Make Finals outdoors, PLEASE!

[euphman89]

I'm pretty sure they had the quarterfinals broadcast in 2007 when the Finals were in Cali.....just sayin..

I LOVE THE INDOOR FINALS! My first indoor show was at the RCA Dome (LOS' predecessor in Indy) in 2004 and let me tell you, that was the most miserable day I have ever had. The echo was awful.

Fast forward 2 years and I attended the first show at Atlanta's Georgia Dome. It was MUCH MUCH better, but not perfect. I still enjoy going to Atlanta b/c of the "guarantee" I'll see a show. Even when God sends torrential rain and it floods the upper deck of the stadium when the gutters fail....the show at the GA Dome will go on!

Lucas Oil is great with the large curtains and such. After 3 years now, I think they've worked out most of the kinks. It will ONLY get better there!

Somebody said it earlier in the week. LOS was made retractable for a football team. THAT PLAYS IN THE FALL IN THE MIDWEST! It's not that hot in the FALL IN THE MIDWEST. The Colts would never think of opening that roof in the late summer. Watch their first few games. That roof will be closed! Otherwise LOS would be an oven cooking all of us with NO circulation.

Just because I like all of you though....I will allow you to have Finals outdoors in 2014!

I can personally attest to this. The Glassmen (2010) got an opportunity to rehearse in LOS with the roof open to test acoustics and see what it would be like for drum corps to perform with the roof open. We arrived early in the morning and rehearsed in there for maybe a full hour (could have been more) and did a run. The indoor temperature rose greatly and, since there is no circulation past the AC, it stayed HOT in there - and this was mid-June. We are talking no kind of breeze whatsoever in an indoor stadium where the sun shines directly on the stands in the morning with no circulation if we had the roof open. Not to mention if a freak storm rolls in (we've all seen them in Indiana) DCI is out of a LOT of money.

I guess I just have to echo (no pun intended) the sentiment that the one negative doesn't outweigh the many positives. I think the acoustics have improved every year finals has been in Indy, with noticeably better sound this year.

[BigBadMadMan]

I honestly can't stand drum corps indoors. This year reinforced that for me. Lucas Oil is fine if you're between the 40's. Other than that, you're wasting your dough. Not sure if I'll spend the money again.

[skywhopper]

Who know what other domes with retractable roofs may be built in the next 7 years as well... maybe one stadium by then will be more advanced and make it more possible to open the roof if need be.

We just need to get them to actually build the rolling roof that was in the plans for Arrowhead Stadium back when it was first designed:

Edited August 17, 2011 by skywhopper

[IMcomguy]

Sound in INDY was good.

If it was outside it would be a rainout for 2010.

open roof means no air conditioning at all. ( BAD CHOICE )

This is BS.

Ever been to a Colts game? I can assure you air-conditioning is ON for the bathrooms, kitchens, dining areas....

The fact that we have a retractable roof and Thursday it was 80 degrees and sunny with ZERO chance of rain makes it sad that they did not at least ATTEMPT their little "Top 15" test which they had planned last year but cancelled.

The roof should be opened when available. Yes, there is no drainage, but with CLEAR SKIES and perfect weather on Thursday, it should have been done. One of the MAJOR selling points of Lucas was the ability to open the roof, yet we've all been misled in the subsequent years thereafter this sell.

Lastly: I live in Indy. And I think the lack of trying to make it right, sucks.

[FHdork]

<Lastly: I live in Indy. And I think the lack of trying to make it right, sucks. >

I would not argue that DCI has been misled...but it is unfair to say they've not tried to make it right. I'm not a member of DCI's board...I have not connection to management of this fine organization at all...but it's apparent they've worked to make things better in so far as they can.

I'm a purist. I want outdoor drum corps. But Boo and the other 'get over it' commentators are correct: the season must end on the Saturday night, and the only way to insure that is a domed stadium. LOS design and logistics prevent opening the roof...so all 3 final shows are domed shows...which, for the members, is ideal (similarity...no wind...predictable, if not ideal, conditions...).

I attended Quarters 4 years ago, in Bloomington, thinking it would be my last trip to nationals...ever...so convinced I was that drum corps in a dome would never work. But the people who's opinions I respect are reporting that it's a vastly improved product. I should have had more faith. But I'll have to settle for being a latecomer to reality.

For the purists...Allentown DCI East is likely to remain a very close to the end of the season event...and it's outdoors. I was there this year and will attest that it was great fun, despite the rain! A great choice for outdoor purists.

[TerriTroop]

What would make the sound even better in Indy is to find a way to eliminate the echo from the top of the stadium. If there were a way to hang a decent sound absorption system laterally from the ceiling without changing the lighting situation, I'd say do whatever it takes. (but not likely, I know. cost and logistics are in the way there)

The one thing I miss about the outdoor venue is the feeling that you are part of a really large, vibrant crowd. There is this oddly intimate feeling in any dome. When some of us started cheering for a certain corps as they entered the field ( ) I felt like we were interrupting some kind of sacred silence. It's awkward! (not that it will ever stop me )

This was my first time at Indy, and I'm glad I went. I'll be back next year, but after that I don't know. (that's more about family dynamic and finances than anything else at this point.)

I would like to see champs week rotate to Denver's Invesco Field from time to time. Talk about perfect weather and a perfect outdoor venue!

[craiga]

<Lastly: I live in Indy. And I think the lack of trying to make it right, sucks. >

I would not argue that DCI has been misled...but it is unfair to say they've not tried to make it right. I'm not a member of DCI's board...I have not connection to management of this fine organization at all...but it's apparent they've worked to make things better in so far as they can.

I'm a purist. I want outdoor drum corps. But Boo and the other 'get over it' commentators are correct: the season must end on the Saturday night, and the only way to insure that is a domed stadium. LOS design and logistics prevent opening the roof...so all 3 final shows are domed shows...which, for the members, is ideal (similarity...no wind...predictable, if not ideal, conditions...).

I attended Quarters 4 years ago, in Bloomington, thinking it would be my last trip to nationals...ever...so convinced I was that drum corps in a dome would never work. But the people who's opinions I respect are reporting that it's a vastly improved product. I should have had more faith. But I'll have to settle for being a latecomer to reality.

For the purists...Allentown DCI East is likely to remain a very close to the end of the season event...and it's outdoors. I was there this year and will attest that it was great fun, despite the rain! A great choice for outdoor purists.

I agree with this. I've had a big change of heart in the last two years about the oil can. Yes, I LOVE drum corps outdoors, and that's why I haven't missed an Allentown in 30 years. Having said that, the season needs to end on finals night in facility which is worthy of our activity(nobody can say Lucas isn't nice, after all), and more importantly, that facility needs to keep the 4000 particpants and 15-20,000 spectators SAFE FROM THE ELEMENTS. I think that about covers it.

[mobrien]

Opening the slit above the field (which is what it is, in reality) wouldn't do much of anything to significantly change the acoustics of LOS. Horns are still projecting their sound into in the direction of a large metal overhang, and once that sound starts bouncing around in there, opening an aperture adjacent to the overhang won't do much to dissipate the sound bouncing around up there.

I performed in the nominally 'outdoors' environment of the Olympic Stadium in Montreal, and even though it had an opening over the field, the acoustics were worse in every way then they are in LOS. Indy's DCI's home for the foreseeable future, so best just to get over it. There are many more positives with the venue than negatives, as last week's storm issue should demonstrate.

One major upside for Indy this year was the increased sense of a party atmosphere happening right outside the stadium on Friday and Saturday nights. That was always one of Madison's strongest suits, but if DCI and the local bars and restaurants can keep pushing that angle, it gives the event more of Madison's charm without requiring anyone to sit in the train wreck of a stadium that is Camp Randall.

[IMcomguy]

But Boo and the other 'get over it' commentators are correct: the season must end on the Saturday night, and the only way to insure that is a domed stadium. LOS design and logistics prevent opening the roof...so all 3 final shows are domed shows...

So the other 36 seasons we've had DCI Finals outdoors didn't "insure" (which should be "ensure" by the way) that things still went smoothly and ended up as they did? Yes, things have been delayed or pushed back before, but the show always went on.i

And LOS design and logistics prevent what? Opening the roof? How is that?! The stadium is built with a retractable roof, so it can be opened. There is not this huge hour long delay to open it. The thing opens in under 10 minutes. Whoopdee doo, schedule it for INT.

They even gave DCI the go-ahead last year (remember how DCI was hyping this for the Top 15 at Quarterfinals to all be outdoors??) but it became too hot out and they left it closed, which I was fine with and understood. This year, however, Thursday was clear and 80 in the day, and 72 at night... which was PERFECT weather! Yet it seems like DCI just went silent on the entire issue after last years intense heat.

Also, just for the record, the crap about how "there has to be 0% chance of rain" because of the lack of drainage is BS also, because I've seen Colts games go on, WITH THE ROOF OPEN, and a 30% chance of rain outside. I've also seen Colts games when it was only 50 degrees outside and the roof open (rare, but it happened on SNF). The glass also retracts and comes down. So those of you that think it wouldn't help the sound anyway because of the glass paneling are incorrect as well.

All I'm saying is TRY IT.

DCI was going to do it in 2010, but it was hot as heck, so they didn't. So we know it CAN be done, and obviously within their budget if they planned on it already.

Who knows? Next year we could see three perfect 80 degree days in a row. You know, it doesn't always rain in Indiana. It also isn't always 95-100 degrees out. But even if there were extreme conditions, Lucas always has the luxury of leaving it closed, but why not at least try if conditions are right?

IMO, Bloomington was perhaps the last great Finals we'll be able to witness, sadly. There is just something not right about being inside, even if the sound was perfect (which it's not), and even sitting in the Club level with cushy seats and A/C. There is just something missing. I think mostly it's the crowd and the way the sound is dampened. We'll never again hear the same roar and get the goosebumps we did when Madison moves up a couple slots, when ties were announced in 99 and everyone was chanting SCV, SCV, SCV!, or when Phantom shockingly takes home the title, or when (insert any number of other things here you can remember from Finals).

The sad part is they have the means to correct this very important aspect of the experience by at least trying to open this venue up... "just to see".

My two cents.

Edited August 17, 2011 by IMcomguy

[Lead]

I'm guessing that the events of this year's Open Class Championships (with Prelims rained out) and then the events at the Indiana State Fair on Saturday night have all but sealed the deal with any more roof opening talk.

It may be sad, but I think more and more people are getting used to it. And I am a huge proponent that if we want better sound in LOS, we just need to get more people there.

With the stadium setup that DCI (and ISSMA, for that matter) uses, the roof cannot just be opened in 10 minutes during INT's show. With the amount of dampening material (read: curtains) that we are using in the stadium, much of that must be removed in order for LOS to open the roof. Then you get into issues with many many different obstacles, such as the obvious sound dampening, air conditioning and cooling, lighting, and even who hangs the drapes back up once the roof is decided to be closed again. It's been said around the stadium that the thing is so big it could literally rain in the high corners of the stadium if the moisture level gets too high inside and the roof is opened or closed quickly without proper time to get rid of that moisture.

Then you have the issue that the corps directors appreciate the consistency of weather during three Championships performances, Tom Blair loves the consistency of lighting and sound for the DVD/BRD production, etc. And now that Quarterfinals are now essentially Open Prelims, why wouldn't the Blue Saints or Colt Cadets appreciate their performance on the BRD/DVD looking just like the Cavaliers or Blue Devils? I think that's another plus.

Sure, it's not open-air. Quite frankly, though, it never will be a true open-air stadium.

I told someone this weekend as we were talking about it... "This place is an enclosed stadium that features an optional retractable roof, not an open-air stadium where the roof can be closed." The guy said that made a hell of a difference in the perception of the place.

IMcom, I've spoken with Glassmen and Tom Blair people about that rehearsal day they had in 2010 with the roof open, and by all accounts, it was WONDERFUL. But, it seems there are likely too many obstacles in the way that are going to prevent having a full show day with the roof open, sadly.