Sad News from Music City

[Freedom]

Here is the entire post I clipped from... where are you stating this is your opinion? To me it sounds like you are stating facts.

"DCA is not an answer or solution to DCI. Its an answer to age outs. Lets face it. Its a substitute IN THE EYES OF THE AVERAGE HS KID. HS want to see Crown and Blue Devils and Cavis and Phantom and Spirit and compete against them. They want to see the best at what they do. Let me think out loud if I am allowed to without giving my name, address and medical history to BluecoastBuc. Kids want to be in DCI. DCI is a deathtrap to upstart corps because of touring costs. How about turning open class into the BOA model where its the weekend regionals and championship at the end of the season. At finals week....Friday night would be the open class finals. Gives the Open Class an audience. Do away with semis in Worlds. Its unnecessary. I would do regionals where the World Class is the Allentown model......either Open Class on Friday night and World Class on Saturday night and then G7 on Sunday. Or do Open Class during the day...World at night. REGIONALS.....meaning unlike Allentown not everyone is there. This way Open Class and World Class can watch each other. Its about education and support for each other. The benefits are too long to illustrate."

It's an opinion.

[Stu]

I will not get into the pissing contest you tend to try to draw others into whenever you post.

My statements were generated by professional experiences of dealing with school districts there and elsewhere. You are correct that the school years seem to begin earlier each year. You and Jim Bari have presented exceptions to what I stated. One exception does not make a full class argument. And one weekend absence does not make a full school year. Further I would guess, no direct evidence except overheard conversations, that SCVC actually has few members from the actual city of Santa Clara and the district you cite.

My conclusion still stands that an Open Class DCI corps who might not finacially afford the current DCI touring model might find other alternatives for competition viable to maintain the organization.

Beyond that, go pee elsewhere.

Presenting factual information to you is not peeing on you; and what has actually gotten you riled up is that the facts do not support your contention. And the 'fact' is an overwhelming number, I repeat, an overwhelming number of public schools across the nation are starting classes way before Labor Day; and many are taking those classes way into late June (just ask Bob Jacobs with Jersey Surf).

[Reed]

I had a student march in Music City this year, and he missed all of band camp (not a big deal, he's already learned the whole show since coming back) and the entire first week of school. Our first full day with students was Aug. 5. Metro-Nashville schools started on Aug. 1. (I teach in the suburbs.)

Edited August 20, 2013 by Reed

[GUARDLING]

Until DCA or I cares about and serves the general public....its going to stay the same. People aren't going because they aren't compelled to go because their last experiences wasnt something they liked or cared for. Starts with show design. Give then receive. That's how it works. That's why TV commercials entertain us. Emotionally connect to the audience. Then...they buy products. Drum corps serve the score sheet and the design staffs egos. Its not complicated. If you go to China to sell the Chinese on whatever you are selling....better learn Chinese. Music is communication and drum corps is a product. What will your product do for me? How does it benefit me? DCI is a yacht club for band directors....not a public service. Even drug dealers get it. Give free samples and sell benefits that appeal to the consumer. Attack that from what angle you want...same principle in sales whatever it is.

let me ask a question....BITD..were people talking about "SHOW DESIGN "? I dont think so, were we "ENTERTAINED" by all corps..nope dont think so, yet many feel they want to go back to when corps entertained..ok you can pick a decade which then doesnt say much about other decades BUT it baffles me sometimes when people bring the word entertaiment in the fold....believe me I get it and in programming its always a point of discussion BUT when we talk about BITD I never remember it ever talked about to MM or even staff.( one major corps I taught when I was a new instructor only talked about entertainment 1st but that was rare ) You picked songs and went for it.....

BITD corps picked music decided their plan of attack was for competition and people came and watched the competition. Now ( and I guess its the times ) people want to be involved in all aspects of it. Maybe its the price , maybe its the times, maybe its frustrated designers, directors and staff maybe its a link to peoples pasts.....what point am I making? none maybe...just a weird observation thinking back I suppose.............but whatever its always sad to see corps go. I would venture to say what we see as drum corps today in 20 years will for sure be nothing what we remember...or maybe not.

[fsubone]

Further I would guess, no direct evidence except overheard conversations, that SCVC actually has few members from the actual city of Santa Clara and the district you cite.

Not entirely from the Santa Clara School District, but SCVC and BDB are still mostly "local" groups. I say local as within 50 miles, so that means Bay Area for SCVC and East Bay area for BDB. Pretty much all of the school districts start the same week, just the colleges are different. The biggest thing these kids will miss is band camp for their high school, but doubtful they'd miss actual school.

[normy diploome]

Presenting factual information to you is not peeing on you; and what has actually gotten you riled up is that the facts do not support your contention. And the 'fact' is an overwhelming number, I repeat, an overwhelming number of public schools across the nation are starting classes way before Labor Day; and many are taking those classes way into late June (just ask Bob Jacobs with Jersey Surf).

Jersey Surf has its base operations in a place where at least 180 in-class school days are required. Hurricane/Tropical Storm Sandy and the later winter snow/ice storms interupted that from the usual momentum. Having been a principal for a time, I know that most schools in the Northeast write at least 5 extra school days into their calendar to offset that. The State limits on State and Federal Aid for school attendance do not allow further prolongations of most calendars at will without State approval and legal changes.. Although schools look to the long view, Jersey's situation was extra-ordinary this year and not a result of starting before or after Labor Day.

You seem to switch horses midstream in answering Drilltech1 or I too am not clear on the point you are trying to make.

As you mentioned a specific corps, let me mention another two corps. Instructors of both Oregon Crusaders and Cascades had conversations with me that they were hampered in starting the DCI tours which are based on college availability and Midwestern/Southern educational biases because the schools in the Northwest mimic the calendar of New England where the traditional calendars have been from Labor Day to the last weeks of June. I opine that the World Class corps have more college age members by percentage than do the Open Class corps. That educational calendars are impinging on the DCI tours, especially for the Open Class, is now more obviously having a thwarting effect.

Edited August 20, 2013 by normy diploome

[skywhopper]

Presenting factual information to you is not peeing on you; and what has actually gotten you riled up is that the facts do not support your contention. And the 'fact' is an overwhelming number, I repeat, an overwhelming number of public schools across the nation are starting classes way before Labor Day; and many are taking those classes way into late June (just ask Bob Jacobs with Jersey Surf).

I'll just go ahead and speak up here, that I've never gone to, had a child go to, had relatives' children go to, or known about any schools that actually start after Labor Day. It's so far removed from my experience that I always wonder WTF is up with the TV news making a big deal out of the day after labor day as the first day of school, because by then me or my kids have generally been in school for two to three weeks. I also consider getting out the last week of May to be pretty early. Maybe schools in these mysterious other places I haven't lived don't run for 36 weeks? College is a different story in terms of the end of the school year, but still, most universities on the semester system start classes in late August, a week or two before Labor Day, otherwise you can't get in 16 weeks of a semester before Christmas.

I'm not sure why we're having this argument, but I figured I might as well join in.

Edited August 20, 2013 by skywhopper

[JimF-LowBari]

Jersey Surf has its base operations in a place where at least 180 in-class school days are required. Hurricane/Tropical Storm Sandy and the later winter snow/ice storms interupted that from the usual momentum. Having been a principal for a time, I know that most schools in the Northeast write at least 5 extra school days into their calendar to offset that. The State limits on State and Federal Aid for school attendance do not allow further prolongations of most calendars at will without State approval and legal changes.. Although schools look to the long view, Jersey's situation was extra-ordinary this year and not a result of starting before or after Labor Day.

Sounds like how and why my area handles ye olde "snow days" but ran into a wierdie while in in the Finger Lakes a few years back. There kids were finishing the school year second half of June and we were told that is normal there.

Just bringing it up as why any start/end dates will bite someone you know where....

Edited August 20, 2013 by JimF-LowBari

[normy diploome]

I'll just go ahead and speak up here, that I've never gone to, had a child go to, had relatives' children go to, or known about any schools that actually start after Labor Day. It's so far removed from my experience that I always wonder WTF is up with the TV news making a big deal out of the day after labor day as the first day of school, because by then me or my kids have generally been in school for two to three weeks. I also consider getting out the last week of May to be pretty early. Maybe schools in these mysterious other places I haven't lived don't run for 36 weeks? College is a different story in terms of the end of the school year, but still, most universities on the semester system start classes in late August, a week or two before Labor Day, otherwise you can't get in 16 weeks of a semester before Christmas.

I'm not sure why we're having this argument, but I figured I might as well join in. :lookaround:/>/>/>

Your experience assuredly is quite valid. What part of the nation do you live?

In Bristol, Ct. there is a company known as ESPN. In Connecticut, the local folk lore is that ESPN offered the NCAA more weekends for college football games to be televised if the NCAA could move the season forward. NCAA supposedly presented the benefits ($$$$$) to the college administrators who agreed and gradually the semester began.

earlier. First the universities adjusted their calendars nationally, and many local schools followed after. The inclusion of more religious and ethnic holidays for an increasing number of people also influenced calendar formation. Schools in the Northeast now have to consider Islamic, Chinese, Jewish, and Christian holydays/holidays when making a public school calendar so as not seem to favor one group over another. And not to regard them at all is to make Secularism a religion.

Another influence on the calendar change was the greater popularity and availability of air conditioning and internal climate control, especially now that computers and technology need a proper climate all year long. What were once calendar excuses due to excessive weather and crop harvesting no longer apply. The times are changing. How is DCI?

Edited August 20, 2013 by normy diploome

[Stu]

... I too am not clear on the point you are trying to make.

Let me make this very simple for you to understand. a) Most, not all, but most public schools around the nation are now beginning their academic session in August prior to Labor Day; a big reason is so that the semester can end at the winter break and not extend into a few weeks after return in January; b) Since most, not all, but most DCI Open Class corps have a lower average age than many of the WC corps this means that many youth performers of those corps are required to attend those schools starting in mid Aug; c) That would therefore preclude most all current DCI Open Class corps from attending the DCA finals which means DCA is not really a viable option for those corps; especially those with great travel distances from MA. Point clear enough for you?