FreelancerAlumni Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Here is a paper by Peter Bond on this subject. +1 Hitting the like button. The rest is semantics... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumno5 Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) The bugle was originally intended and designed to be used as a military signaling instrument. It was deliberatly concieved to be loud so that it would be heard over the din of battle. Not so with trumpets. C'mon, don't kid yourself with that originally-designed-to-be-loud stuff, like some artist/scientific genius painstakingly worked out the formula: It doesn't look like a lot of intense thought was put into the design. And in any case, drum corps bugles as we know them, even the old G-D models, bear little resemblance to a "military signaling instrument." Peace, Fred O. Edited March 23, 2012 by drumno5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamarag Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 I was observing a band director who made sure his students had a tuner on their stands at all times. And said that it always have to be in the green. OMG it was so hard not to open my mouth. I did have a chat and asked him why after the class. He said that's what he was taught in college. I keep a tuner on my stand at all times, but I'm a tuba player :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreelancerAlumni Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) C'mon, don't kid yourself with that originally-designed-to-be-loud stuff, like some artist/scientific genius painstakingly worked out the formula: It doesn't look like a lot of intense thought was put into the design. And in any case, drum corps bugles as we know them, even the old G-D models, bear little resemblance to a "military signaling instrument." Peace, Fred O. No... Don't kid yourself ! From pre-history, man has endeavored to create instruments of all kinds. Some were successful, some not. Brass instruments are a fairly "new" concept. But even with that, from the ram's horn to today's modern designed instruments, most of the features have been an effort of trial and error. Even with all the modern day, "high tech" measuring and monitoring equipment we have, a lot of how a brass instruments works and why is still a bit of a mystery. There are several manufactures that are employing very sophisticated construction/measurement and test criteria developing and selling "State-of-the-art" instruments. And we still don't have the "perfect" instrument. Modern day Bugles (valved or not and other instruments, trumpets, coronets etc...) are nearly identical to those constructed during the Civil War, and earlier! Oh, and the horn in the picture would have been used for ceremonial use. Military funerals etc... It looks to be short on the tubing (hard to tell though) but is probably a Bb Bugle. Most of the "Flugelhorn" shaped Bugles I've seen were Bb. Some were made from Copper and are actually quite beautiful looking and playing ! Edited March 23, 2012 by FreelancerAlumni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumno5 Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) Oh, and the horn in the picture would have been used for ceremonial use. Military funerals etc... No, it was offered for sale at an auction in 2009. Description rom the Phillip Weiss Auctions website: "The actual bugle that was used to alert American troops at Pearl Harbor in 1941 will be sold on May 9." Fred O. Edited November 29, 2012 by drumno5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mello Dude Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 I was observing a band director who made sure his students had a tuner on their stands at all times. And said that it always have to be in the green. OMG it was so hard not to open my mouth. I did have a chat and asked him why after the class. He said that's what he was taught in college. Ya, those little things like tuning the 3rd of a triad goes right out the window. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickhaltsforlife Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 I feel like it's good to have a tuner nearby... but some people rely on them way too much. Learn to use your ears. And as an educator we have to help develop those ears. Practice with a tuner. Work on your aural skills. Singing warm-up chorals as a band is great. Maybe tune chords by singing then playing. If you can sing it, that means you can hear it which means you can play it (yes by doing all of the technical things needs to play your instrument correctly also). Some of the best horn lines sound amazing when they sing. I feel like I'm preaching to the choir though.... But I digress... I could go on forever about this topic. And could go really in depth. But it has nothing to do with the G bugle being a bugle or not. Just for fun I would like to hear Crown play on Gs for a year just to hear. They could possibly be the best line on Bbs and have been the most consistent year to year since 06/07. So let them have Gs for a year, and see how it goes. Will it make a difference? Still has nothing to do with a g horn being a bugle or not, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Yeah, but did they ever tell you what to listen for? Or how to make corrections? LOL, picturing being asking "Are you listening" and replying "Yeah... it sucks, now what JP Sousa?". Would have been interesting to compare the difference when we upgraded to a more corps savvy horn staff (Ray Eyler, others) but was away at college too much to tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 (edited) Yeah, but did they ever tell you what to listen for? Or how to make corrections? Nowadays, these same geniuses just say "use your tuner" and think their job is done. After thinking about it... hey it takes a while for 30+ year memories to come up.. What we were told to listen to was blending volume (OK dynamics for you musical types) and not losing the tone by overblowing. Can't remember a thing about listening for being in tune while we play during 74-79. In 84-85 horn instructor started working having us be able to tune ourselves but we had other problems to work on. Not to mention the number of untrained ears that never had any... well training... Ended up tuning to each other right before (or maybe not right before) we went out and that was it. Be interested to hear how this is handled back then or how it is handled now.... Maybe a new thread.. Edited March 24, 2012 by JimF-LowBari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piper Posted March 24, 2012 Share Posted March 24, 2012 After thinking about it... hey it takes a while for 30+ year memories to come up.. What we were told to listen to was blending volume (OK dynamics for you musical types) and not losing the tone by overblowing. Can't remember a thing about listening for being in tune while we play during 74-79. In 84-85 horn instructor started working having us be able to tune ourselves but we had other problems to work on. Not to mention the number of untrained ears that never had any... well training... Ended up tuning to each other right before (or maybe not right before) we went out and that was it. Be interested to hear how this is handled back then or how it is handled now.... Maybe a new thread.. Oh boy does that bring back memories! We had a brass intructor one time, who's name is still well known in Drum Corps circles, and we had a bad habit of getting hit for "overblowing". He would say "Yeah yeah we've gotta do something about that" then two minutes later he would scream "PLAY THOSE ******* HORNS!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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