AlexL Posted September 20, 2009 Share Posted September 20, 2009 21 isn't arbitrary at all when you consider that it was the nearly universally understood age of majority at the time the junior corps concept was established. Even today, it's a reasonable demarcation of when a person makes major transitions from thinking and living as a child to thinking and living with the responsibilities of an adult. (It's arguable, I know... but still reasonable.) Its a valid point, as 21 seems to be this 'full adulthood' age where you can do things like gambling, drinking, etc (though thats a topic for another day... id like to see all those things at 18). These kinds of things change over time though. Even past 21, there are some things where you arent treated as an adult until you are 25 (car insurance rates, car rental, you can stay on your parents health insurance until 25 in many states, etc)... and its been a general trend that the age where the age of that transition to adulthood has risen higher and higher over time. As was mentioned above, the age limit has been at its present level for a long time.. and it could be time to adapt that more to the present. If one thinks that junior corps has a mission of education and building character, then there has to be a time when junior corps has done most of what it can for a member, and like it or not, a time to move on. In this case, it wouldn't be a matter of what the member wanted, but a matter of what the institution felt was appropriate as it relates to its own objectives. That could make just as good a case for removing the age limit entirely though as well. Just as right now, there is no official minimum age for DCI, many corps do have their own set minimums. Corps could decide individually if it fit their organization's mission to allow 22 or 23 or 24 year olds, or to keep at the present level. So, IMO, 21 is a pretty good cutoff for keeping focus on the education mission... raising it would force emphasis away from that mission because older members would have much less need of it. As someone in the thread mentioned though, while some corps have younger members, some corps have average ages well over 18, and we see threads on here every summer that decry how the top corps have moved away from that focus on education since the top ones bring in talent that is already at such a high level. And the counter for that is the same- there is always something to be learned. While corps like Cavaliers and BD and Crown are bringing in top level talent that already likely has a pretty good level of education already, you really couldnt say that they arent educating their members either. It just means they start a bit farther up the ladder, a ladder which, while im sure it has a top somewhere, hasnt been reached. That being said, if I were King of DCI, I would make a special exception for you, Alex. haha, even if it were so, id be done anyways. 07 wouldve been the last year i couldve marched (i was 22 then) even if there was no age limit. I only mention myself as an example, i know there are a lot of ageouts sitting at home for a summer or two afterwards that could easily be on tour. Some valid points (so rare on dcp sometimes), agree to disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidp Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 The choices are what they are.If you can get on the bus and have the talent and the dough, you march World. If you need a local corps so you can have a summer job but can still march a limited tour, you have Open Class. If you can get on the bus but need to develop your talent, you have the upper tier of Open Class. If you need a local corps because you have a real job or a family (or both), or you need to develop your talent, or you don't have the dough, or you have a little gas in the tank and are over 22, and still want to march, you have all-age. If you need a local corps, have gas in the tank but want to entertain first, you have the alumni corps (Bridgemen, Cabs, St Joe's to name a few). If you have a local corps that is small but mighty and you need an outlet for your talents and effort, you have mini-corps (Star, Mass Brass, Golden Eagles, Ghost Riders to name a few). Choices. Lots of 'em. All good. And boundaries. And that's ok. 22 World Class, 19 Open Class, 24 All-Age, 9 Alumni, 13 Mini-Corps 87 situations to choose from....coast to coast. If it ain't broke... Hopefully, there will be at least 14 mini corps in the near future. I usually post on the all-Age forum, but this caught my eye. I'm attempting to start a mini corps for the west Atlanta/north Georgia area. Right now, I'm an army of one. Anybody interested can PM me here. Thanks! Sorry to be a thread-jacker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRacer Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 I'm all for it, as long as the 23 & 24 year-olds play woodwinds or electric bass in the pit-- DCBOAI rocks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwillis35 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 (edited) Why does college have to drive this thread at all?Another way would be to market to ALL PEOPLE IN THE 0-22 AGE GROUP, NOT JUST COLLEGE [MUSIC MAJORS.] Any 22 or younger person with a phone, i-pod and shoes can afford to march drum corps. The "talent" aspect is way over-hyped by the elitists amongst us. We should be able to teach ANYONE with an ounce of desire how to spin/drum/blow at all levels of DCI (function of: level of desire+quality of instruction+time) We need to market "how easy" drum corps can be. Instead, we dwell on its difficulty (hooking people up to medical devices to show it takes more work than a marathon), or its talent (soloist this, soloist that; champion this or that), or its expense. Ding, Ding, Ding (and sing)!! We have a winner! I completely agree. Getting more youth involved in an activity that is supposed to benefit our youth means marketing to our "youth." The fascination with college age students is way overblown, and the notion that raising the age limit to 23 or 24, or beyond, does nothing to enhance the activity's youthful image and purpose. We need to be who we say we are. We are NOT a semi-professional music troop for mid-20-somethings to prolong their lives. How you live is your business, yes, but any activity that claims to honor and serve youth would have a hard time explaining their efforts if they were catering to 23, 24, and 25 year-old members. Life must move on! DCA is a fantastic way to take part while allowing for real-life issues like jobs and family. Those of us who are fans of DCI, as I am (and all of drum corps), know that we love the flash and demand and hard work of this activity. But in some ways this definitely scares people. The "Red Badge of Courage" that we like to hold high and brag about (demand, speed, musical skill, hard work, long days, etc.) can easily scare folks away, and these might be people who can benefit. In large part this is because the focus is centered on the top 6, 7 or 8 corps. 12, 13, and 14 year olds can march, but they need to know where to go, and we can certainly get more 15 to 21 year-olds on the field. I don't think we have exhausted those possibilities. But raising the age limit is really not a great idea. Not because we should compare it to college, but because we need to compare it to life, our responsibility as adults, and to the youth we claim we are serving. Edited September 21, 2009 by jwillis35 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob J Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 The choices are what they are.If you can get on the bus and have the talent and the dough, you march World. If you need a local corps so you can have a summer job but can still march a limited tour, you have Open Class. If you can get on the bus but need to develop your talent, you have the upper tier of Open Class. If you need a local corps because you have a real job or a family (or both), or you need to develop your talent, or you don't have the dough, or you have a little gas in the tank and are over 22, and still want to march, you have all-age. If you need a local corps, have gas in the tank but want to entertain first, you have the alumni corps (Bridgemen, Cabs, St Joe's to name a few). If you have a local corps that is small but mighty and you need an outlet for your talents and effort, you have mini-corps (Star, Mass Brass, Golden Eagles, Ghost Riders to name a few). Choices. Lots of 'em. All good. And boundaries. And that's ok. 22 World Class, 19 Open Class, 24 All-Age, 9 Alumni, 13 Mini-Corps 87 situations to choose from....coast to coast. If it ain't broke... What if you can get on the bus and have the talent and the dough, but are over 22? you cannot march World. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euphononium Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 What if you can get on the bus and have the talent and the dough, but are over 22? you cannot march World. Top tier DCA corps are located in NY, PA, NJ, Minnesota, California, etc... DCA isn't just for old farts anymore. DCA is improving almost by the second, with some great corps top to bottom. If you've got the dough, make a donation or sponsor somebody who can march in World OR Open OR DCA. There's plenty of options for EVERYONE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexL Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Top tier DCA corps are located in NY, PA, NJ, Minnesota, California, etc... DCA isn't just for old farts anymore. DCA is improving almost by the second, with some great corps top to bottom.If you've got the dough, make a donation or sponsor somebody who can march in World OR Open OR DCA. There's plenty of options for EVERYONE. yeah, its the BEST option (and one i may take advantage of someday), but you KNOW thats not what hes talking about. Until theres a full-time touring DCA corps there is a hole there for people who want THAT option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruckner8 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 yeah, its the BEST option (and one i may take advantage of someday), but you KNOW thats not what hes talking about. Until theres a full-time touring DCA corps there is a hole there for people who want THAT option. And that's what it will take. Just one DCA corps willing to give it a go. And when that corps wipes the floor with every other DCA corps...another will follow. And then DCI kids will say "Wait a minute...screw this education stuff, I want to be in the best corps ever!" and they'll start choosing full-time all-age over full-time age limits. And then DCI will become "a little less excellent." And DCI would slowly become less relevant from a "Major League" standpoint. It would take about 10-15 years...a DCI generation. It would change the marching activity forever, and we'd have a new "Marching Music's Major League." But DCI can pretend for now.... (C'mon lottery, curse you!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob J Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 and its all about making the product better. or is it about the kids? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruckner8 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 and its all about making the product better.or is it about the kids? Why is this a mutually exclusive question? Also, define "kids." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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