The Return of Ludwig-Musser

[doylejd]

It's funny to me when people talk about the price of Dynasty's being so cheap. When I was purchasing a new battery for my high school band last year, they were the most expensive of the big three. I ended up going with Pearls because of the sound AND price (they were the cheapest).

Dynasty deals direct to drum corps and WGI lines. They are eligible for deals you cannot get through school bids.

[lowend]

Dynasty deals direct to drum corps and WGI lines. They are eligible for deals you cannot get through school bids.

This I realize. I merely find it funny that they are giving away a product to a select few and then overcharging what should be their target market. That sounds like a recipe to remain in 3rd or 4th place in terms of market share.

[perc2100]

Actually, yes it does. :) You can have a full battery drumming at fortissimo and not be too loud for the audience.

Plus it is easier to hide dirt: it's easier for a judge to hear the constant 'grey' of a Dynasty snare line and chalk it up to characteristic tone instead of constant 'not-perfect' drumming. And yes, I was being 100% serious when I made my comment (even if it was posed in a manner that is arguably a negative about Dynasty's sound).

But more importantly, Dynasty gives awesome deals to start-up groups that other companies just choose not to offer. The quality of the product may be questionable to some, but the customer service and price without question the best on the market. If Ludwig wants to break into the market again, they'll have to either use a similar strategy OR get a bunch of big names to switch over to their product right out of the gate.

Obviously mileage may vary, but in my experience Yamaha has been without a doubt THE best customer service in the market. I know my personal current close proximity to Yamaha (MAYBE 120 minutes South) means great attention, but in my experience using Yamaha products, there is NEVER a time I haven't been able to reach a Yamaha rep for help (be it with battery, pit, concert, electronics, or even band/wind departments), or even been able to get face time w/a Yamaha rep who could problem solve on the spot for me. I've not had the same service with Pearl or Dynasty (companies I have used previously): no where close, in fact, to the customer service as Yamaha as given me.

Again, your experience might be vastly different, but for me Yamaha has been well above/beyond their competitors. As for price, that might be a different story, but Yamaha is competitive price wise enough that combined with their outstanding service (and product), I don't mind paying a little extra.

Either way, nobody is going to use their products if they keep their awful field marimba design.

heh; won't get an argument from me on that one

[perc2100]

It's funny to me when people talk about the price of Dynasty's being so cheap. When I was purchasing a new battery for my high school band last year, they were the most expensive of the big three. I ended up going with Pearls because of the sound AND price (they were the cheapest).

Add to that choices in finish from Pearl and Yamaha, and they really beat Dynasty hands-down. If you want any finish other than 'color variation on formica' then you're out of luck for Dynasty: even if you're a World Class Dynasty-endorsed drum line. Yamaha and Pearl now offer a 'standard custom' finish that is a little more than stock but still relatively quick to ship that make any high school line look great/unique. Or, if you have more money to spend, you can get a straight-up custom finish (for Pearl and Yamaha) that will take awhile but look incredible (i.e. take any finish from their top of the line drum sets and for a mark-up they'll finish your battery in that custom finish).

[sarnia sam]

Sorry....I don't see Allan being able to do anything near what you speak of here. Ludwig/Musser line won't depend on Sales and Marketing. It WILL depend on quality craftsmanship, extensive R&D and affordable costs. All of which drum corps and marching bands are receiving from many OTHER vendors.

Let me lend you my glasses. If anyone can put Ludwig back on the field, it's Al. He'll get done what has to be done to make those drums be the ones everyone wants to use. And, he's so connected don't be surprised to see Ludwig become dominant again.

Regards,

John

[BozzlyB]

Let me lend you my glasses. If anyone can put Ludwig back on the field, it's Al. He'll get done what has to be done to make those drums be the ones everyone wants to use. And, he's so connected don't be surprised to see Ludwig become dominant again.

Regards,

John

I guess time will tell. If he's as good as a number of you are saying (very possible don't know the guy) then I would expect to see at least 1 maybe numerous top 12 lines using Ludwig marching percussion in the next 5 years. Expecting them to break into the top of the market in the next one or two years is highly unrealistic IMO regardless of who we're talking about. Remember, for every great marching drum Ludwig promo's there are established and trusted equivalants already on the market offering pretty huge deals to the top lines. Ludwig not only has to break free of making crap marching instruments and offer comparable products, they'll have to offer sweeter deals than are already being offered. If Ludwig isn't prepared to offer custom finishes on an anual basis they can forget marketing to the majority of the top 12.

Edited December 15, 2010 by BozzlyB

[MikeN]

If Ludwig isn't prepared to offer custom finishes on an anual basis they can forget marketing to the majority of the top 12.

Actually, that's not entirely true - there are a number of shops that do aftermarket wrapping and rewrapping for factory-fresh lines. Drum Foundry (www.drumfoundry.com) has done the Cavaliers' drumline before as well as the Colts. (And about a million other sports lines, colleges and high schools.) It's only in about the last 5 years or so that companies have really started pushing their own custom finishes.

Anyways, more perspectives from a lowly drummer.

Mike

[doylejd]

Plus it is easier to hide dirt: it's easier for a judge to hear the constant 'grey' of a Dynasty snare line and chalk it up to characteristic tone instead of constant 'not-perfect' drumming. And yes, I was being 100% serious when I made my comment (even if it was posed in a manner that is arguably a negative about Dynasty's sound).

I was being 100% serious with my response. I've always cited Dynasty's lack of projection as my number 1 reason why I don't like them for corps or band situations, but for indoor, I don't much mind them.

Obviously mileage may vary, but in my experience Yamaha has been without a doubt THE best customer service in the market. I know my personal current close proximity to Yamaha (MAYBE 120 minutes South) means great attention, but in my experience using Yamaha products, there is NEVER a time I haven't been able to reach a Yamaha rep for help (be it with battery, pit, concert, electronics, or even band/wind departments), or even been able to get face time w/a Yamaha rep who could problem solve on the spot for me. I've not had the same service with Pearl or Dynasty (companies I have used previously): no where close, in fact, to the customer service as Yamaha as given me.

Again, your experience might be vastly different, but for me Yamaha has been well above/beyond their competitors. As for price, that might be a different story, but Yamaha is competitive price wise enough that combined with their outstanding service (and product), I don't mind paying a little extra.

I've never had to deal with Yamaha's customer service, so I cannot actually speak for that. But Dynasty's customer service has been amazing in my interactions with them. Every time I've called, I have the answer I have needed within just a few minutes. I love Pearl more than any other brand, and it is a good thing that I don't often need customer support for their products, because I've not had the same success with them.

heh; won't get an argument from me on that one

[BozzlyB]

Actually, that's not entirely true - there are a number of shops that do aftermarket wrapping and rewrapping for factory-fresh lines. Drum Foundry (www.drumfoundry.com) has done the Cavaliers' drumline before as well as the Colts. (And about a million other sports lines, colleges and high schools.) It's only in about the last 5 years or so that companies have really started pushing their own custom finishes.

Anyways, more perspectives from a lowly drummer.

Mike

Interesting, Mike. Has the aftermarket finishing continued to be a player now that companies are offering custom finishes direct from the factory?

Edited December 16, 2010 by BozzlyB

[perc2100]

I guess time will tell. If he's as good as a number of you are saying (very possible don't know the guy) then I would expect to see at least 1 maybe numerous top 12 lines using Ludwig marching percussion in the next 5 years. Expecting them to break into the top of the market in the next one or two years is highly unrealistic IMO regardless of who we're talking about. Remember, for every great marching drum Ludwig promo's there are established and trusted equivalants already on the market offering pretty huge deals to the top lines. Ludwig not only has to break free of making crap marching instruments and offer comparable products, they'll have to offer sweeter deals than are already being offered. If Ludwig isn't prepared to offer custom finishes on an anual basis they can forget marketing to the majority of the top 12.

Add to that Ludwig will need to prove that they can offer superior service to their corps/artists. While money talks and the financial bottom line is often what drives someone to go with a certain company, a good relationship between artist and company rep, as well as the ability to prove that parts will be available at the drop of a hat when emergency repairs are required, are integral. I know plenty of directors/caption heads that would hesitate to switch companies due to the relationship they've built with company reps.

We'll see what happens. As someone else said Ludwig will not grab a substantial chunk of market share overnight: the company has too much to overcome from its past, and will need time to convince corps to invest in their product. But it's plausible five years down the road they could represent adequately. If a company is offering a high quality product, competition will only benefit the activity/corps.

Based on my experience with Ludwig (that was, albeit, decades ago) they have a long journey to legitimacy again, but not an impossible one.