JimF-LowBari Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 While I must agree that the intonation today is far superior, I find it funny that people try and say today is as loud as BITD. Yea, it comes close but how many horns on the field today ( on average ) as compared to say, 1980 ? DCA comes close as they didn't rack up the numbers like DCI. From this non-musical guy (I'm not a musician I play horn. - Rip off of John Kruks "I'm not an athlete lady, I'm a ballplayer. ) I hear hits of volume but few corps open it up like my time. Guessing blend with the other voices comes first. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contrajedi8 Posted August 14, 2013 Share Posted August 14, 2013 I'm borrowing this thought from another DCP member's post. A corps (pick whoever you want, the poster said Troopers), comes out and performs on G bugles. What happens in the stands? Nothing would happen in the stands. Only DCP would notice. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbandguy Posted August 15, 2013 Share Posted August 15, 2013 Were you around in the eighties and nineties? Like....around drum and BUGLE corps....standing in front of them or a mile away? If not.....you wouldn't understand. I was there even before the 80s. I'm not OLDbandguy by choice. Yes, I do understand and the volume today with the Bb is still awesome and the intonation is awesomer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mingusmonk Posted August 15, 2013 Share Posted August 15, 2013 (edited) You can only do so much if you aren't from the time period, but, here's Empire Statesman at their premier show I think. Even with the crappy cell recording, considering the age and size of their corps (not full size), you can hear how loud the horn is. Put them in Carolina Crown's hands. Yeah, that will be loud. Better yet - put them in Phantom or Madisons or BD's. My link: Such a sorry sounding state of affairs. Edited August 15, 2013 by mingusmonk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mingusmonk Posted August 15, 2013 Share Posted August 15, 2013 It's shame really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bayareafan Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 Anyone that sat in front of BD during their warmup back when they were on G bugles knows the difference in power that you get from those horns versus the B-flat horns of today. Just listening to BD tune on the old G bugles was honestly worth the price of admission to a show. You'd literally feel the stands shaking from the sound. The flip side is that the horn lines today are a little cleaner and are more in-tune thanks to the B-flat instruments. I also think that moving to B-flat has helped the lower tier corps perform better. The top tier corps always had such phenomenal talent that they could make the G horns sound good. But the lower tier corps would have a hard time playing them. Today when you go to a show the lower tier corps perform way better than they used to and the overall effect of the change has been to narrow the difference in quality between the lower tier and upper tier corps. From a volume perspective corps today are compensating in a variety of ways - most notably with all the electronic goo they use during loud section to support the horn lines. I don't personally like all that goo, but alas it seems we will have it from now on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pearlsnaredrummer77 Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 (edited) The g horns do have a distinctive and brighter sound. When I hear a b flat horn line it always sounds a bit choked off to me. The g horns also gave more bang for the buck. Today's b flat lines have considerably more members than the g lines. I suppose its easier to have a spotlessly clean line in b flat, but I don't think the average audience member notices the difference in that regard. Only the music majors or would be music majors do. Finally one of the arguments for b flat would be that a cheaper point of entry with a more accessible instrumentation would encourage the growth of new corps. Oddly enough the newer corps (I'm referring to smaller & parade corps) seem to be using the discarded g horns. So at some level it may have worked, but in an oddly ironic way. :) Edited August 17, 2013 by pearlsnaredrummer77 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 The g horns do have a distinctive and brighter sound. When I hear a b flat horn line it always sounds a bit choked off to me. The g horns also gave more bang for the buck. Today's b flat lines have considerably more members than the g lines. I suppose its easier to have a spotlessly clean line in b flat, but I don't think the average audience member notices the difference in that regard. Only the music majors or would be music majors do. Finally one of the arguments for b flat would be that a cheaper point of entry with a more accessible instrumentation would encourage the growth of new corps. Oddly enough the newer corps (I'm referring to smaller & parade corps) seem to be using the discarded g horns. So at some level it may have worked, but in an oddly ironic way. :) There aren't many "discarded" G horns left that have much life left in them...wouldn't be a great investment in the future even if they were cheap...and God forbid you (or anyone else) is the person responsible for keeping them in playing condition. That would be a job akin to having to teach me how to pirouette. In 2000, I did not notice the difference between Cadets' and Cavaliers' horn line quality while viewing them live. Cadets had B-flat horns and Cavaliers still had G. When I received the CDs, minus the visual stimuli, I was stunned. The difference in clarity between the two B-flat lines—Cadets and Blue Devils—and the remaining G lines was astounding. At that point, I called a director friend of mine and told him I hoped he was planning on making the switch, because once a brass judge closes their eyes to shut out everything else and focuses specifically on the quality of sound...it's all over. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumno5 Posted August 18, 2013 Share Posted August 18, 2013 I'm borrowing this thought from another DCP member's post. A corps (pick whoever you want, the poster said Troopers), comes out and performs on G bugles. What happens in the stands? Probably not much. It's a moot argument, I suppose, but I would bet a fair percentage of the audience wouldn't notice the difference, including at least a few of the "real drum corps" anti-Bb contingent. Peace, Fred O. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanstulbrass Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Why do people keep insisting that the G horns would be "louder" than the Bb horns? Is there something about the physics of their construction that makes this so? In all of the research I have done (somewhat limited) I have flund nothing about the basic construction of these instruments that would suggest Bb or G is louder than the other. From Kanstul's line of marching instruments, here are some specs: BbTrumpet: .470 Bore with a 5 1/16 inch bell G Soprano Bugle: .470 bore witha 5 inch bell What is supposed to be making that G bugle sound so much louder??? Is it less tubing (since it is in G instead of Bb)?? Help please with the physics of this "G is louder" assertion. Lower pitch, longer soundwaves, better projection. Also, Kanstul G bugles as well as Kanstul Bb/F marching brass are built better and resonate better. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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