Drum Corps for Engineering Majors

[chaos001]

As an engineering professor, but as someone who never marched, I'm only partly qualified to comment on this. :)

100% of the graduates in my department get jobs (perhaps not until late, and perhaps not their first choice, but they get jobs). And I'm at a university in a state where engineering jobs are perhaps a little tougher than other states, and my department is different than yours (industrial and systems engineering, which likely provides broader marketability). Many of our students get internships, and they certainly help after graduation, primarily because students end up working at one of the places where they interned. Many choose to take summer courses, do summer research, do mission work, or something else, and all have gotten jobs regardless of that internship.

I say the key to getting a job lies in how you sell yourself: synthesizing what you've learned in your courses and how knowledge can be used solve the problems associated with the position to which you're applying, syntehsizing your experiences (e.g., drum corps) and how they make you a strong candidate, etc. And another piece of advice: don't rely only on your university's career services program - go try to find other postings all across the map that interest you and apply to them (cast a wide net to improve your chances of getting offers since you haven't tested the waters with an internship).

I say, in my unprofessional opinion... GO MARCH. Maintain a high GPA. Don't remember everything you learned in class, but remember that you learned it. And change your major... :)

It's nice to see that you're finally good for something. ;)

[kdaddy]

It's nice to see that you're finally good for something. ;)

I was saving it for my 1381st post. :)

[chaos001]

I was saving it for my 1381st post. :)

Almost as good as your stalking skills...

[SnoWhite421]

We've been having drum corps/resume related conversations with our daughter, who will march her sixth summer and age out this coming season. After five years with the same organization, she's considering auditioning with BD and mulling the pros and cons. If she stays with her current corps, she stands a good chance of being section leader, and she already has a lot of ideas about what she would like to do in the position. If she auditions and is accepted by BD, she stands a good chance of getting a championship ring. Something we've pointed out is that, when she talks to potential employers, unless she's applying to tech somewhere, they're not going to care that she plays the mellophone well and marches cleanly. They will, however, be impressed if she explains that she took the five-year investment that the corps put into her and returns it by helping to make her section be the very best it can be in a potentially very exciting year for our organization.

Also, her dad works for a major retailer and does a LOT of hiring, including department managers, pharmacists and optometrists. He told her that most everyone has the same major-related campus organizations on their resumes, it doesn't mean much unless you can show active participation and leadership in that particular organization. Just going to the meetings doesn't cut it. So, basically, it doesn't matter so much what you are involved in as how you contribute while you are there.

Good luck with all your pursuits!

[SpiritVet]

Here's two perspectives you might find enlightening. Granted, my situation is pretty unique, but some themes are similar.

I was set to graduate in December of 2010 with my BS in Materials Engineering, but I got the bonus year and would age out in 2011. Coming out of high school, I was an ardent follower of drum corps, but didn't think I was talented enough to actually do it until after my little brother marched in 2009. I auditioned with him at Spirit for the 2010 season, and made the cut, but eventually decided to take an internship and march all-age (Atlanta CV). Both my internship and marching CV have proved to be very valuable to me, not only in the obvious ways, but also in that I established quite a few connections to people of similar professions while marching. After I graduated, my plan was to apply for grad school, work part time/intern, and march Spirit. I ended up dropping my grad school plans in favor of full time employment, and found a company that wanted to take me starting in May. I was able to convince them of the value of marching corps, and they delayed my start date until August. I ended up leaving that company and searching for new jobs, but my connections in corps, as well as my marketability from internships, and the way I was able to sell my experience marching drum corps got me into my current job. The way flex time works, I've even been able to do some marching band teaching during the fall.

Now, my brother decided he was talented enough (very true) and wanted to do corps immediately after high school, and then go to the same school as me, majoring in Aerospace Engineering (eventually changed to Computer Science). He's marched four years and aged out in 2012 with Spirit, and is set to graduate this December. His grades have been outstanding, and he's received offers for internships and/or jobs that he's turned down to do corps instead. He's steered his CS curriculum to eventually move towards grad school doing Music Technology, and during the down time between graduation and the start of grad school, teach on visual staff for a corps.

Basically, you'll be surprised who you'll meet doing drum corps. Several engineers have made it work before you, and you'll probably meet them along the way. Also, how you manage to sell your experience can have a great effect on your future. But as for how you split your time doing internships and marching, it's all up to you and your situation. Consider carefully if you'll graduate before or after aging out, and as a CivE, it'll probably be important for you to get your PE, which means getting employed as soon as you can after graduating.

[Pete Freedman]

Maybe it's different with engineering, but in general a large percentage of internships are completely worthless as learning opportunities.

A radio station here in NYC was doing a topic on this very problem of interns not getting the educational value they were promised, when a caller asked whether the station itself had any interns and whether they were doing anything valuable. The announcer chuckled and wouldn't give a clear answer. (Maybe an intern passed the call through...)

Point is, if you go for the internship, talk to current or past interns there to ensure there is real value at that internship. Often the employer just wants a free person to file papers and make coffee. Search 'bad internships' on the web. It's a bit of a scandal, actually.

[Quad Aces]

Along with all of the great advice already given, another thing to consider is that even if you max out on internships/co-ops, that won't guarantee that you get a job after school either.

I was an aerospace engineering major at a top engineering school in the country. At the time (early 90s), the job market for aerospace wasn't that great at all - we had professors tell us that they feel bad for us because the market was as bad as they have ever seen it (I wish they told us that a year or two earlier before we got too far invested in the program, but that's a totally different conversation :) A classmate of mine co-oped with McDonnell Douglas for every semester that he was eligible (5 total, so about 2 1/2 years worth of work there). Towards graduation, I asked him what his job outlook was, saying that if anyone of us was going to get an aerospace job he would, right? He said no - there were only two positions open, and he wasn't guaranteed to get one of them.

I, like others, would say if you really love drum corps, then do it before you are no longer eligible, and if you can, then take a summer or two off and mix in a few internships/co-ops where possible. That way you can get the best of both worlds. Whichever route you go, throw yourself into it and do it as best as you can, and the rest will sort itself out.

[Pete Freedman]

It may be a long shot, but I wonder if you could count your drum corps experience as credits toward the non-engineering portion of your degree requirements? I realize with engineering most of your undergrad courses will be engineering, but usually there are some non-engineering requirements as well.

First you would probably go to the registrar and see what evidence your counselor there would require to count the experience. You may have to log your hours in training, and performances. Then you would have to go to the music department to get the approval that it would be equivalent to a 3 credit course (of course in reality it would be much more). They you take that signature back to the registrar.

These counselors have an amazing amount of authority to play with the stated graduation requirements, and most students graduate without ever realizing it, so see what you can get. You can use the time saved to do an internship during a semester.

Another thought is doing what is sometimes called 'directed readings', that is, a three credit learning experience that you and your professor design for yourself around the summer tour. Stadiums and football fields (and the attached schools) are a worthy aspect of civil engineering, and you will be doing a tour of a couple dozen during the summer. There must be something you can study about them to write a paper.

Between these ideas you just might parlay your drum corps summer into six credits. Maybe not, but it's worth a shot.

As an important aside, get to know your department secretary(s) and get them to like you. They are officious because they tend to be treated like crap by everyone around them (the social pecking order in college is brutal), but they have both the power and knowledge to work the system. They have the keys to the kingdom. Smile at them, treat them nicely, complement the pictures of their kids, and you will benefit.

[Toby]

Another thought is doing what is sometimes called 'directed readings', that is, a three credit learning experience that you and your professor design for yourself around the summer tour. Stadiums and football fields (and the attached schools) are a worthy aspect of civil engineering, and you will be doing a tour of a couple dozen during the summer. There must be something you can study about them to write a paper.

A study on the best showers on tour.

[HockeyDad]

I'll answer it in more simple terms:

If you want to go march, go march. You'll have the rest of your entire frickin' life to work. And it can be a grind at times. That's why we call it "work." So, go do drum corps. AND DO NOT put "synthesize" in your resume. Clearly there's a gulf between the ivory towers of academia and the real world (that's fer you kdaddy).

Signed,

Degreed Civil Engineer with 30 yrs in the business.