stifled4mallettechnique Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 So, if judges were able to score each corps on the merits of their individual performance, it would work? Hmmm... then there wouldn't be a need to mix things up! Judges holding back scores to leave room for where they think other corps will score... sounds like the problem is clearly identified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickk3 Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 ...Judges holding back scores to leave room for where they think other corps will score... Well, yes and no. To insure fairness in scoring and placement, a measure of flexibility would have to be allotted for in case a corps unexpectedly performed above or below their season average - i.e., above or below where they might score. A judge would have to allow room for a potential adjustment by not being overly generous or stingy. The scores would be lower for fairness sake. I think a difference might be that (perhaps) one could think a judge might have, or benefit from, a predetermination in placement. I don't think that's the case (for no other reason than there could be nothing gained or lost by such a predetermination). As esteemed as DCI is, I doubt Tim Donaghy is chomping at the bit for a piece of it. Often, while watching a finals performance, I think of how difficult it would be for a judge to exact a placement even with the corps competing back-to-back - let alone if they performed sporadically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ingenious Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 No real theory as to what would happen on my end. I would hope that it wouldn't make a difference. It's for the fan's sake and the show's success that the line-ups are ordered that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
84skyrydr Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 It sure made a difference for Madison in 1988....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Clark Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 It just might cut down on corps "getting lost" on the way to the show, so that they would not have to go on first. Not that that has ever happened over the decades... I'm just sayin'. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinwiz Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 Corps go on in order of scores, what if the order was shuffled at random each day, would that change scores?Now judges pretty much know that the last 4 corps will score highest. Yes. The earlier the performance in the day, the more variable the score. Just look at the differences between Quarters and the previous weekend for the 17+ corps. With a shuffle, Cascades would have likely made Semis and Troop could have beaten Southwind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Drum Corps Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 The only problem I see with a random order is that lower placing corps would go on after higher placing corps. This happened in Memphis this past season. Pioneer went on after Crown and right before Cadets, so they were extremely under appreciated by those around me, and likely a lot of other people there too. ...Including the judges! Pioneers score went way down that night. The stadium seemed to suck up the sound between Crown and Cadets, there seemed to be a vacuum in the stadium. The kids unfortunately looked like "deer in the headlights"...that was a huge venue with only 200? fans in it. 20 less horns than everyone else before them and after them didnt help matters, I realize... But that particular situation was unordinary, the stadium was awful, in the Liberty Bowl. Donny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t-mac Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 It sure made a difference for Madison in 1988....... Do you think Madison wouldn't have won otherwise? Just curious. Personally, I think '88 was the most exciting finals ever, at least as far as watching the awards ceremony goes. I have always thought some version of this would be the most equitable method of scoring to reduce likelyhood of unintentional(intentional) "slotting". By the way, I was concerned going in to the Atlanta Regional because of Crown's early performance order, but they ended up jumping two corps that performed after they did if I remember correctly. Also, as far as '88 goes, I believe that it was revealed afterwards that Madison had actually won Semi's also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2ndSop4Life Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 It sure made a difference for Madison in 1988....... wrong, Madison was first after prelims anyway plus, they performed the #### out of that show, the deserved what they got Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Cavalier TDY Posted October 4, 2007 Share Posted October 4, 2007 I remember back when I marched junior corps in the 70's, it was common to have between one and three days for preliminaries in order to determine the corps which made the night show. Several times, corps I marched with got 'the short end of the stick' as tolerances changed after we had gone on. Early draws have ALWAYS been a pain! I don't know which method I prefer - random draw, establishing brackets and mixing the order within them or the present format. I suppose there are arguments for and against any of them. I CAN tell you I have taken guests to shows and they have seen, and appreciated, the gradual progression from the first corps on to the last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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