WWonka Posted October 13, 2006 Share Posted October 13, 2006 If the bottom # of corps aren't there, it doesn't mean that the whole of DCI will get worse. Huh? It doesn't mean that the top of DCI would get worse but how could it not mean the whole would be worse? Does not existing qualify as being better off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martybucs Posted October 13, 2006 Share Posted October 13, 2006 Hate to tell you this...but w/o DCI forming the junior corps arena would be gone by now, IMO. Veteran groups, the church, and PAL all were abandoning drum corps before DCI came along...even for the little corps that made up the builk of the activity. That is simply not true. DCI created an environment which, financially, made it impossible for those organizations to continue with their drum corps programs. Imagine the corps director of the local CYO or VFW telling the orginization that they need a half a million dollars, ( in say, 1974), to compete, when in previous years 20 thousand or less, would have done the job. There are, indeed, many more reasons for the state of drum corps today. I do not think DCI is evil. I think the kids in DCI corps are great. Every bit as great as any generation past. However, DCI created the subculture of Div II and III and those corps simply don't get the respect they deserve and who wants to belong to a group like that? Many do and do a great job, but they are snubbed by the "great ones" that occupy Div I. "In the old days", there were the top corps that kicked ### every weekend, but we were all in the same soup. There were different classes, but almost everyone, if they went to nationals went to compete against the top guns. You knew you were gonna kick your butt kicked, (you hoped you wouldn't), but you wanted to see how well you would do. The way DCI is set up favors the big budget and DCI running drum corps, (sort of like the UN), the little guys don't really count and so over time the DCI system eliminated those smaller corps or relegated them to diminished status in Div II or III. This is of course, my opinion, and of course, once again we disagree on the same subject. The death of drum corps is close at hand and I, for one, don't blame the VFW or CYO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmom Posted October 13, 2006 Share Posted October 13, 2006 If the bottom # of corps aren't there, it doesn't mean that the whole of DCI will get worse. You may have misinterpreted what I said. My point was that if corps 19-23 were somehow eliminated, then corps 14-18 would now be the bottom 5 corps. Has nothing to do with the quality of the performances. By the way, some of the most crowd pleasing performances were by those lower down the scale. My only point was that these kids get little respect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumcat Posted October 13, 2006 Share Posted October 13, 2006 Huh? It doesn't mean that the top of DCI would get worse but how could it not mean the whole would be worse? Does not existing qualify as being better off? That's not what I meant. The argument was that the "middle" corps would be the bottom corps if the last few were gone. That's true, but it wouldn't necessarily mean the "new bottom" was somehow performing at a lower level - there's no correlation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hup234 Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 That is simply not true. DCI created an environment which, financially, made it impossible for those organizations to continue with their drum corps programs. <snip>The death of drum corps is close at hand and I, for one, don't blame the VFW or CYO. Agreed, Mb. The continuous reality-denial we read throughout this forum is spectacular. The VFW and CYO influence in D&BC ended when Nixon was president 35 years ago. Still we see finger-pointing at the leaders of that day for the worsening situation of today, and that's not unlike all the people today who blame their parents/teachers/classmates for the failures in their adult life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hup234 Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 Well...there are also a bunch of D2/3 corps that have aspirations of moving up into the D1 class someday. How would "leaving" DCI and forming their own circuit support their long-range plans?M Isn't that exactly how and why the Combine/DCI started? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hup234 Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 The Div II/III corps have their own committee w/in DCI to make their own decisions...how their champs week will look is one item in theri control.Would members even WANT to belong to these corps if they were no longer part of DCI? Excellent question, Mike. I'll bet all the AL, VFW and CYO corps asked that very same question about their then-current affiliations at the founding of DCI 35 years ago. You realize, of course, you've made my point that the managers/directors of the Golden Age corps were made of some mighty tough stuff, willing to take chances at changing what they didn't like, unlike the gutless wonders of today who refuse to take control of their own destinies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tone Quality Matters Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 The way DCI is set up favors the big budget and DCI running drum corps, (sort of like the UN), the little guys don't really count and so over time the DCI system eliminated those smaller corps or relegated them to diminished status in Div II or III. You shouldn't compare DCI to the UN. DCI actually has a track record of success. That would be a topic for another forum though. DCI's Div. II and III are very relevent and their shows are in many cases, more enjoyable than some of the Div. I stuff IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drillwatcher Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 Capital Regiment Magic Kiwanis Kavaliers Esperanza ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 Excellent question, Mike. I'll bet all the AL, VFW and CYO corps asked that very same question about their then-current affiliations at the founding of DCI 35 years ago. You realize, of course, you've made my point that the managers/directors of the Golden Age corps were made of some mighty tough stuff, willing to take chances at changing what they didn't like, unlike the gutless wonders of today who refuse to take control of their own destinies. Not sure how you get that...div II/III directors do control a lot of the things that impact them through their own committee. One difference 35 years ago is that DCI was formed by the top corps...not the smaller less known ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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