ZealJ03

They could freaking score 12th and still steal attention away from a championship corps or bigger story.

Goood dam nit It's always about the Cadets, ever since freakin '83, non stop, every freakin year.

lol

You have to be a contender, like real contender. Examples: 2004 - Blue Devils or Cavaliers 2005 - Cadets and Cavaliers 2006 - Cavaliers or Blue Devils or Phantom 2007 - Blue Devils or Cadets 2008 - Blue Devils, Cavaliers, or Phantom

It's money-making scores for DCI. I firmly believed that it was just a play on numbers to get talk happening. I still think Phantom should have won, but comon... 0.025 finals night coming in from a seeded 4th place on Quarters. Seems a little suspicious. The number they won by was suspicious as well. Then again Phantom does have its luck with last minute scores. Phantom as a perennial fan pleaser is bound to create drama if they win by a litttttle bit. Merchandise flying off the hooks, DCP flooding out, praise be to the judge gods, people staring at www.dci.org's recaps for 3 weeks, people preaching heavenly things for the corps itself. 1996 Over Cadets, tying with BD finals night 2003 Over Santa Clara by 0.05 finals night (smallest margin there) 2005 Over Blue Devils (not really finals night but up to quarterfinals) 2006 Over Blue Devils finals night 2008 Over Blue Devils finals night

1990-1993 Blue Devils - Phenomenal music, but the visual program was so far behind in terms of creativity to what Cadets, Star, SCV, and the Cavaliers were putting out, that it really almost took away from the show 1994 Cadets - West Side Story with a Medea perspective does not happen for me. I'm very glad they didn't take the 1983 approach 1996 Cadets - Love the music, some of the best, overall show just... wasn't there for me 1997 Cavaliers - Maybe cus it wasn't their style... 1997 Blue Devils - Clean, performed great, besides A Night in Tunisia, I think the rest of the program was just flat. 2002 Cadets - Great music, but it was so poorly performed for me finals night, it just looked like a disaster everywhere. I can't get the blow ups out my head when I think about the show 2005 Blue Devils - Great Corps, getting a feel for the theme? Not there 2006 Cadets - Great music, great drill, good moments, baaad continuity. 2007 Cavaliers - It was cute, but the program just lacked a vibe 2008 Carolina Crown- I loved it for a while. I don't know but the concept was not starkly expressed, it just ended up being 3 tunes that was over shadowed by corps that played, moved, and expressed it better. Oh yeah... 2007 Blue Devils - Apart from the phenomenal opener, I still don't know how this corps racked up GE. I don't know what the show's even really about. It was followed by a chord progression ballad and an incredibly lackluster closer. I don't know how they won, I don't even think they marched, played, or spun anything incredibly challenging or executed it well. I'm kind of baffled that they won.

Here's how I see it, they all lead to great things The Cavaliers use visuals to carry their programs forward Blue Devils use music to carry their programs forward Phantom Regiment uses music to carry their programs forward The Cadets do both. Santa Clara Vanguard have been using more visual Crazy drill just doesn't seem to be in Phantom's blood. They're phenomenal without the Gaines, Sacktig, Weber/Rosander approaches. I think it'd look awkward to see them do insane pass-throughs and diamond cutters. They're more about majesty and a subliminal expression. I doubt Hi-Cam is their most watched angle on the DVDs.

Hate'em or Love'em. They can march, they can play, at extreme levels simultaneously. That ending to that show has still blown me out of the water when I watch that clip. This is why the Cadets probably are probably known for their work ethic. Boy for that kind of visual and musical responsibility for a full minute and half at 200+ bpms, it's pretty easy to understand why they have to rep the heck out of that chunk. Just think, they were flying and playing already for 10 minutes before. Astounding absolutely astounding displays of musical athleticism. Some guards and drumlines do their work while holding, but the Cadets just haul, every member (except the pit). That last minute and half is something no Drum Corps dares to do. I don't know of any 5th place corps that can stand out of the rest like that. Simply, that's just impressive.

Crown aims for the fans. They just need to play typical drum corps songs with long loud chords. I don't think design sophistication is their goal in any year that I've seen them. I think whatever they do in their realm won't be hard to pull off. I wouldn't expect Crown to do shows (at least the direction they've been going) like Medea, Frameworks, The Zone, or Constantly Risking Absurdity.

wrong thread

I didn't think this would even be a surprise considering Colin and Ian have been running Cadets' rehearsals way more than Tom and Neil for the last 2 years.

Best Opener: Blue Devils Best Ballad: Crown Best Closer: Cadets for Vesuvius, like I'll say over and over again: what a phenomenal last 1:30. Best Soloist: Phantom Regiment Best Marching: Cadets Best Guard: Blue Devils

Try running to 1993 Cadets 2001 Cavaliers 2003 Santa Clara Vanguard 2005 Cadets 2006 Phantom Regiment 2007 Cadets

So I was up very late tonight looking through my friends facebook to find a great clip of the 2008 Cadets final 1:30 of their show. I went to finals and saw all the shows and I certainly remember the Cadets not to be my favorite. Somehow I kept repeating this clip over for ages. However, I couldn't help but let my jaw drop at the final push of their show. The closer itself was fast. but it just got faster and faster, the hornline was playing every second of these inhuman tempos and dashing across the field. Rotating diamonds, massive step sizes, fortissimo volume levels, ridiculous pass-throughs, blind drill moves that would make heads spin, amazing runs under these long sustains. The drumline is just hauling as they play insane licks. There is no colorguard that spins and runs that much distance at the same time. I get it, there are great pushes to the end. Majestic half times and silent suspenseful visuals and theatrical captivation. But in all of Drum Corps, there is certainly no push to the end like The Cadets. Every year, as if their shows weren't hard enough, the last minute always seems to be the pinnacle of enduring amazement. The horns don't come down, the drums don't stop, the feet never halt, the flags never cease. Every year, The Cadets end their show with the most demanding minute of any drum corps member. What amazes me the most is that this corps will march play and spin some of the most ridiculous visual highlights at insane tempos. I feel like so many corps resort to majestic half-time play loud endings or silent visual (with only percussion playing) based moments. No one seems to try to push the limits in terms of both visual and music demands, not to the max, but to the extreme. --Honorable Cadet Endings that blow me out of the water-- 1990 Cadets 1993 Cadets 1997 Cadets 1998 Cadets 2000 Cadets - WOW 2001 Cadets 2005 Cadets 2007 Cadets - WOW 2008 Cadets - O-O holy smokes

2008 was definitely very clean compared to 2007, 2005, 2003

You just have to sit in front of that hornline for that opening hit. The earth did shake. Easily the most angry hornline of 2000s.

My heart has really changed for the Cadets. Regardless of the controversy, they've still got the most notes, craziest tempos, overall demand, and as of late, incredible performance. 2007 Cadets - Narration or not, it was demanding, face-peeling loud, and holy-wow fast. What I would do to sit in front of their company fronts charging at me like that... Even if you hated the show, this corps was a brutal monster. I would be terrified to warm up next to them. You know it you've all been there... 2006 Cadets - Again, the controversy made me hate it in the beginning, but in the end it was quite a horn book and a phenomenal ballad 2005 Cadets - It was just odd. I didn't understand it. In the end, this show really just opened my eyes to the Cadets. Possibly the most avant-garde design I've seen. This show really pushed the envelope Other honorable mentions: 2006 Phantom Regiment - Didn't care for it at all, probably because I saw them early season. The show looked very average with a boring visual design. However, it grew on me quite quickly. The performance really did it in for me. 1999 Santa Clara Vanguard - Never really developed for me. I didn't like it because of the dirty visuals, both drill and guard. In the end, I got to hand it to them for a solid performance. 1998 Cadets - Again the show was odd, it wasn't loud, it was fast, but i felt it was really slowly developed. But comparing the feet of these guys to any other corps, it's pretty phenomenal. ----The opposite "Loved it and then didn't care much for"------ 2002 Cavaliers - Was my favorite show for a long long time. Eventually, I lost the hair tingling excitement from watching it 2003 Phantom Regiment - I began to find that the brass book outdid the performance of the brass line 2004 Cadets - I was jammin to this all summer long. I was left with a very stale visual program 2005 Phantom Regiment - Great performance awesome concept. Once I got it on DVD, I was much less impressed 2000 Cavaliers - Great show, but watching it back to back with the Cadets, I still don't think it was as good by natural comparisons.

Ha. It's still a choice.

HA I should write this one down.

I don't know about repetition in a top 6 Drum Corps. You don't see anyone trying to repeat 1987 Garfield Company front or 1989 SCV magic trick. Well 2006 Phantom Regiment had a moment where the hornline was jazz running and playing. Okay by definition it's innovative, cus "it's new". Going with that mentality, The Cavaliers playing Billy Joel can be considered innovative. However, does it mean, that it's innovative. Will these 18 seconds really turn some heads of not only audience members but also the designers for the other corps. Yes there's a definition to the word innovation, but there's also a very important value attached on to the word. 1993 Star, I don't even need to go there in terms of innovation. Look at the series of shows influenced by that design. 1993 Cadets, same thing, no one's gone faster than them, not to mention decide to play as much as they were running around at those tempos. Ask for a show about speed, it'll probably show up on the list by many people who watch drum corps often. So does 18 seconds of everyone jazz running innovate the road of Drum Corps. I don't really think so, especially when those 18 seconds aren't dispersed with every member jazz running. (Let alone have good foot timing). It looked cool, but I don't think it's anything that the others in the top 12 are going to be groveling to experiment in their 2008 and beyond productions.

:blink:

That was NOT 200 bpms. That was more like the 176-186 range. Which, I'll add is a severe difference. And that motion was only one drill move. If it's anything for marching fast (ground breaking fast, as in no one goes faster) and sounding good I'd check out 1993, 2001 Cadets, possibly even 2007 Cadets if you like that Gino aggression. Also check out 2001 and 2004 Cavaliers. It wasn't that the overall show sounded bad, just the end of it. It's just they sounded one way most of the show, and then sounded another way towards the end which makes it seem like they weren't playing with same sound. It's just a logic to it. If they started edgy and kept edge all the way to the end, no one would probably complain as much. I mean there was a flam at the end. A pretty great one. Those mellophone had a lot of rips in there with those runs.

So I've been looking through the Cavalier videos lately. I couldn't help but notice, in my opinion, how mundane the design is in the last minute of the show. Out of the top 6, especially considering The Cadets and Phantom Regiment, The Cavaliers have some of the most weak endings that I've seen. They seem like an end of a song almost. Their loud chords at the end just don't seem to cut it as much as the other corps. The last minute or two is almost unmemorable musically and surprisingly visually. There's almost an absence of that "final push", that definitive end. A lot of times, I feel like their endings seem like a close to a song but not a show. Anyone else share this?

I am absolutely blown away by Phantom musically every year. I think it's great. But I have to absolutely agree with you. I just don't know about their mellophones last year. I feel like they're trying to side with a more Cadet, run-heavy, approach but they sound almost like car horns when the play. So, it becomes so easy to stick out for these guys. Removing myself from it, the mellophone line wasn't moving much and it was just a sustain. I don't think it was anything difficulty groundbreaking. Designwise, yes I'd say it was exciting, but nothing any other corps can do better. After hearing it, it just sounded kinda bad...

The Cadets -Hornline- I don't think any corps has as many notes as these guys lately. Next to posthumous Star, no mellophone section comes close. Stuff like 1997 and 2001 were some absolutely phenomenal efforts in putting possibly the most moving lines in brassbook history. With the addition of Gino Cipriani, these guys have had an undeniable voice in attitude. In addition to the visual demands, I've never seen a hornline that has them play as crazy parts while moving at that rate. -Percussion: Absolutely fantastic. If it's any drumline that moves and plays simultaneously as much as these guys do, I'll be impressed. 2007 Cadets, absolutely phenomenal in terms of movement, they are cooking durings these drum breaks. All those pinwheels and direction changes at top notch tempos. Amazing and so clean. The Cadets also enjoy an amazingly well written pit book. 2005 had some absolutely phenomenal stuff. -Color Guard - These kids book it across the field. This guard never ever stands still as they spin some ridiculous stuff. See 2005 Cadets for the most beautifully arranged books out there. -Drill: These guys probably come in 3rd to SCV and The Cavaliers in terms of design, but I think they reign in terms of demand. Like I said over and over again, they don't stop moving at all. There's probably no corps that tests the waters out with fast tempos as much as these guys. If you ever notice, Drum break material for this corps has been the best. While the drumline is playing, the hornline is doing some ridiculous drill. Other corps seem to stand around and do some body movements or lax drill, or even just hide behind props. But no, The Cadets put up some fireworks during their drumbreaks. Certainly admirable on my part. The final minute of any Cadet show has blown me away with the dril and musicl writing. These kids are absolutely booking it. There's probably no corps that comes up with more exciting endings out there. Consistently, these ending minutes have been mind blowing movements for physical and mental demands.