When it's time to walk away-

[Sexyguardcap]

When DCP becomes so much like RAMD you can't tell the difference.

[bishtom]

When DCP becomes so much like RAMD you can't tell the difference.

...or a DCI event...

[silvertrombone]

Mmm...mmm...mmm.

We need to work on how we speak to each other around here. Me, too.

OP. You will miss that first hit from BD so bad it will hurt. And neither the big screen nor the TV will be the same. The activity has changed from when we marched. It has gotten better in some ways, others, some would differ.

Guys, here's my take on the whole thing--again. The competition is absolutely incredible, as we have all discussed elsewhere. This drives everybody. If the Top 3 next are not the top 3, replaced by Bluecoats, Crown and Phantom, things will change the next year, etc. Meaning, if Blooo, Crown, and PR bring incredibly good, competitive, and more entertaining shows, and place higher, you can be danged sure the Big 3 will take note. There's a reason those three corps have so many championships--they WANT to win. Who doesn't?

If they do some esoteric, blah, crap and get slammed in the standings, they will change. If entertainment value (Crown, anybody?) takes over the activity, we're in for a treat! Because unless you're on crack, I think everybody here will admit that talent and performance level right now are at their highest levels ever.

Including the 70's, so don't even try that.

Add up stellar quality with supremely entertaining and we're about to have a really, really incredible activity.

400 corps growth? No. But the 40-some that we do have will be absolutely amazing. And "elite" will be the entire top 12. And semifinalist status will be a great achievement. Hmm. Kind of like this year.

The Big 3 have many quality corps nipping at their heels. That makes for a very unique situation. Enjoy. Don't go away, OP! You'll wish you hadn't, and the rest of us will have to track you down and drag you back, and that can hurt--my back if not yours! :P So don't make me do it!

Hang in there guys. I took a long break, but what I came back to has dumbfounded me. It looks like we're heading down a pretty interesting road, and none of you wants to miss out on what lies ahead!

[silvertrombone]

I happen to be one who knows a lot of people who have chosen to remain involved.

Yeah, no kidding! So what does that make all of us around here?? We're always talking about who we volunteer/ed with, what shows we're going to, souvenir merchandise--geez, even who we support with sponsorships! We as in the DCP community. If anything, we're seeing more people (young people) getting involved online as they age-out--heck, even before they march! How many people on here are teens that are in love with DC and have not marched yet?

We're growing, folks. And so is the activity, in some ways. What were the broadcast numbers on PBS? I'll bet we top a million next month for the Deuce broadcast--wow! Cinecasts aren't exactly attended by active alumni, now are they?

daniel is right--there needs to be an organized way of coordinating the 21/22 change. When you age out, DCA should be right there to introduce themselves and at least say, "Come check us out when you graduate." The stronger the entire activity, the better. If you have four junior corps and four senior corps at every show nationally in 5 years, then you have a heckuva lot more people involved as performers than right now. Those are performers with friends, family, co-workers, neighbors, community acquaintances, fellow church/synagogue-goer's, etc. Those are potential fans, guys.

Oh, and do we need, as adults, to increase our physical activity? Burn off some extra pounds? Tone up that heart a bit to avoid nasty heart problems later in life? Duh--yes! And applause is always a good thing for the human spirit--let's us know that what we are doing is appreciated and desired by other human beings.

Good little tangent there...

[drumcat]

We all get burned out for a while. I had mine, twice. It happens, and you'll probably be back. It's normal.

[danielray]

DCI and the corps souvie booths, fundraising campaigns should do some research on which demographic is spending more money. When people purchase tickets or buy a souvie they can ask for the person's age on a voluntary basis. It'd be interesting to see who is spending their money on what and how much. I know for the last 15+ years I've been going to championships, it's mostly older folks sitting between the 40's and those tickets are not cheap. They're also the ones I tend to see with the most bags of corps merchandise. I think DCI still needs to pay attention to that. The kids I see at shows do have money to spend, but they're mostly spending it on nachos. You'll see the occasional bag or purchasing of drumsticks, but rarely higher priced items like sweatshirts, DVD's, etc. There are definitely more kids in the stands, but is their purchasing power stronger than the 30+ crowd?

I used to work in the booth selling souvies for a couple of corps. I could give you a rough, unscientific, breakdown of the demographics... who is buying what where.

Shows like Allentown and other big east coast shows draw a lot of older fans that purchase things like sweatshirts and more classic stuff. The shows with a lot of band kids actually have a higher turnover, as they are buying up loads of t-shirts and smaller items.

The older segment 45-50+ are pretty solid customers, they buy higher-priced stuff. Between 30-45 like to hang around and talk a lot, but don't usually buy too much. Band kids buy a lot of stuff.

A few things people don't consider...

Kids pay in cash, only. Older fans tend to pay more often with credit card or check, and use these to purchase higher priced (not necessarily higher margin) items.

Because the credit cards are run manually, the fees are higher (about 5%) and there is no way to 'clear' the transaction. Since these are generally for larger purchases, not small, this creates a scenario where it is large transactions that end up of chargebacks, which eat into the margins. Bad checks are the same. There are transactions that go uncollected. Again, eating into a solid percentage of the margins for the older fans, but not for youth.

I know this from sitting on the phone calling in the transactions after each show... and having to write down decline or invalid card on the slip.

The higher-priced items don't make up such a large part of the profits, as the volume is much lower, the margins aren't that great and, as I mentioned before, the profits are eroded by chargebacks and bad checks.

If I were to do this again... I would kill the high-priced items... and try to pump the volume of t-shirts and cheap sweat shirts to the youth segment. That's where the money really is.

Edited August 27, 2007 by danielray

[audiodb]

My take - you priced the bigger items too low, so they aren't profitable. Instead of fixing the problem, you'd rather discard the product lines (and the demographic that buys them).

[ScribeToo]

A few things people don't consider...

Kids pay in cash, only. Older fans tend to pay more often with credit card or check, and use these to purchase higher priced (not necessarily higher margin) items.

Because the credit cards are run manually, the fees are higher (about 5%) and there is no way to 'clear' the transaction. Since these are generally for larger purchases, not small, this creates a scenario where it is large transactions that end up of chargebacks, which eat into the margins. Bad checks are the same. There are transactions that go uncollected. Again, eating into a solid percentage of the margins for the older fans, but not for youth.

I know this from sitting on the phone calling in the transactions after each show... and having to write down decline or invalid card on the slip.

I think more recently, I've seen a lot of corps go to a wireless Omron port right in the booth.. eliminating the manual part of the process. This has probably gone a long way towards eliminating the situation you outlined above.

I don't think that changes the demographic distribution but it is a change that's become more common in recent years while you've been overseas.

Stef

[danielray]

My take - you priced the bigger items too low, so they aren't profitable. Instead of fixing the problem, you'd rather discard the product lines (and the demographic that buys them).

The quantities are too low and the way that corps purchase on short runs prevent any improvement in the margins on higher items.

Take a QUALITY embroidered or cutout hoodie that you would sell for $40 (can't go much higher than that). At the quantities that corps can reasonably run, the cost is probably around $22-24... a margin of $16-18/ea.

A white T-shirt with a couple of colours screened you could sell for about $18. You're looking at a cost of about $5-6... a margin of $12-13/ea.

If you were to bulk buy basics (white/black tees), you could bring the costs down about another $1-1.50, improving the margin to about $13-14.50.

T-shirts are more often cash sales. $40 is about the breaking point between cash and credit/check. This cuts a few % out of the margins, making them not too different.

T-shirts outsell everything else several to one. This is what I'd focus on.

Also, if several corps would create a scheme to pool resources to bulk buy basics (everyone uses white, black and grey tees and grey sweatshirts) and lock up a common supplier to get an aggregate volume break, that's another couple bucks a shirt in profit. Everyone wins.

[Bucbari]

The last drum corps show I went to was in 2004....my interest is waning...I still love the activity and I dont mind tweaks and changes...but I do mind tinkering with the very core of what makes an activity unique...

For some people it was adding a pit...for others it was adding a 2nd or 3rd valve or allowing Bb horns...its varies where the line is for most people....

People treat those of us who are against rapid, widespread changes as closeminded dinosaurs out to kill and hold back this wonderful activity.

I'm pretty open minded (I'd like to think) but I'll walk away when they add synthesizers and/or woodwinds because then it will just be marching band....but I'll watch from a distance...

...drum corps is a major part of how I became who I am today and I will still hold on to my fond memories of the years I performed....I think I have a right to that...

I would disagree with you shosta on a very small detail. I started marching in 1967 so I have seen the wholesale changes over the decades and there was very little controvery about grounded pit or 2 and 3 valve horns or any of the changes between 67 and say 2000. They didn't change the fundamental grounding of DC.

To address the issue of walking away. Attendance does seem flat. DCI imho is not growing. The Fan base appears to be shrinking. I remember the 1st show I ever saw. There were 25,000 people in that stadium and it wasn't a finals crowd. Makes one wonder.