Stu Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 My living situation does not represent a lack of loyalty to some set of founding principles of a country, as much as it simply articulates the obsolescence of the very concept. I have homes in several countries and most of the time divide even a single week between countries. In each of these places live my family, friends, associates and those familiar to me. Each of these places are my community. Each are equally deserving of my respect and loyalty, not simply those connected to a piece of land through the lottery of birth. The idea of loyalty to a specific country or government is a concept that has long outlived any usefulness. We are all human. No individual society is any better or worse than any other. We are all equally responsible for the health, safety and well-being of every other human on this planet, regardless of nationality. Were there a flag that represented this concept, that could probably be one I could get behind... as I am human, FIRST... and am American only when I need to go through the archaic ritual of demonstrating my place of birth in order to cross a border. Back to the original topic... the choice to display or not display any flags or symbols within the drum corps activity should simply be up to the kids performing, but not some mandatory requirement. If they choose to do this, then they should probably do it in a way that demonstrates a general courtesy or etiquette. If something this minor could possibly distract or detract from the significance of what these kids have accomplished, then it might be best just to skip it. a) Your loyalty would certainly come into play if those countries in which you live go to War against one another. b) While the U.S. has had warts, and still does, the ability to correct those warts is clearly written into the Constitution which is one of the main beauties of our society; so please, go have a discussion concerning "No individual Society is any better or worse than any other" with those who currently live in Darfur, Somalia, Iran, Syria, or those who lived through Nazi Germany when the no better or no worse U.S. fought to release them from tyranny and then get back to me on how those societies are no better or worse than ours. c) Umm, so your loyalty is to what, the UN? That useless body cannot get countries to agree even on what beverage to serve at dinner. d) And by the way, if you cite the American Pledge (not saying that you do but only if), you either do not understand the actual meaning of the opening stanza or you choose to be obtuse. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Once again, the flag code remains in the US code, but is not enforceable. You can set the thing on fire at the Superbowl without any legal recourse. See also: Texas v. Johnson This is also one of the beauties of how our society is far far better than many others (try burning the Iranian flag in Iran and see what happens). We are allowed, in our free society, to disrespect the very item which symbolizes why we have the freedom to disrespect that item. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 ...One other thing....I do feel bad for the ONE poster here who seems to think that flag and country have no meaning anymore. That's a very myopic view, imo. He has the right to that view, and it took the sacrifices of men and women over 235 years to ensure that right. He mentioned that he has homes in several different countries. I wonder, how many of those countries are free democracies now due to the sacrifice of American people wearing the American Flag on their shoulder during the last century? Well, let's see.... Oh how they forget... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummergirl Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Perhaps the reason the corps didn't have the flag at retreat was because the corps were not allowed outside to go back to their equipment trucks due to the nasty storm that was outside. I'm not sure who the last one was that was allowed outside but I do know that Regiment, who went on 5th from the end, was not allowed out after their performance. Their pit was taking the mallet keyboards back after retreat was over and folks were saying byes in the lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 but tradition of the flag, just like other traditions, have to change to fit the new era. If I seem off base, please tell me. What "new" supposed era do you think we are in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 My point exactly, just more elegantly put. This is a democracy last time I checked. We often hear the claim that our nation is a democracy. That wasn't the vision of the founders. They saw democracy as another form of tyranny. If we've become a democracy, I guarantee you that the founders would be deeply disappointed by our betrayal of their vision. The founders intended, and laid out the ground rules, for our nation to be a republic. The word "democracy" appears nowhere in the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution – two most fundamental documents of our nation. Instead of a democracy, the Constitution's Article IV, Section 4, guarantees "to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government." Moreover, let's ask ourselves: Does our pledge of allegiance to the flag say to "the democracy for which it stands," or does it say to "the republic for which it stands"? Or do we sing "The Battle Hymn of the Democracy" or "The Battle Hymn of the Republic"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Other Mike Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 We often hear the claim that our nation is a democracy. That wasn't the vision of the founders. They saw democracy as another form of tyranny. If we've become a democracy, I guarantee you that the founders would be deeply disappointed by our betrayal of their vision. The founders intended, and laid out the ground rules, for our nation to be a republic. The word "democracy" appears nowhere in the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution – two most fundamental documents of our nation. Instead of a democracy, the Constitution's Article IV, Section 4, guarantees "to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government." Moreover, let's ask ourselves: Does our pledge of allegiance to the flag say to "the democracy for which it stands," or does it say to "the republic for which it stands"? Or do we sing "The Battle Hymn of the Democracy" or "The Battle Hymn of the Republic"? Please! Don't confuse them with facts And here I thought there wasn't gonna be anything good to argue about post season. "If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy." – James Madison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 (edited) Why was this instance with Jim Craig so Inspirational to so many people......and what a drum corps did so horrible? I'll ask.. why can't a few people not handle two simultaneous emotions at the same time re. the USA Hockey Team and a couple of Corps ? Both inspiration in their performance and disappoinment in their display of the Flag ? Is that too complicated a thing for some to experience ? (experience more than one emotion simultaneously ) If so, this might explain this, imo. Edited August 22, 2011 by BRASSO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralTsoChicken Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 On the quick topic of the Canadian Corps mentioned above... Canadian Drum Corps are not obligated to the United States Flag Code. The Canadian Flag, in accordance with "Her Majesty's Law" IS TO FLY higher than the flag of all other endorsed countries. If anything, it is VERY encouraging that the Canadian Corps was following their own, and correct, protocol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mello Dude Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 My living situation does not represent a lack of loyalty to some set of founding principles of a country, as much as it simply articulates the obsolescence of the very concept. I have homes in several countries and most of the time divide even a single week between countries. In each of these places live my family, friends, associates and those familiar to me. Each of these places are my community. Each are equally deserving of my respect and loyalty, not simply those connected to a piece of land through the lottery of birth. The idea of loyalty to a specific country or government is a concept that has long outlived any usefulness. We are all human. No individual society is any better or worse than any other. We are all equally responsible for the health, safety and well-being of every other human on this planet, regardless of nationality. Were there a flag that represented this concept, that could probably be one I could get behind... as I am human, FIRST... and am American only when I need to go through the archaic ritual of demonstrating my place of birth in order to cross a border. Back to the original topic... the choice to display or not display any flags or symbols within the drum corps activity should simply be up to the kids performing, but not some mandatory requirement. If they choose to do this, then they should probably do it in a way that demonstrates a general courtesy or etiquette. If something this minor could possibly distract or detract from the significance of what these kids have accomplished, then it might be best just to skip it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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