ravedodger Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 When I marched, I heard that it was the Scouts that had broken a pressbox window sometime in the early '80's. I later learned that it was supposedly Spirit. Hmm...maybe in 10 years someone will be saying that it was the Renegades in 1997. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsar Nikk Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 ok, i just really wanna know something. my band director told me about as he put it, "An old drum corps wives tale" about how in 1991 (the year they won) Star of Indiana played so loud when they were warming up, that they put a crack in a window by where they were warming up. can anyone bring this to truth for me? thanks. Old Wives' Tale. Glass would have to vibrate at a certain frequency to crack, no matter how thin the glass. When glass cracks due to loud noises, it isn't really because of the strength of the volume, but rather the overtones (most of which are inaudible to the human ear with one exception: See below). Overtones that extend beyond a certain partial will crack crystal, which is very thin glass. I don't know how high an overtone would have to be in order to shatter a regular glass window, but I know that it wouldn't happen with a drum corps brassline, no matter how loud they played, even if they were 4 feet away from it, instead of the likely 20 yards away or so. The one exception I can think of is exceptionally strong soprano vocalists who can hit a very high C which has been known to vibrate crystal glasses. While I have seen this (and heard this and felt this) with my own eyes and ears, I have never personally seen a soprano voice shatter a glass crystal. I suppose that someone with a very loud and clear high C could do it if they were able to sustain the pitch long enough. but I really don't believe the human voice can shatter crystal. If someone can point me to some definitive proof, I would be delighted, but for now, I am going to say that no unamplified or unsynthesized sound is capable of breaking glass. Just not enough overtones. Just my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rookie@Spirt Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 (edited) Technically, wouldn't sound from a hornline be an amplified sound? Mouthpiece is the instrument, horn is the amplifier kinda thing. Edited April 20, 2004 by Rookie@Spirt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburstall Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 Let me add to that from an engineer pov (I never heard this story, BTW). Glass that is used in houses is a crystalized silicon but not at the same level as it is with wine crystal. Also house glass will have different things added to it like a sun filter, etc. This causes the glass to have different frequencies all around the window. So unless the corps had hit a single frequency with the sheer force of the sound, then a certain part, usually the weakest part, will crack. I highly doubt a corps hornline, no matter the volume, could have a high enough frequency, to even come close to shattering a window. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tristan Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 All that has to happen is there must be a sound loud enough that matches one of the resonant frequencies of the sheet of glass. Not all the frequencies are high--to hear for yourself, rap on a window with your knuckles--you'll hear a range of pitches, some of them are quite low--contra range. If the corps is playing a powerchord where all the notes in the chord are part of the harmonic series based on that pitch, it is conceivable that the glass may break. However, it seems unlikely that this would occur, especially in a stadium as the legend says, since glass that weak would surely be against building codes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevingamin Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 Old Wives' Tale.Glass would have to vibrate at a certain frequency to crack, no matter how thin the glass. When glass cracks due to loud noises, it isn't really because of the strength of the volume, but rather the overtones (most of which are inaudible to the human ear with one exception: See below). Overtones that extend beyond a certain partial will crack crystal, which is very thin glass. I don't know how high an overtone would have to be in order to shatter a regular glass window, but I know that it wouldn't happen with a drum corps brassline, no matter how loud they played, even if they were 4 feet away from it, instead of the likely 20 yards away or so. The one exception I can think of is exceptionally strong soprano vocalists who can hit a very high C which has been known to vibrate crystal glasses. While I have seen this (and heard this and felt this) with my own eyes and ears, I have never personally seen a soprano voice shatter a glass crystal. I suppose that someone with a very loud and clear high C could do it if they were able to sustain the pitch long enough. but I really don't believe the human voice can shatter crystal. If someone can point me to some definitive proof, I would be delighted, but for now, I am going to say that no unamplified or unsynthesized sound is capable of breaking glass. Just not enough overtones. Just my opinion. Somebody send this into Mythbusters so they can test it. ^0^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usmpiano Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 Glass would have to vibrate at a certain frequency to crack, no matter how thin the glass.When glass cracks due to loud noises, it isn't really because of the strength of the volume, but rather the overtones (most of which are inaudible to the human ear with one exception: See below). Overtones that extend beyond a certain partial will crack crystal, which is very thin glass. I don't know how high an overtone would have to be in order to shatter a regular glass window, but I know that it wouldn't happen with a drum corps brassline, no matter how loud they played, even if they were 4 feet away from it, instead of the likely 20 yards away or so. The one exception I can think of is exceptionally strong soprano vocalists who can hit a very high C which has been known to vibrate crystal glasses. While I have seen this (and heard this and felt this) with my own eyes and ears, I have never personally seen a soprano voice shatter a glass crystal. I suppose that someone with a very loud and clear high C could do it if they were able to sustain the pitch long enough. but I really don't believe the human voice can shatter crystal. If someone can point me to some definitive proof, I would be delighted, but for now, I am going to say that no unamplified or unsynthesized sound is capable of breaking glass. Just not enough overtones. Just my opinion. Great explanation Nikk...Saved me the time...:P I have personally seen it done with a High F (above the staff), and let me tell you it is a powerful experience. literally. I felt like my chest had been punched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsar Nikk Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 I have personally seen it done with a High F (above the staff), and let me tell you it is a powerful experience. literally. I felt like my chest had been punched. Personally seen glass crack? Or seen it vibrate? What was producing the high F? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsar Nikk Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 All that has to happen is there must be a sound loud enough that matches one of the resonant frequencies of the sheet of glass. Not all the frequencies are high--to hear for yourself, rap on a window with your knuckles--you'll hear a range of pitches, some of them are quite low--contra range. If the corps is playing a powerchord where all the notes in the chord are part of the harmonic series based on that pitch, it is conceivable that the glass may break. However, it seems unlikely that this would occur, especially in a stadium as the legend says, since glass that weak would surely be against building codes. In theory, you are correct, but here's the thing... Higher frequencies vibrate much MUCH faster than lower frequencies. So in order to really set up enough vibration that glass would break, they would have to be higher pitches. Also, there are such things as subsonic pitches, which i am sure could do some real damage...but I don't think it is possible for any unamplified instrument or group of instruments to make those subsonic noises loud enough to really do any sort of damage. Again...I am not an acoustician. I have studied acoustics and conducted small experiments with glass crystals, but I have no "field knowledge" with window-grade glass. I still find it very doubtful that any hornline, no matter how loud, no matter how in tune, would reach the necessary volume levels to produce the overtones required to shatter glass or crystal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerriDitt57 Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 And no one has woken up any dead warming up near cemeteries, either. I know because the RA warmed up near two of them last year, Woodstock and South Milwaukee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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