Make Finals outdoors, PLEASE!

[Grumpy]

I understand the posts about the need for Finals to be held and completed on Saturday, and all the reasons behind it. Last year, with the extreme heat and this year, the severe storms we were fortunate to be where we were, and the show went on. Although I would have preferred to have Finals outdoors, I was glad we were inside.

HOWEVER, when it was originally reported that we had a long term contract to have our World Championships at LOS, one of the major "selling points" was the fact that the facility has a retractable roof. For our inaugural championships in 2009, we were told that the roof couldn't be opened because of the slight possibility of rain. Last year, we were told the roof was going to be open part of the time, as an experiment...but then it became a safety issue due to the heat (quite understandable). This year, we weren't told ANYTHING...and to reiterate what was stated earlier, Thursday this year was practically picture perfect-no chance of rain, low humidity and comfortable outdoor temps...and still the roof stayed closed. If the curtains are the issue, IMO this should have been taken into consideration when the stadium was designed-after all, a 10 year contract with the facility, with a major selling point being the retractable roof, should have warranted some considertion to us. Barring that, it should absolutely have been addressed following the first year-and how was it going to be handled in 2010 if we HAD been able to open the roof? The only way we are EVER going to know if it helps the acoustics or not is to TRY it-not in June, with one corps doing a rehearsal in there, but during one of our Championships-with different sized corps, different musical selections and real people sitting in their seats. Only then will we truly be able to tell if the sound is better, if the audience is comfortable temperature-wise, or if different corps have an advantage or disadvantage.

Heading into our fourth season in this venue, the issue of whether the roof will/can be opened really should have been settled long ago. I really wish DCI would address this now, try to have an open roof for at least part of next year's event, and put this to bed once and for all.

[WWonka]

I keep hearing people talk about how much they enjoy the AC at finals.. I guess it's nice but have we become that soft?

Till the rain came in Jackson and cooled it of there it was hot.. we lived. The Cotton Bowl was sweltering. KC one of the two years (Don't remember which one) was a baking oven. Everyone lived. 40 years of finals and only 3 have been indoors but some how we survived. Hell it was over 105 at show time at 3 different shows I went to this year.

LOS is a nice stadium. But I hate the sound in there and the way it's stacked. It's the new style to go up instead of back but it makes if feel like little layers of fans who have no connection with the next level. Some times you can hear the roar from above or below but you can't see them unless you go to a spot to look.

Hey it's a nice place. And Indy is decent. And it's a done deal and nothing is going to change, including opening the roof, etc. So deal with it. But don't act like the acoustics don't suck.

[Dave]

Who know what other domes with retractable roofs may be built in the next 7 years as well... maybe one stadium by then will be more advanced and make it more possible to open the roof if need be.

But remember...that's how the whole thing was sold to us in the first place. "It'll be great, we can open the roof or close it if it rains!" Then once DCI is in there..."No, we can't open the roof, it's too hot!"

[Splooie89]

After discussions directly with the DCI staff, there are three major reasons why the roof will just not be opened;

1. Curtains - (as previously mentioned). It's just not that easy to lay down every curtain in the place, especially since they're hung from the top of the building (did you look up?). It's labor and cost intensive and also takes intt account the banners and marketing issues that would have to resolved. The safety rules would probably also prohibit hanging curtains in an environment that would be exposed to a potential wind gust (see Indiana State Fair 8-13-11) and fall on fans or even on the corps. Even barring a gust, which staff do you think would stand for nice flowing curtains during their performance? (see Rose Bowl / hash marks). If you lay down the curtains to open the roof, now you've drastically changed the accoustic environment.

2. Weather potential....(the horse is dead...move on!)

3. LOS is 4 times the air volume that the RCA Dome was. The reason they can open it for football in 60 or 70 degree weather is that it takes only 4 hours or so to heat it 20 degrees. It takes THREE DAYS to cool it that much with the humidity that has to be withdrawn from the air. 65 degree temps with humidity about 50% ain't happening anywhere in August except MAYBE Denver. Minneapolis...great location, lovely stadium, one rain out and one hotter than the maroon side of Cadets show! Just an example.

DISCLAIMER - I live in Indy, love it here, thrilled to see that more people are coming around to it's qualities and having fun. The people at DCI and in Indy have worked VERY hard to address every concern and make this a place our activity looks forward to coming back to. I've been in LOS for games with the roof and side window open and it's AWESOME, but in our case, the cure is worse than the disease and keeping it closed is the right decision.

[Ghost]

I really wish DCI would address this now, try to have an open roof for at least part of next year's event, and put this to bed once and for all.

Maybe they have with their silence for the time being and hoping the subject goes away.

[lastknight]

Honestly, I would prefer to keep it at Lucas Oil. But I would like to see the roof opened as much as possible. I know it will still be echoey because of the overhangs. But I imagine it would be better acoustically. And for me, its just aesthetically pleasing to be able to look up at the night sky during a drum corps competition. Simply doesn't feel right indoors.

No disrespect intended, but acoustics as I understand them do not support your imagining. Other than sound projected UP off the drum heads that would not be reflected back down (in the center of the field only), opening the roof would change the echo very little.

[lastknight]

So lay the drapes across the seats exactly as they do along the sides if they're planning to open it (it's not going to rain anyway when they plan to open it, right?). Sure, it won't look like WGI with a solid black wall and be all pretty for the Blu-Ray, but it will create a similar acoustic dampening effect. There. Curtain issue solved. And as a BONUS: Nobody needs to hang up any drapes after everything is done.

The curtains to the audiences left were not only covering the seating, but (more importantly I think) were shielding the field and seats from the humongous glass wall on that side of the stadium. I've been on that concourse in 2009 and again this year during corps' performances. HUGE difference in my estimation.

[3rd Glasgow BB]

I support the dome 100%. Some of you may have 1000s of $$$$ to waste if there's a rain delay but I don't.

It's an amazing facility and I can't wait to get back next year!

[skywhopper]

I think DCI's FAQ they posted along with the original announcement is interesting in terms of comparing the expectations going in to how LOS is thought of today (I've bolded the most interesting lines to me):

Does this location mean that DCI is becoming an indoor activity?

No. What it means is that the DCI World Championships can never be rained out....

With the 2008 Drum Corps International World Championships currently scheduled as the first event to be held in the new Lucas Oil Stadium,

we will be integrally involved with the creation of the standards for acoustics in the facility

.

Will the retractable roof at Lucas Oil Stadium be open or closed for Drum Corps International events?

It is too early to tell what exactly will happen when the roof is open or closed, and every option and related consequence will be explored and evaluated.

It is DCI’s expectation at this point in time, that whenever the weather allows, the roof will be kept open.

For example, if high humidity or high temperatures may detract from the experience of the performers and fans, DCI may choose to close the roof for comfort and/or safety considerations. That these options are even within the realm of consideration are tremendous assets for DCI in the production of the most elite marching music competitions in the world.

If conditions require DCI to keep the roof closed,

there are provisions being made to create the best possible acoustical environment indoors

. DCI will also be cooperating with acoustical modeling and sound testing of the stadium during the construction phase whenever called upon to do so.

How can DCI do this, without knowing what drum corps will sound like inside the stadium?

DCI did not research what the sound would be like in Denver, Foxboro, or the newly renovated Camp Randall Stadium and has produced highly successful events in those venues. In all cases, there were and will be acoustical challenges.

The experience DCI has had now in three domes gives the organization significant confidence that a hard structure retractable roof will allow for a successful acoustical event, sight unseen.

If the acoustics are indeed a problem at Lucas Oil Stadium, remedies to DCI’s satisfaction are included as a part of the agreement.

Edited August 18, 2011 by skywhopper

[Cadets98]

No disrespect intended, but acoustics as I understand them do not support your imagining. Other than sound projected UP off the drum heads that would not be reflected back down (in the center of the field only), opening the roof would change the echo very little.

Funny that you mention the battery percussion, because that is precisely the biggest issue of playing indoors. With the corps that I came in to help for the last two weeks (Blue Knights) that was the adjustment we had to make after Quarterfinals. We were getting killed for balance issues in "Molly on the Shore" when during the season it was I admit a bit of a problem but not nearly as obvious. We had to make adjustments in brass articulation and volume and the drums had to bring heights down, all in our short semis rehearsal day. This is exactly what I'm talking about. We rehearse outdoors every day, balance things for outdoors, and then have to reinvent the wheel for Finals. Its silly. I understand the positives but lets at least continue this conversation. Like was previously posted, lets try it with the roof open once instead of just ignoring us purists and hope we go away. The drums, not the pit, the battery is way, way, too loud indoors. And honestly I'm sure its kind of disappointing for those battery percussion performers who have to tone down their volume in spots for balance--balances that are just fine when outdoors. Has anyone else had this experience in either band or drum corps where you had to adjust battery volume for indoors?