DCI should discourage movement between corps

[mybugsyisblue]

mabye a bit off topic, but i think it would be cool if they had some sort of joint audition. All applicants for 5 or 6 corps in one area could gather at the same time to one area. Staff from each corps could evaluate applicants and chose them for a corps based on their abilites and style. There should be representatives from all divisions and all placement levels. Then everyone who wants a spot will probably get one with out having to waste money on traveling and trying to find another corps if their first doesn't pan out. It would be a logistical head ache, but it's a thought.

I'm sure what I envisioned upon reading this was nothing along the lines of what thenextone intended, but I immediately had a vision of an American Idol-like atmosphere. those wishing to audition coming before a panel of judges. I'm not sure who would be on that judging panel, but I know it would have to include Hopkins.

sorry to meander from true topic.....

As the parent of a marching member, who has as some would call it "chased a ring", I don't think that you will ever completely change the way that drum corps are built by controlling the membership or the selection of members. There is a feeder system in the activity, as there is in other great american institutions like baseball, golf, Nascar. This feeder system unfortunately means that some corps will represent the top of the pyramid and others will have to be the support beneath them. My daughter dreamed from the first time she saw them perform to march with the Canton Bluecoats. Her first show was in 2002(?), and at the age of 12 years she probably wasn't putting a whole lot of sound reasoning behind her desire. Surely she must have enjoyed the show, maybe the fact that they were in our proverbial backyard was appealing to her As time would pass and she became more exposed to the activity, she came to realize that the average age for your DIV 1 corps was not allowing for many 14 year old marchers. She knew if she was to be a member of the Bluecoats that she would have to polish her skills and develop her talents........Too Long........Cut to the chase............Allaina, at the age of 14 was able to march her Div 1 dream by going to Capital Regiment in 2003. She became immersed in the activity, and has since been able to fufill her dream to take the field as a Bluecoat. Capital Regiment served her well as a proving ground. They developed her love of the activity, they taught her that all would not be rosy. She knows that struggle and discomfort are not things that you walk away from, you have to face them and they temper the metal that you are made of. With those lesson learned, only then was she ready to be a Bluecoat, or a Blue Devil, a Cadet, or a Cavie (well maybe not a Cavie).

To summarize: Movement between corps is a neccessary and important part of the activity. It serves to develop the young leaders that will serve as technicians, educators, and adjudicators in this actvity in the coming decades, by exposing them to various management and teaching styles. Partnerships between corps need to be encouraged that would allow auditioning members who come up a little short to be referred to "feeder" corps to develop and grow. It is a shame for talented youths to be performing in "B" corps and not bettering the programs the likes of Cascades, and Esperanza, and (insert struggling corps name here).

Let me leave you with this......STOP vilifying this movement from one corps to another, there is often more to it than a ring!................(meant as a general statement not directed at any DCP participant in particular)

Scott

exasperated, steps from his soapbox and walks to the refrigerator for a beer.

[mybugsyisblue]

I'm sure what I envisioned upon reading this was nothing along the lines of what thenextone intended, but I immediately had a vision of an American Idol-like atmosphere. those wishing to audition coming before a panel of judges. I'm not sure who would be on that judging panel, but I know it would have to include Hopkins.

Hopkins says:

........."applicant #316, would you mind if I could see you in this white rabbit outfit?"

........."it's a great routine #411, would you please try it wearing this red negligee?"

sorry........

[Casaba]

Nice response...btw..I would not consider a move from a small div 2 or even very low div 1 to the corps of a persons dreams "ring chasing" However going from the cavies, BD,cadets, etc may be a different story, sorry if my original post implyed that

enjoy the beer, for the record, i'm in your shoes, my 14 yr old just happened to only try out for his dream corps with Crown so no need to jump around :)

[Kansasfan]

Well, my idea got about the reaction that I expected. :)

And my underlying thought still remains that I think it would be good for the activity as a whole if there was a more realistic chance that a corps other than the established big five/six had the opportunity to compete for a top finish. I applaud all of those who chase their goals and if that means changing corps, great!

There will always be feeder corps, that is the nature of the beast - I am simply trying to see if anyone else believes that maybe it shouldn't always be the same corps that are feeders. There was an interesting thread a couple of weeks ago that pointed to a trend that corps that seldom/never made finals tended to go out of existence. Many factors make a corps go inactive, but long-term competitiveness is certainly one of them.

[PeeWee]

During my drum corps career I moved "up" and you know what, I'm very grateful to have had the opportunity to do so.

1988 VK was a lot of fun, but I fell in love with SCV way back in 1986 and always dreamed of marching there. By '88, I felt like I was pulling many of those around me up. I wanted to do better, and knew we could. But many of them didn't care. And so, during my age-out year, I decided to try-out for a corps that would push me instead of me pulling them. Best thing I ever did! And if I'd known better, I would have auditioned for SCV in 1987 instead of waiting for my age-out year, but SCV intimidated the heck out of me!

But there were plenty of people who aged-out in VK as well.

Edited August 6, 2006 by PeeWee

[Kimberly]

Partnerships between corps need to be encouraged that would allow auditioning members who come up a little short to be referred to "feeder" corps to develop and grow. It is a shame for talented youths to be performing in "B" corps and not bettering the programs the likes of Cascades, and Esperanza, and (insert struggling corps name here).

I doubt that those who choose to be affiliated with a lower placing corps think of themselves as a "feeder corps." Each corps has its own traditions, history, AND its own sense of self. The only corps who probably see themselves as "feeder" are probably the only 2 B or Cadet corps that I know of, BD's and SCV's.

Let kids march where they want to. If a kid wants to march BDB, let them! It's not our place to direct them to Cascades or Esperanza, or the Troopers, or anywhere else--this isn't about how to better any other corps, it's about personal choice.

One major problem with the "feeder corps" scenario is something I saw firsthand 20 years ago. We had a couple of people who marched with us and were bad... they couldn't march, couldn't play, were immature, had a bad attitude... and we had to pull them along all summer long. Instead of returning to be a productive, contributing member the next summer, they jumped to a higher placing corps, and one even won a ring that next summer! Not cool - especially since most of us were marching right where we wanted to be.

Edited August 6, 2006 by Kimberly

[Dave]

A "salary cap" on staff would go much farther if corps equity is your goal. Maybe even budget caps? It would force corps to work withn similiar budgets, and stop the arms race of the big boys.

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.........

Sorry to take so long to get to typing. I was busy rolling on the floor laughing at the notion of "high-priced staff" pulling down big bucks doing drum corps. Not even the vaunted design staff makes that much compared to how much time, effort and energy they put into the shows they're doing. NOBODY does drum corps for the money; that's why they all teach marching bands and such during the off-season, and have other jobs; like the rest of us, they do drum corps because they love the activity. Some sort of "salary cap" would simply drain the already shallow pool of people willing to sacrifice huge chunks of time and energy (and in the case of touring staff, money) to create and teach corps shows.

[Morgoth Bauglir]

I am all for more competition between corps. But not if it means any more expense or hardship for the members. Period.

And who is to say that one person's reasons for wanting to march are less valid than another's? Who are any of us to tell some kid that his dreams of winning a championship are less noble or worthwhile? Everyone marches for their own reasons. And it costs each member A LOT. Not just money for tour fees, and air-fare, but for missing out on summer as well. For leaving home for 3 months, postponing college. Passing up jobs and opportunities to be with friends. It's hard work, and the payoff is different for each members. So what if some choose to march with the goal of winning. That is their choice to make, not ours.

And let's not forget, WE caused this problem in the first place. Every time we download a Cavies APD, but not a Spirit or Glassmen once. Every time we show up late to a show, or spend the first part of the evening in the lot watching the top corps warm up while the smaller corps are performing. Every seat that is filled at Finals but empty at 1pm during Quarters. Every "Top" list on DCP that is filled with Cavie, Cadet and BD shows, but have very few Cascades or Magic shows.

Every time something like those things happen, we cause this problem to be greater. We hold the top corps up so high and give them endless praise, but can't be bothered to even be in the stadium for the corps that don't get to play under the lights.

So instead of whining about parity and about forcing the members to solve our problems, how about you go buy some Troopers merchandise, or maybe show up to the stadium when it's still light out. Give the kids in the lower corps a reason to stay. Not a reason to leave.

[drumcat]

I wish this could happen, but unfortunately, kids pay for the experience. If corps offered kids the opportunity to play for free, and maybe even a stipend, and then some boosters slip some money to the soloists under the table, corrupt the DCI staff a little, and then make sure that corps "self-report" any infractions....

Then you have an NCAA model where that could work. Unfortunately, competitive balance can't be achieved through restricting corps spending or membership. What can happen is that DCI moves toward judging more things that don't cost money (i.e. less GE, more music), and you'll see more movement. Emphasize on-the-night calls by the green shirts, and you'll see more movement. There are some other things, too, but it has to be more related to focusing on "the game" of drum corps rather than money. Because the one thing that team sports have an advantage with, is that when they start the game, there's a ball, some rules, and the score is 0-0. Hopefully we do more towards that. I'm not suggesting a "tick", but there are other methods that aren't related to signing restrictions.

Bravo for the thought, however.

[up4479]

The local Boston area circuts had this type of system. You had to obtain a release from the unit you were marching with in order to march with another unit. I lived under this system for over a decade. Most kids left for social reasons but others left due to the instability of the units they were with. (poor management, loss of sponsorship, poor or unstable staffing, etc) It resulted in a lot of unhappy kids not marching because of, IMO, self centered management not granting releases. The kids in that case had to sit out a year before joining another unit. Most that chose that path never marched again. It only created a new problem and never resolved competitive issues. IMO, the solutions to these problems are elusive and profound otherwise after dedades of trying to come up with answers, somewhat effective soulutions would already be in place.