Liahona Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 Which gets to the point that I have been repeating in this board for over a year now........The junior drum corps activity in this country needs independent, outside administration. It needs it now. DCI - or whatever entity runs junior drum corps - should be headed up by completely independent individuals, with no allegiance to one particular corps. There should be no financial or competitive conflict of interest, period. Right now, there is colossal conflict-of-interest, which is what you always get with a plutocracy or meritocracy. I disagree with this. That model failed already. i.e. VFW et al. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 Thank you for the interview reference. This is the first I've read it and I've re-posted the quote here..."We have 2,000 kids who apply for the Cadets," Hopkins said. "The Blue Devils and the other top corps have a similar number. The kids who get turned down don't join other corps for the most part; they only want to be in the top corps. I think we will end up with 10 or so super performance groups." I'm not too sure if the ones that get turned down don't audition for other corps? Of course he says for the most part which is a little vague in itself. How would he know this information? So I guess at that time he considered the top 10 the elite and now has revised his earlier definition to 7. I do see what you mean though. I've yet to ever see a Cadets PR piece that said 2000 kids try out for them. Now, this was back in the days when YEA was in the fold, but still, they've never released anything with those numbers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 I've yet to ever see a Cadets PR piece that said 2000 kids try out for them. Now, this was back in the days when YEA was in the fold, but still, they've never released anything with those numbers Well, George did not say 'try out'..he said 'apply'..which might just be kids filling out a form at a USSBA show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 It's not a power grab at all, and it's more about survival for the corps thinking about doing it than greed. I'll grant you a "mulligan" for this one. Moving on.... I mean to suggest that it's not about power, it's about survival for the corps doing this. The sky is falling! Seriously, do you really believe that the G7 corps are in such dire straits? Because if so, your next sentence is off the charts with irony.... The member corps choose what goes in DCI, and they're all very big boys and girls who should be able to take care of themselves and their corps; it's insulting to make them sound so feeble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 Not only do the "lower" level corps act as training grounds for these kids, the kids often move to a G7 level corps because of a strong desire to compete for a DCI championship.So - if the G7 are no longer part of DCI, those kids will not be able to go for the ring and they will lose interest. Even more of a reason why the G7 will no longer be getting the same quality and skill level at audition time. Perhaps the G7 would become a training ground for corps remaining in DCI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Other Mike Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 I disagree with this. That model failed already. i.e. VFW et al. This could be a good point for debate. Did it fail or was it killed by a select few ? The numbers were still rising in VFW the petered out in the mid 70's. For corps trying to compete in both it was just too hard with the rule changes so they were forced to chose one over the other. Once DCI had them by the short hairs, DCI kept making it more and more expensive to play. VFW might have been stale but it was keeping cost down compared to DCI's progressive nature. To say VFW failed ? VFW was murdered. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hup234 Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 (edited) I freely admit, that I almost didn't make it through. I thought my eyes were going to bug out of my head, and my cabeza was about to explode, because of the anger and vitriol that I was experiencing. Here are some of the obvious lies, distortions, fabrications, and infuriating statements that I saw:"Corps are not the same." "The premier corps are critical to the organization's success." "Governance needs to be weighted to allow those who drive success to affect decisions." "They can add into a show and they can attend the champs but there is no real service offered." "[We are] in business to return cash to the corps at the highest of possible rates." "WE CANNOT BE ISOLATED. WE NEED TO BE LIKE OUR PEERS AND STOP INSISTING WE ARE DIFFERENT AND BETTER." "[Non-member] corps WOULD NOT be able to participate in any share or fund distribution." "If not approved - [we will] decide next steps" "This is NOT For distribution. This is a working document". Your anger is understood. Sounds like my anger in 1971 when the Midwest Combine started up within the [then] more-winning corps and almost exactly the same elitist principles. The difference is that nobody seemed angry about that then. Instead, the rest of the then-many corps - which the Midwest Combine not-so-secretly called "crap corps" - joined them in the new anti-VFW/anti-AL Drum Corps International, the George Orwellian "All D&BC are equal now" organization. And everybody forgot who/what started DCI and assumed (we know that word well, don't we?) that they meant what they preached. (I'd said all that here in not so many words ten years ago to whomever would listen; it was met with yawns. The few responses were angry; it seems I'd somehow denigrated their heroes, you see.) Edited July 27, 2010 by Hup234 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hup234 Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 This could be a good point for debate. Did it fail or was it killed by a select few? The numbers were still rising in VFW but petered out in the mid 70's. For corps trying to compete in both it was just too hard with the rule changes so they were forced to choose one over the other. Once DCI had them by the short hairs, DCI kept making it more and more expensive to play. VFW might have been stale but it was keeping cost down compared to DCI's progressive nature. To say VFW failed? VFW was murdered. Indeed. As was the American Legion's Uniformed Groups Congress. And after that was when the now-unleashed artistes came into D&BC strong, their ####-the-cost/lights-on-Broadway dreams no longer suppressed by silly, archaic rules moderated by veterans groups who bristled at any tune other than "You're In the Army Now" (or so the effete, pedantic New Wave staffers/leaders had been claiming in order to win their arguments for drastic change in D&BC.) So the '70s and '80s rolled on, and as the corps began to die for lack of nourishment from within and without, the newly-spandexed New Wavers dismissed that as the age-old 'survival-of-the-fittest'. Except that the total numbers of participants was also shrinking. Many corps couldn't keep up with the artistes' sophisticated new de riguer equipment mandates and Nouveau Riche uniforms and marching trends; and they began to disappear in wholesale lots. Fewer corps meant fewer contests and farther distances to travel to the remaining contests, and greater costs, and a resultant strain on a shrinking total membership, the recruitment of which was now directed towards attracting only trained talent .... just like Broadway. Still, all the dazzling show offerings from the top remaining units blinded everyone to the underlying, worsening rot from the bottom up, and the DCI leadership continued on its merry way with hardly a thought to the hundreds of corps with their thousands of members who were gone forever. Occasionally there'd be token nods of regret over DCI's disappearing underclass. But DCI did nothing about changing the root causes of the terminal decay. After all, weren't those finals so spectacular each year? It's nearly over for all but the big boys now. Oh, I believe something will continue on, but just what is anyone's guess. Maybe some VFW or American Legion post or PAL or Boys & Girls Club or church somewhere - unaware or more likely uncaring over all your current mess - will pass out some G bugles and cheap drums to the neighborhood kids so they can march in the local parades playing "You're In The Army Now". And then someone in the next town over will say "Hey, we can do that, too!", and pass out bugles to their neighborhood kids, and ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerguy315 Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 I've yet to ever see a Cadets PR piece that said 2000 kids try out for them. Now, this was back in the days when YEA was in the fold, but still, they've never released anything with those numbers the 2000 is the number that requests information at some point (online, at a marching band competition, etc)... not the number that shows up with their instrument to try to make it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 here I think is where outside help can work for DCI: an entertainment lawyer. can help with rights and negotiating for PR outside of band related magazines. someone on the board who is known for fundraising genius for non profits. two people, not tied to a corps and not looking to change rules, but to help the leaders make wise business decisions....in areas, i'm sure many of these corps directors may not be as wise in as they think 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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