How will you react to the new G8 format?

[audiodb]

This is a point that really SHOULD be clarified, I guess I was under the impression that if the TOC shows continue in 2012 and beyond that each ensuing years G-8 would automatically be the top 8 from the previous year.

I think it was sufficiently clear. The TOC shows include the previous year's top eight. That is the only reason the Blue Stars are involved....they were never part of the G7 nonsense (and there is no such thing as a G8).

[BozzlyB]

I think it was sufficiently clear. The TOC shows include the previous year's top eight. That is the only reason the Blue Stars are involved....they were never part of the G7 nonsense (and there is no such thing as a G8).

That's what I thought. Now back to our previously scheduled program....

[MikeN]

This isn't a perfect analogy, but there's actually a similar situation going on right now in Spanish soccer. Real Madrid and Barcelona, the two biggest clubs by far, just pushed through a TV deal that sees 33% of the money go to them.

Worth a read, just for some of the parallels. There's no resolution to this, so there's no moral one way or the other, but it's interesting to see the same basic ideas playing out in another arena.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/sid_lowe/01/17/la.liga.competitiveness3/index.html

Every club has an equal vote, but equality is a myth. Everybody knows that Madrid and Barcelona are the most powerful -- especially Madrid and Barcelona themselves. No deal can survive, much less prosper, without Madrid and Barcelona. The league would not be the same without them -- and that is a point about which the big two are quick to remind the others clubs. The threat of losing them always hangs in the air.

Madrid and Barcelona know that and use it to their advantage. They can hold the rest to ransom: We generate the money, we should make it. I'd like to see you try to get people excited about a league without us. There is an inescapable reality there. There are other pressures, too, other deals being brokered. A refusal to loan or sell players can be used as leverage, for instance. Madrid's and Barcelona's attitude is that the rest of the league should be grateful to play on the same pitch as them, even if it is not a level playing field: Don't go asking to compete on top of that. If you don't like it, tough. What would your league be without us?

Mike

[audiodb]

Interesting. One difference, though, is that those teams have other leagues (i.e. UEFA Champions League) and tournaments to compete in, and thus continue to prove their status even if Spain's league called their bluff. The G7 drum corps do not.

[chaddyt]

Mr. BozzlyB it is not a DRUM CORPS SHOW it is 8 Drum Corps Shows for a select few who have chosen to select themselves as the elite of Drum and Bugle Corps.

Last I checked, judges were the ones who more or less passed judgement on how corps rank. That the corps in this group of 8 have been able to consistently stay at the level they're at should be something to be proud of. Not something to berate them for.

Being "elite" is not a bad thing. You find it in just about every activity that is competitive. You can argue and debate the points of the proposal and their would-be effects on Open Class and all that. That's fine. But to try and pretend that this activity does not or SHOULD NOT have levels of excellence is foolish, IMO.

[charlie1223]

Last I checked, judges were the ones who more or less passed judgement on how corps rank. That the corps in this group of 8 have been able to consistently stay at the level they're at should be something to be proud of. Not something to berate them for.

Being "elite" is not a bad thing. You find it in just about every activity that is competitive. You can argue and debate the points of the proposal and their would-be effects on Open Class and all that. That's fine. But to try and pretend that this activity does not or SHOULD NOT have levels of excellence is foolish, IMO.

Aaron Sorkin at the Golden Globes said "Elite is not a bad word, it's an aspirational one"

[thirdcoast]

Last I checked, judges were the ones who more or less passed judgement on how corps rank. That the corps in this group of 8 have been able to consistently stay at the level they're at should be something to be proud of. Not something to berate them for.

Being "elite" is not a bad thing. You find it in just about every activity that is competitive. You can argue and debate the points of the proposal and their would-be effects on Open Class and all that. That's fine. But to try and pretend that this activity does not or SHOULD NOT have levels of excellence is foolish, IMO.

I had this long tirade to throw at you- about such things as consistency, already having different levels of excellence(finals, semi-finals, quarter finals), that the judges had no part in the g8 - toc shows, I could go on and on, but... I really dont care about it anymore, from what I here it is not happening the way it was suppose to and its just not that big of a deal anymore. Yep those Drum and Bugle Corps were great, you are right. Enjoy the shows if they happen, hell maybe you will see me there. Bye the way being elite is not a bad thing, going around telling everyone that you are elite... is.

Edited January 19, 2011 by thirdcoast

[thirdcoast]

Nothing like taking something that is struggling and making things worse. Most talk about a divide in Drum Corps that is now happening, they talk about the 1st g7 pp. and how much it is just going to ruin Drum Corps as people have kown it for all these years. Yes I know its not the same now, but that was the 1st impression. Me, I am on the fence. I enjoy the drama, and I sure would have liked to see the g7 go out on there own with nobody else just to see how they would have faired, man I wanted that to happen. Just so that 7 found out how good they had it, but of course we all know what happened. I sometimes think about when I marched, I think about all those finals I marched in and the stands were packed, how at no time did I ever think I was elite to the other Corps. Every year I marched we beat Bluecoats, CC, Blue Stars, most years Cavaliers, some years Phantom, Garfield, SCV and Blue Devils and never once did I think I was elite. Never once did I want to do a show without the other Corps. Never once did I think I was better than another Drum Corps. Maybe, just mabye that is why the stands are not packed at finals anymore. I cant say I will not go to the toc shows, I might want to check out the drama, I might want to see what is going to happen, as I said I enjoy the drama.

As I said, I just dont care about the g8 - toc ..... anymore! The kids in the Corps yes, everything else...no.