cowtown Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 1 minute ago, chris7997 said: Everyone has personal tastes. Even show designers. They don't want to control content? They don't have personal tastes? Clearly their tastes are for the dark and obscure. And it's becoming cliche. And yes, I and thousands of other drum corps fans are getting a little weary of their personal tastes year after year in 80% of the shows. They need to put aside their own personal tastes for once and bring more balance and open-mindedness to show themes. I speak for millions of drum corps fans who are fine with 83.5% of the show themes as is 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris7997 Posted June 2, 2017 Author Share Posted June 2, 2017 (edited) 9 minutes ago, dcsnare93 said: Judging a show based on a description without having actually seen it, I would call that being close-minded. Corps' have also done the very themes you claim like, just this past year... nature, heros, current events, inspirational stories. I'm not judging the shows themselves. I never made that claim. Of course I cannot do that...no one has seen the shows! But I'm not holding my breathe that a show about an Ouroboros will not have substance about a snake that eats itself or an Enigma show won't be enigmatic. True, I agree. There are themes (which I gave credit to in my commentary) of heroes, current events, and nature etc. But they are often the exception to the rule...especially this year. But even many of those are often relativistic and obscure as well. I'm arguing that the scale is tipped in the balance towards esoteric, obscure, dark post-modern art...not in the other direction. It's been like that since I've been following drum corps in the 90s. We all know what I mean. I'm arguing for more tolerance and more balance. Edited June 2, 2017 by chris7997 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mingusmonk Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 5 minutes ago, chris7997 said: I'm arguing for more tolerance and more balance. Can I get some examples of the intolerant behavior? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris7997 Posted June 2, 2017 Author Share Posted June 2, 2017 (edited) Like Western values? And what are those Western values, who decides them and how is that free speech if it's so limited to only a narrow range? 20 minutes ago, cowtown said: It does sound like too much to ask but then again, I’m not sure I follow you because you contradict yourself. Could you hash it out a bit more so I can better understand what you’re saying ? Like Western values? And what are those Western values, who decides them and how is that free speech if it's so limited to only a narrow range? Fair question. Freedom. Freedom of religion. Freedom of speech. Freedom of enterprise. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Liberation of racial minorities. Liberation of the oppressed. Western Civilization took part in the abolition of slavery. Democracy. Science. Technology. Medicine. But I'm also referring to Western (not eastern) music, art, writing, poetry, etc. etc. Western values of charity, temperance, etc. The list is huge. Edited June 2, 2017 by chris7997 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris7997 Posted June 2, 2017 Author Share Posted June 2, 2017 (edited) 9 minutes ago, mingusmonk said: Can I get some examples of the intolerant behavior? Mingus, that's what I'm asking for. I want examples of why tolerance in this context is completely defined and accepted as having an Eastern, Dark, Obscure DCI show theme in your show. And why having a show with an actual message is so-called "intolerant." I want to know why corps designers are not more open-minded and tolerant of shows with a real message? Edited June 2, 2017 by chris7997 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjoakes Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 This is a fine topic for discussion here. chris7997's original post did not indicate any judging of the shows, performances, or talent. And he anyway replied a couple of times that he is only looking at the themes and not the shows. Of course, a dark-theme might turn into a heck of a show this summer. And yes, our reaction to themes is at least in part a matter of personal tastes. Are we now not supposed to comment on DCP based on personal tastes? Good grief. I don't have a big problem with the dark themes. Some seem pretentious - if not preposterous - to me. But I am not going to get too worked up over what must be a tough task between designers, directors, and their attempt to appeal to their members and fans. Because I am not so worked up over it doesn't mean chris7997's perspective isn't a legitimate one to toss out here. More interesting to me would be some intelligent study of how these dark themes align with the backgrounds and demographics of many of the millennials or compose the mms. No, that study isn't at all worth it. I just mean to say I'm curious about it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 7 minutes ago, chris7997 said: Like Western values? And what are those Western values, who decides them and how is that free speech if it's so limited to only a narrow range? Fair question. Freedom. Freedom of religion. Freedom of speech. Freedom of enterprise. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Liberation of racial minorities. Liberation of the oppressed. Western Civilization took part in the abolition of slavery. Democracy. Science. Technology. Medicine. But I'm also referring to Western (not eastern) music, art, writing, poetry, etc. etc. Western values of charity, temperance, etc. The list is huge. Wasn't it Blue Stars who did a show on the Four Freedoms? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowtown Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, chris7997 said: Western Civilization took part in the abolition of slavery. Abolition was a radical concept to many at the time of its introduction because Slavery was a Western Value? I’m so confused Why are snakes and butterflies bad? Are all animals bad? Is there a list of your approved animal? Or is it their behaviors you object to? I agree that most show announcement are lacking, often just filling space with way too many adjective that say nothing but generally, my issues with them are writing style and not the show themes presented, partic. content 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldSchoolCorps Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 Everyone has their opinion, true enough. I tend to appreciate true art, which to me is to express ones concept artistically without the restrictions and confines of opinions and personal preferences. I love it when designers and those that conceptualize shows break away from "the norm" and push their creative limits! I, for one, am THRILLED that Phantom is doing what they're doing, and I can't wait to see/hear it! Blue Devils NEVER disappoint, so I've just learned to withhold my critiques until I see what they've put together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, mjoakes said: This is a fine topic for discussion here. chris7997's original post did not indicate any judging of the shows, performances, or talent. And he anyway replied a couple of times that he is only looking at the themes and not the shows. Of course, a dark-theme might turn into a heck of a show this summer. And yes, our reaction to themes is at least in part a matter of personal tastes. Are we now not supposed to comment on DCP based on personal tastes? Good grief. I don't have a big problem with the dark themes. Some seem pretentious - if not preposterous - to me. But I am not going to get too worked up over what must be a tough task between designers, directors, and their attempt to appeal to their members and fans. Because I am not so worked up over it doesn't mean chris7997's perspective isn't a legitimate one to toss out here. More interesting to me would be some intelligent study of how these dark themes align with the backgrounds and demographics of many of the millennials or compose the mms. No, that study isn't at all worth it. I just mean to say I'm curious about it. American sociologists have long researched that the great musicals of the American theater arise most often out of the war years, depressions, and times of more difficult life. That depressive dark themes come to the mind of the design teams do not surprise me. But I wonder if in these Divided States of America, as some term the current age, whether the dark themes will resonate with older generations perhaps tired of the negative sagas while younger generations haven't maxed out those experiences yet. I don't disagree at all with Chris' push for more positive productions. Many find life difficult as is and don't need anymore depression no matter how creative it is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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