Another open letter to DCI.

[JulesBry]

THat show had a high chance of exploding in their faces, they got the thing to actually work, whether anyone liked it or not.

Do you honestly think there was ANY chance that judges would give BD anything less than a high score for anything they put on the field? Can you imagine them receiving 2/10 even at their first show?

It had the chance of exploding in their faces from a crowd perspective (and in a lot of ways, I think it did), but BD (along with many of the G8) could field a show based on dog excrement and the judges would love it.

[JulesBry]

Sometimes when one pushes the envelope, you can get it right, or get it wrong, and fail pretty specatcularly. Competition and the harsh realities there usually straighten out the mistakes.

Except when they don't. When's the last time the judges decided that an "innovative" show didn't work? I'd love to know. According to DCI, if it's never been done before, it's automatically perfection.

Like going to an art museum. I don't expect you to like all the paintings. I don;t expect all fo them to affect you, or expect all of them to affect me, either. I enjoy a lively discussion about them, and about the shows in DCI as well.

Would you expect every professional art critic to like every "innovative" work ever hung in said gallery? That seems to be the case with DCI judges. To me, that doesn't pass the smell test. I'm not saying that they're being bought off or anything, but I am loudly proclaiming that there is no diversity among DCI judges. That may be because the system doesn't allow them to express professional opinions, and if that's true, it's a shame. But in any case, DCI is NOTHING like the world of visual art (or even the larger body of music) because it is judged in such a way as to reward "innovation" regardless of the quality of said innovations.

[JulesBry]

In my opinion, it isn't really a fine line at all. I could care less if the crowd is entertained or not.

That's a great way to end DCI. No audiences will make it awfully hard to fund tours.

I am addressing the attitude of "I am not entertained, therefore I am going to stop supporting DCI and the opportunity it is offering to young people." I find that very selfish, and I don't think it is a fine line at all.

So how many youth programs do you donate to (and ones in which any of your children are directly involved do not count)? Any that bore you to tears on a regular basis? If DCI were to become completely boring to you tomorrow (perhaps it immediately reverted to 1950's drum corps over night), would you continue to support it exactly as you do today? Or would you, say, write letters and try to get others involved in making the situation better?

[JulesBry]

Infact I remember people on DCP commenting that after champs in 2011 things were "quiet" on here. everyone was content with the winner. After 2010 and now after 2012 you have a lot of angst. Which obviously nobody wants.

MikeD already pointed out the 2005 controversy. (And I was livid with the Cadets that year--they used to be one of my favorite corps, but I absolutely hated their shows from 2005-2007. So much so that I now like them with an asterisk because I'm afraid they might try to do something like that again, and I don't want people to think I approve of that style of show.) I would also ask if there were similarly angry reactions with Blue Devils won with Phenomenon of Cool in 2003. I don't remember this kind of response, but I wasn't on DCP or anything like it at that time.

There were lots of people angry with Cavies early in the 2000s. Were they all Cavies-haters? I doubt it. This, "if you don't like the BD show, you are an awful person because you hate the kids and everything they do" kind of BS is ridiculous. I just don't like the show, and haven't liked the last few they've done. I think DCI isn't bold enough to call a spade a spade, and it bothers me that the judges are in lockstep on what is and is not good art. Plus, I like brass and percussion more than synths and amplified voices, and I don't think I'm alone. If I am, I'll leave permanently (rather than my planned temporary hiatus to see if my mind changes) and no one will notice.

This really isn't any more complicated than that. Please don't put motivations in people's mouths.

[fatbrassboy]

Yes, scatter drill is very easy to clean.

But I agree based upon what the judges want these days, BD did the best job of delivering that.

As to the BD souvie trailer making a lot of money.....remember, this is America and people like winners. Why do you think the Lakers, Yankees, Giants, Cowboys, Manchester United, Real Madrid all sell more stuff then their counterparts? People like consistent winners. So selling a bunch of T-Shirts does not equal an audience liked show. To figure that out go by the applause. And if you do that, BD was certainly not tops on most people's list at finals.

It was obvious after the show was over who the fan favorite was. The PR souvie stand had 29 people in line when I walked by and 1 in line next door at the BD stand.

[JulesBry]

I don't know how many new fans were created this year, but I know there are at least two...myself and a young lady from Kansas that I met through BK's FB.

The two of us will take up the slack two of you quitters leave behind.

Except that it's more than 2. If you check the poll on my open letter, you'll see that it's more than 40 out of the 250 who have responded. That's a pretty high percentage. And there are another 90 or so who aren't happy with the direction of DCI, but are sticking around in hopes of things changing. If they don't, who knows how many of those people will be bolting.

Of course, even 130 people wouldn't be noticed by DCI, but if (and I do say IF) that is representative of the community at large, can you see that DCI could have a bigger problem on its hands?

And the truth is, getting rid of electronics would fix a lot of things. I don't think you or the lady from Kansas would even notice their departure. And if DCI created sheets that allowed judges to be completely honest about what they like and don't like, so that placements changed a bit from night to night, I think you'd see a lot of the other people stick around and come back.

I'm not asking for a wholesale restructuring of the activity. I'm just asking DCI to do some research and find out if the preliminary findings from my focus group are at all representative of their fan base at large. If it is, they had better make some changes, or the two of you won't come close to making up for the 130 of us.

[JulesBry]

These "open letter to DCI" reek of narcissism to me. Why post a rant on DCP before you leave the activity?

Because we love drum corps and we don't want it to disappear. If we are more than the minuscule minority you think us to be, and DCI continues to ignore us, the activity won't have the finances to continue. If my rant encourages others who are planning to leave quietly to say something, and perhaps causes DCI to make some changes so that the activity sticks around for a few more years, isn't that a good thing?

If nothing else, shouldn't we find out exactly how big or small the dissenting group is before writing them off as crybabies?

As others have said, where were these threads last year? or 2008? Oh yeah that's right, the favorite corps didn't win this year, so fans feel compelled to complain about the direction of the activity on a public forum, bemoaning that corps don't "play to the audience." Puuhleeze, how about enjoying the blatantly "entertaining" corps more (like Surf) and quite whining about a few shows you don't like. Honestly, I am glad we have that kind of diversity in the activity, but I'll take flawless execution over cheese any day.

I'll point you to MikeD's post about Cadets '05 and mine about some other controversial/non-controversial champions. Please know your history before you insult people with sarcasm.

Guess what, lots of fans (myself included) actually ENJOY those darn "WGI-type" productions,

Great. Go to a WGI competition and enjoy all you want. In fact, now you can go to WGI, BOA, and DCI to get a triple helping of what you like.

I like brass, percussion, and drill. Where do I go to get that without a side of WGI? DCA. Except that the closest competition is a couple of days' drive away.

ENJOY corps willing to take a chance instead of rehashing Malaguena for the umpteenth time, and APPRECIATE/ENJOY the level of execution that most corps bring to the field, regardless of show design. I loved Surf this year, don't get me wrong, but I can see the same thing from dozens of college marching bands during the fall. Halftime entertainment is for marching band; pushing the boundaries of marching music is for drum corps.

I do. In fact, I was among the minority who really liked SCV's 2011 show. And I'm a huge fan of the Cavies' innovations of 2000-2005. I also loved Crossmen '96 opening the show with nothing but flags and drums. Innovation can be good, but it isn't necessarily good. What I see from DCI today is that anything new or different is automatically good. I just don't think that's an ideal system of judging, and it's turned me off to the organization as a whole.

[BigW]

I agree that innovation for the sake of innovation is a can of worms. It can fail. I have stated this before on other threads years ago. It seems you just don't like the winning show this year, so you'll just hang it up. There were some really fine programs out there. I personally enjoyed 11 of the 12 finalists very much. My guess is that's about the same percentage that you have. It's just the one I detested is different from your thoghts on the matter.

And I profile as some old legacy dino stubborn old coot and they had a 92 percent batting average. I'd call that pretty good.

[GUARDLING]

Because we love drum corps and we don't want it to disappear. If we are more than the minuscule minority you think us to be, and DCI continues to ignore us, the activity won't have the finances to continue. If my rant encourages others who are planning to leave quietly to say something, and perhaps causes DCI to make some changes so that the activity sticks around for a few more years, isn't that a good thing?

If nothing else, shouldn't we find out exactly how big or small the dissenting group is before writing them off as crybabies?

I'll point you to MikeD's post about Cadets '05 and mine about some other controversial/non-controversial champions. Please know your history before you insult people with sarcasm.

Great. Go to a WGI competition and enjoy all you want. In fact, now you can go to WGI, BOA, and DCI to get a triple helping of what you like.

I like brass, percussion, and drill. Where do I go to get that without a side of WGI? DCA. Except that the closest competition is a couple of days' drive away.

I do. In fact, I was among the minority who really liked SCV's 2011 show. And I'm a huge fan of the Cavies' innovations of 2000-2005. I also loved Crossmen '96 opening the show with nothing but flags and drums. Innovation can be good, but it isn't necessarily good. What I see from DCI today is that anything new or different is automatically good. I just don't think that's an ideal system of judging, and it's turned me off to the organization as a whole.

it seems, and Maybe Im worng BUT it doesnt seem that you and your 130, you dont love drum corps , you only love YOUR drum corps( which is fine ). I also marched BITD and I teach now and no I dont like everthing about the activity BUT I didnt like everthing about the activity BITD either.

The difference is and maybe if I werent still involved I would feel a tad different BUT the difference is I know I had my time as a MM , its Not my drum corps anymore, its their time and as much as I dont care for a few things And I DO have an influence on at least 2 DCI corps and 1 DCA corps I recognize that people like to always think they are majority, as many as one could find on one side of the spectrum we can find as many on the other. Corps in the past did what they thought was best at the time and its as it should be. There were many corps that met with unfavorable comments from the audience ( funny those are revered as cutting edge now ) so everyone DID NOT have to like everyone BITD nor do people now have to.

I do believe that many of the judges have to go same with WGI BUT with new sheets as well as if there were new judges that doesnt mean outcomes would be different. This was proved this year. What on earth would make people think that sheet changes would change placement. A high level corps knows how to work a sheet or learns to no matter what they are. I had no dount there wouldnt be change hardly, especially because of any sheet.

[Grandpa]

I agree that innovation for the sake of innovation is a can of worms. It can fail.

Well that brings up an interesting thought for me. Are the designers under constant pressure to up the artistic/innovative game every year? Are they actually doing what they want to do or what they feel they need to do to put the numbers on the scoreboard?