What is wrong with US?

[Jeff Ream]

41 minutes ago, cixelsyd said:

Yes.  Like that episode yesterday.  Or anything where you extrapolate on the basis of a website being perfectly up to date.

trust me, relying on the Commonwealth of Pennsyltucky for anything is a futile effort.

[Terri Schehr]

4 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

trust me, relying on the Commonwealth of Pennsyltucky for anything is a futile effort.

Illinois says hold my beer. 

[Jeff Ream]

2 minutes ago, Terri Schehr said:

Illinois says hold my beer. 

you've driven our roads. we win ( or lose depending on your POV)

[2000Cadet]

13 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

i agree.......and don't agree.

 

sadly talking to those in charge often gets you sunshine and roses answers or flat out ignored. there's some transparency in some places, but drum corps has proven time and time again to be reactionary only after the worst possible case scenarios unfold. sadly too many good intentioned people refuse to open up to let people help, and try to control everything, and make it worse. and in this day and age with lawsuits flying hourly, and it seems the statutes of limitations being widened to bring old wounds forward, airing laundry sometimes is sadly the only way to get change and transparency to happen.

 

it's a double edged sword indeed.  but until the corps themselves get ahead of #### before it breaks and be open, it's the world we live in today. if you think it's bad here, check out Reddit

Have the postings about SCV's troubles led to changes within their org? I'm asking because I don't know, not to be an a-hole. 

[GraysonHarris]

Too many people have an axe to grind, including some very vocal regular posters on here who refuse to believe or think that they are ever WRONG.

[Jeff Ream]

14 minutes ago, 2000Cadet said:

Have the postings about SCV's troubles led to changes within their org? I'm asking because I don't know, not to be an a-hole. 

given what continues to be found publicly, it doesn't seem to have changed anything.

[cixelsyd]

14 minutes ago, 2000Cadet said:

Have the postings about SCV's troubles led to changes within their org? I'm asking because I don't know, not to be an a-hole. 

Yes, they have led SCV to a renewed focus on transparency.

Whether that means providing or thwarting transparency, however, remains to be seen.

[MarimbaManiac]

3 hours ago, 2000Cadet said:

Don’t get it confused. I am all for holding corps accountable for what happens with their finances, ESPECIALLY when much of their coins are from donations. But if we protest to love this activity as much as we do, WHY are we trying to destroy the reputations of corps we claim to love? 

 

So, you acknowledge that there are problems that need to be addressed, and in later posts acknowledge that other avenues for fixing those issues have been attempted, yet you complain when people trying to bring those issues to light?

Let's be clear about something. When there are systemic issues in an organization, and that organization is unwilling to even ACKNOWLEDGE them yet alone address them, there are two options. Let it be, or dig further and shine a spotlight. The problem, as you put it, is that for decades people were too comfortable with, or encouraged by others, to stay quiet and let things be. There was too much willingness to overlook clearly serious issues for "the health of the activity" or "out of respect for the organization." It bred a toxic environment where issues were allowed to fester, and whistleblowers were declared to be the problem because it was "too messy."

Frankly, the people who want change, but refuse to get their hands dirty, are the worst offenders of this story. They cry foul enough to make it seem like they're engaged and offended, but are actually more offended by the heavy handed processes that are required to force change in intransigent organizations. In my opinion, they are the ones who are doing the most damage to the activity, because they're too "grossed out" by the dirty work that they allow corruption and incompetence to continue, even when that results in very real negative effects on the marching members and staff. 

If SCV, or Cadets, or SOA, or whomever is refusing to acknowledge their systemic issues, then THEY are the ones who have destroyed the reputation of the organization. THEY are the ones who brought this upon themselves, and THEY are the only parties responsible for their unwillingness or inability to get their houses in order. It is NOT the people who have been bringing up these issues quietly for years, only to be dismissed or ignored. It's NOT the people working to uncover and bring to light these issues, and it's NOT the people amplifying the message that a house cleaning is in order. 

The organizations being ripped apart, brought this on themselves, and they only have themselves to blame. Stop shooting the messenger. 

 

 

[Terri Schehr]

15 minutes ago, MarimbaManiac said:

So, you acknowledge that there are problems that need to be addressed, and in later posts acknowledge that other avenues for fixing those issues have been attempted, yet you complain when people trying to bring those issues to light?

Let's be clear about something. When there are systemic issues in an organization, and that organization is unwilling to even ACKNOWLEDGE them yet alone address them, there are two options. Let it be, or dig further and shine a spotlight. The problem, as you put it, is that for decades people were too comfortable with, or encouraged by others, to stay quiet and let things be. There was too much willingness to overlook clearly serious issues for "the health of the activity" or "out of respect for the organization." It bred a toxic environment where issues were allowed to fester, and whistleblowers were declared to be the problem because it was "too messy."

Frankly, the people who want change, but refuse to get their hands dirty, are the worst offenders of this story. They cry foul enough to make it seem like they're engaged and offended, but are actually more offended by the heavy handed processes that are required to force change in intransigent organizations. In my opinion, they are the ones who are doing the most damage to the activity, because they're too "grossed out" by the dirty work that they allow corruption and incompetence to continue, even when that results in very real negative effects on the marching members and staff. 

If SCV, or Cadets, or SOA, or whomever is refusing to acknowledge their systemic issues, then THEY are the ones who have destroyed the reputation of the organization. THEY are the ones who brought this upon themselves, and THEY are the only parties responsible for their unwillingness or inability to get their houses in order. It is NOT the people who have been bringing up these issues quietly for years, only to be dismissed or ignored. It's NOT the people working to uncover and bring to light these issues, and it's NOT the people amplifying the message that a house cleaning is in order. 

The organizations being ripped apart, brought this on themselves, and they only have themselves to blame. Stop shooting the messenger. 

 

 

You’re right but the thing is that when you stick your neck out there, you are sometimes harassed, ostracized, and threatened. Been there, done that.  Read the Tricia Nadolny articles. 

[MarimbaManiac]

3 minutes ago, Terri Schehr said:

You’re right but the thing is that when you stick your neck out there, you are sometimes harassed, ostracized, and threatened. Been there, done that.  Read the Tricia Nadolny articles. 

That's fine, usually the people making the most noise have the thickest skin. 

I just want to point out the issue with being "morally opposed" to something but balking at the practicality of forcing change is incredibly destructive.