Lance Posted July 16, 2010 Share Posted July 16, 2010 All of this is getting way beyond the scope of drum corps discussion. Sorry. Regarding DCI shows: 1) You either like it or you don't depending on your taste. 2) The only people to blame for trends (whether you happen to like them or not) getting rewarded in design is with the corps themselves, who collectively create the rubrics they're judged on and collective choose how they want judging to occur. 3) If enough people really hate what they see and aren't outweighed by people who do, then things might change. If you hate it, and still show up, you're funding that which you hate. You have nobody to blame but yourself. 4) Opinions about what is "good" or "not good" about a bunch of people marching around on a field tooting on things, spinning things, or banging on things (or pressing a button now, I guess) are 100% subjective, and none are any more right or wrong than any other. Sorry if that bothers people. Just my opinion.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ducttapedgerbil Posted July 16, 2010 Share Posted July 16, 2010 Yes, all opinions are equally valid and important by definition. That's basic logic. Your examples of whether or not to have 18 valedictorians or trophies for all little league teams are actually perfect for that. Opinions on either side of those cannot be "correct" or "incorrect", "right" or "wrong." You can have your opinion about it though, and yours will be equally as important or valid as those who disagree with you. In short, there's a difference between fact and opinion. One can be proven right or wrong, and the other cannot. You can objectively and empirically refute somebody saying that there are more corps today than there were 20 years ago. You cannot do the same with somebody who says that drum corps today is "better" or "worse" than it was 20 years ago, or that judging was "more accurate" or "less accurate" 20 years ago than it is today. Also, DCI has never had objective judging whether we're talking "ticks" or judging off of rubrics. What is or is not a tick is subjective. And no rubric eliminates subjectivity, no matter how sophisticated its creator purports it to be. DCI member corps choose the rules that all corps are judged by, and from time to time get together and change the rubrics in attempts to more accurately reward what they collectively think is most important. I think you just validated my point. I cheated and took a look at your profile and based on your age your formative years were right when all the psycho-babble in education was gaining steam. Those of us that are just a bit older were exposed to both trains of thought and have seen where the train of thought you are supporting has taken us so we have a unique perspective. I welcome you to spend some time with someone a bit older with an analytical mind and have some discussion, not about drum corps....about other things which you may have in common. I really think it would be a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance Posted July 16, 2010 Share Posted July 16, 2010 I think you just validated my point. I cheated and took a look at your profile and based on your age your formative years were right when all the psycho-babble in education was gaining steam. Those of us that are just a bit older were exposed to both trains of thought and have seen where the train of thought you are supporting has taken us so we have a unique perspective. I welcome you to spend some time with someone a bit older with an analytical mind and have some discussion, not about drum corps....about other things which you may have in common. I really think it would be a good thing. I'm sorry you had to resort to this. I know I can be overbearing, so I apologize. added: I do think that having 18 valedictorians and giving trophies to everybody who participates in a competition is silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlvalet Posted July 16, 2010 Share Posted July 16, 2010 I'd also argue that unedited "first thoughts" are where the really good stuff comes from as often as the deliberately constructed art....as somebody familiar with various media (which you seem to be), I would think you'd agree....not sure though. lol. Yes, it's possible to hit a hole-in-one on the first try. The planets align. There's a cosmic shift in consciousness. And then BAM! Brilliance hits. It's happened to me. However, more often though, it comes from focusing on something until you have a better solution. Here's the best quote I could come up with on 2 minutes notice: "It's not that I'm so smart, it's just that I stay with problems longer." -Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlvalet Posted July 16, 2010 Share Posted July 16, 2010 4) Opinions about what is "good" or "not good" about a bunch of people marching around on a field tooting on things, spinning things, or banging on things (or pressing a button now, I guess) are 100% subjective, and none are any more right or wrong than any other. Sorry if that bothers people. Just my opinion.... I still think #4 ignores the whole "talent and craft" point I brought up earlier, but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance Posted July 16, 2010 Share Posted July 16, 2010 I still think #4 ignores the whole "talent and craft" point I brought up earlier, but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. Give me some examples of fantastic talent and craft and terrible talent and craft in drum corps. I'd be willing to bet you'd have a lot of opinions about your examples, and they wouldn't all be wrong simply for disagreeing with you. That's really my only point here. Thanks for the discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ducttapedgerbil Posted July 17, 2010 Share Posted July 17, 2010 I'm sorry you had to resort to this. I know I can be overbearing, so I apologize. added: I do think that having 18 valedictorians and giving trophies to everybody who participates in a competition is silly. I was trying to be as nice and positive as I could. Nobody likes to hear that something they have grown accustomed to might not be correct....remember how heartbroken you were when you found out there is not Santa Claus or Easter Bunny?....I know I was. But I do think that anyone up to even the age of 40 could benefit from some of the life experiences of someone that was a responsible thinking adult (stoner/alcoholic uncles don't count ;-)) before the touchy-feely late 80's. Remember....they invented the internet and the video game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance Posted July 17, 2010 Share Posted July 17, 2010 I was trying to be as nice and positive as I could. Interesting. I'm sorry that what I said got you to a point where your only retort was ad hominem, which really isn't nice no matter how old you are. At any rate, I'm always astounded by how little I know. It becomes more apparent every day, and by the time I'm your age, my ingnorance will be even more apparent to me...I hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ducttapedgerbil Posted July 17, 2010 Share Posted July 17, 2010 Interesting. I'm sorry that what I said got you to a point where your only retort was ad hominem, which really isn't nice no matter how old you are. At any rate, I'm always astounded by how little I know. It becomes more apparent every day, and by the time I'm your age, my ingnorance will be even more apparent to me...I hope. I simply recognized that you may not have the benefit of the life experiences a lot of us have that could be useful to you. There is this WWII and Korean War Vet that cruises by the Starbucks I go to and I almost always try and stop and sit down and chat with him. He retired I think as a Commander in the Navy (I think that sounds right) just as Viet Nam was starting up and he has lots of stories based on his life experiences of life in the Navy in Europe and Southeast Asia and daily life in general. We talk about motorcycles of the 50's-60's and now, women (then and now), etc.... I really feel honored to have those conversations with him because when he is gone so are the stories and all that knowledge. Sure, I can have an opinion about things that he experienced, but the validity of my opinion pales in comparison to his....and I recognize that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance Posted July 17, 2010 Share Posted July 17, 2010 Yes, it's possible to hit a hole-in-one on the first try. The planets align. There's a cosmic shift in consciousness. And then BAM! Brilliance hits. It's happened to me. However, more often though, it comes from focusing on something until you have a better solution. Here's the best quote I could come up with on 2 minutes notice: "It's not that I'm so smart, it's just that I stay with problems longer." -Einstein Can't argue with any of that. BTW, I've thought about getting some Organikat products....cool logo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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