps have the exact same show. How and What is one of the hardest things to gauge as a judge and its truly the most subjective part of judging the marching arts. Just my thoughts. While I marginally agree with what you're saying, I've talked to several DCI judges and they've generally said that when it comes to crowning a champion in any caption, it is not only who's the cleanest, but who has the "best" book (obviously subjective). For example, if Blue Devils and Cavaliers brass are both on the same level of execution, the "best" brass book (more difficult/effective) will win. However, clean almost always wins. If a staff can't clean the book they have through out the summer, and don't water it for Finals hoping that it'll be clean, I don't have much sympathy for the members or staff of that corps. This is an activity based not only on innovation, but also execution; if you put out a product that can't quite be cleaned enough to win, than design a product that is just as effective but more attainable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluublood Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 This is going to be a fun thread. l\ l l l l DID I NOT CALL THAT OR WHAT!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven69 Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 I hate Crown. Sucks to be you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaddyt Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 Sucks to be you. Would expect nothing less from someone whose favorite drum corps SEASON is 2009 Carolina Crown. Here I was thinking other corps were competing as well this summer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trumpetcam Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 I'm guessing you want us to go back to a 55 pt GE system?I will say this, A little dirt with superior writing and performed with a ton a FIRE = WIN It rarely wins a title, but to me it's more enjoyable and awe inspiring. Not really, just using that show as an example of when a show wasn't as clean, but won out in the eyes of the judging community. When you get to finals, I think anyone in the top 3 or 4 should have a real chance to win and it should come down to who brings it at finals and how the judges react to the how and what after that show. Hey, if the 55 pt GE system means taking out the fact we have 4 colorguard captions now, I am all for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluublood Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 I'm running out of troll food. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MariaCrown2010 Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 You got it. To be fair to the judges, when you get to the top 5 and all the shows are rally good with difficulty in different areas, it gets really tough to separate. They do their best and are human and we will always disagree, so it's a lose for them regardless.You have good points, it's just such a fine line at the top and once they have seen the shows 5 or 6 times each, they have a pretty good idea of the difficulty and we just have to put faith in that they will do their best to be fair and call it like they see it. All the members of every corps bust their butt on their show, so we just hope its fair at the end. Ya exactly. Just like my band director says "They are just people saying their oppinon". I guess at times we are harsh on the judges, I just wish like the points part would have more weight in the execution part. Good points though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acolli17 Posted July 16, 2009 Share Posted July 16, 2009 l\l l l l DID I NOT CALL THAT OR WHAT!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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