Lighting - the next frontier of "staging"

[perc2100]

I don't claim a definitive conclusion based on these feeble results, but the camp that claims it's clear that the top corps draw more BITS haven't proven that claim with statistics, either, that I have seen published anywhere.

I think anyone who's attended a full-day of a Regional-type show (a show were every WC corps performs, for example) can clearly see empty seats for earlier corps and a more full house for the last corps. Those seats are paid for, but there are obviously many ticket-buyers who don't seemed too enthusiastic about watching non-Finalist corps vs, say, the Top 6. This type of behavior seems to happen at most large shows over a number of seasons (i.e. it's not a one or two year trend): heck, it seems annually there is plenty of conversation urging people to watch the less-achieving corps and not spend so much time in the lot

Also, based on your stats, more tickets were sold when a Top/contending-for-the-title corps was performing than not. Sure, only by a little over a hundred, but still...

EDIT:

I do totally get what you're saying though, and just like many arguments on DCP the discussion is a lot more complex than just the performance line-up.

I think, though, it's pretty irrefutable that the top corps like BD, Cadets, Crown, etc. have much higher souvie sales and camp turn-out than lower-placing corps. Many people think that Cavaliers will fairly quickly bounce back from their low placement this year, partially because they have such a long history of excellence and will likely still draw high achieving prospective members to auditions. A corps like Colts might not be so lucky if they place lower than they traditionally do.

Edited August 22, 2012 by perc2100

[Kevin Powell]

I think DCI sells the tickets. For an example of what I mean, look at their best selling show - DCI finals. Most of the tickets for this show sell before anyone knows which corps are in the show.

I am not thoroughly schooled in governmental models, but I am fairly sure that DCI is not communist. The organizations that join DCI do not throw all their resources into one collectivist pool.

I know what you mean about there being a logical conflict, but not to the extent of communism versus capitalism.

DCI is merely a competitive league of drum corps. When it was created, it was just one of dozens of drum corps circuits that operated independently from one another in a free market society. Most of those circuits operated more like the federalist model you describe - and they are now gone. Maybe a little communism helps keep a competitive league of drum corps going. But I would not call it communism - joint venture sounds more appropriate.

the term "collective" that is being thrown about is a "marxist/communist" ideal. So yes... the conflict is as extreme as these two ways of governing.

Governing is what DCI does so using these ideals is a good comparison.

I used this to show the extreme difference of ideologies. These ideologies mirror government issues/philosophy. And we have been discussing a rule (a law with DCI) I at no point said anyone was communist and was very careful not to put that label on any group.

Edited August 22, 2012 by Kevin Powell

[Kevin Powell]

I want to stay out of the communist vs federalism debate.

I realize I used those terms. They were used to describe this one conflict. This whole thing starts sounding like "The occupy wallstreet movement". In a way there is a great "parallel". A group feels like they are being oppressed... "occupy G7" and ask for equal share.

I hate it for both sides. I see the point of both sides. It does not make either side correct or wrong. They need to bring ALL the directors together to vote.

[Kevin Powell]

NOW... back to lighting. Like this quick free form thought, imagine elements that could be thought out if you were working with a concrete idea. That wss a list of WGI Ideas...

Here is another thought... INTRODUCE Brass to the WGI STAGE.

WGI has brought all the movement to the DCI stage... reverse it back to WGI. Show us a winter brass ensemble.

I like the way you think, The possibility once you remove limitation, and excuses is endles

s for a designer that is trying nothing more than to immerse the audience in the world of the show.

I also remember in 2002 for opening ceremonies in Madison, White Screens with back-lit silhouettes of brass players, guard members, and drummers. Seems fairly simple to achieve.

[perc2100]

In a way there is a great "parallel". A group feels like they are being oppressed... "occupy G7" and ask for equal share.

Is there really some sort of oppression though? I'm talking corps directors in DCI World Class corps (the corps that are actual DCI members).

Anyway, I know this is off topic, but I think the cries of oppression are more from people who post on DCP and are pretty far removed from the inner-workings of DCI corps directors

[perc2100]

NOW... back to lighting. Like this quick free form thought, imagine elements that could be thought out if you were working with a concrete idea. That wss a list of WGI Ideas...

Here is another thought... INTRODUCE Brass to the WGI STAGE.

WGI has brought all the movement to the DCI stage... reverse it back to WGI. Show us a winter brass ensemble.

Some groups have tried to add brass to the indoor arena, but it didn't last more than a few seasons (and it wasn't part of WGI). I think that the size of a regulation WGI competitive floor/gym is not conducive to brass being integrated with percussion and/or guard. I think what's more interesting and feasible (and has been done before a little bit) is to 'marry' the guard & percussion sides of the activity. I'd love to see more guards in WGI percussion ensembles, and I'd like to see them integrated well (interesting side note/trivia: in the late 90's WGI used to have a rule that any performers in a WGI percussion group had to contribute musically for a significant amount of time - we had guard girls in our WGI IW programs, but they had to play percussively, hold cymbals, etc).

[Kevin Powell]

Is there really some sort of oppression though? I'm talking corps directors in DCI World Class corps (the corps that are actual DCI members).

Anyway, I know this is off topic, but I think the cries of oppression are more from people who post on DCP and are pretty far removed from the inner-workings of DCI corps directors

I have no idea... Personally, I do not believe there is the oppression that is being talked about.

I do know, looking at what each of the top 12 spends each year, they are all pretty equal. (hats off to Boston for having such a low budget)

[ShortAndFast]

I think DCI sells the tickets. For an example of what I mean, look at their best selling show - DCI finals. Most of the tickets for this show sell before anyone knows which corps are in the show.

If you buy your finals tickets for 2013 today, you can guess with 99% certainty 9 of the corps you'll be seeing. Spoiler alert: BD makes it in!

The real test is prelims. How many are in their seats at 10AM to watch #35? How many at 2:30 to watch #23? How many at 7PM to watch #13? How many at 10PM to watch #1? That tells you a lot about which corps are causing the tickets to be sold.

[Glenn426]

NOW... back to lighting. Like this quick free form thought, imagine elements that could be thought out if you were working with a concrete idea. That wss a list of WGI Ideas...

Here is another thought... INTRODUCE Brass to the WGI STAGE.

WGI has brought all the movement to the DCI stage... reverse it back to WGI. Show us a winter brass ensemble.

I was having a discussion with friends and staff at the beginning of summer and this came up, I think its only a matter of time, Starting with Independent groups, Maybe have Yokohama Scouts, or European-based corps as a model.

I think this is an untapped medium and a lot of Wind kids who want to be involved in the marching arts activity but have no way to do so other than learning how to drum, or spin a flag.

Maybe have all Brass groups compete and then a couple years after have a Indoor competitive theater shows, Were all elements can be mixed and molded into an 8 min show. Think Aimachi + Winds.

Maybe even have some of the top Drum Corps field the first groups. So instead of Vanguard Fielding a separate Guard and Percussion unit, they mold into one theater group. These corps can now operate year round, and develop and execute at a much higher level.

[Kevin Powell]

Some groups have tried to add brass to the indoor arena, but it didn't last more than a few seasons (and it wasn't part of WGI). I think that the size of a regulation WGI competitive floor/gym is not conducive to brass being integrated with percussion and/or guard. I think what's more interesting and feasible (and has been done before a little bit) is to 'marry' the guard & percussion sides of the activity. I'd love to see more guards in WGI percussion ensembles, and I'd like to see them integrated well (interesting side note/trivia: in the late 90's WGI used to have a rule that any performers in a WGI percussion group had to contribute musically for a significant amount of time - we had guard girls in our WGI IW programs, but they had to play percussively, hold cymbals, etc).

i'll admit, I have no clue about the WGI rules so I might have been "spewing" a little. That being said... your options are great and I see no reason not to throw a little brass in the mix. I'm not thinking full brass line because ten folks could fill a gym with sound.