kusankusho Posted February 9, 2008 Author Share Posted February 9, 2008 (edited) No. I know there are because as a TaeKwonDo student, I've seen them. Michael, what makes TaeKwonDo different from Karate or Kung Fu? What makes Northern Shaolin different from Southern, or Shorin Ryu different from Goju Ryu? See where I'm going here? Edited February 9, 2008 by kusankusho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 No. I know there are because as a TaeKwonDo student, I've seen them. My point was how much drum corps means to us, as evidenced that we're talking about drum corps here. I'm not discounting any other activities, but I am trying to recognize how much drum means to people to care about it. I'm not disagreeing on that Mike which is why I missed what ever point was being discussed. Since I think it helps to compare DC to other activites maybe you can answer this or at least give some good guesses. Let's pretend some people what to change Tae Kwon Do so that it becomes less of what it used to be (IOW what makes TKD unique from other Martial Arts) and more of another type. Think there would be heated discussion between the purists and evolutionists? Think it would sound like DCP? Don't know if this is even possible but like I said, let's pretend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 As for the "What is DC" discussion, people will decide what is DC based on the first time they see a corps or a show. DCI is going for a revolving door with fans as the #1 concern is finding new members. So as new people (continuely) come in and see their first show they will think "Oh this is Drum Corps". This includes the people who see their first show in 20?? and decide that a Drum Corps is something with woodwinds, amps, electronics, mixing boards and flutophones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusankusho Posted February 9, 2008 Author Share Posted February 9, 2008 I'm not disagreeing on that Mike which is why I missed what ever point was being discussed.Since I think it helps to compare DC to other activites maybe you can answer this or at least give some good guesses. Let's pretend some people what to change Tae Kwon Do so that it becomes less of what it used to be (IOW what makes TKD unique from other Martial Arts) and more of another type. Think there would be heated discussion between the purists and evolutionists? Think it would sound like DCP? Don't know if this is even possible but like I said, let's pretend. Exactly right. Karate evolved in Okinawa, not mainland Japan. When Gichin Funakoshi took Okinawan karate to Japan, he didn't change his original style (Shuri-te) for the Japanese, he founded a new style, Shotokan, to incorporate the adjustments he wanted to see. In this way he made the changes he felt should be made, without disrespecting or co-opting Shuri-te. Shuri-te evolved on it's own, but it wasn't changed to accomodate Funakoshi-sensei. He would not dream of being that egotistical or disrespectful of Okinawan history, wisdom and tradition. If someone wants a summer band circuit, I say go for it and I honestly wish George, or whoever, the very best of luck with it. But don't take the lazy and destructive route by co-opting and essentially killing something unique and wonderful that already exists. DCI could learn a lot from Funakoshi-sensei. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 some of us could not participate in baseball, martial arts or hockey at anywhere near the level of excellence or success that we were able to experience in drum corps. That makes the drum corps experience unique for us as former marching members. And, it will continue to make it unique for the future marching members of drum corps. It works both ways, though. In my own case, my HS marching band experience was more intense than my experience with a DCI finalist. More successful, too. But that doesn't stop drum corps from holding a special place in my heart (and my budget). And it certainly doesn't explain why I should continue to call it "drum corps" if it changes completely into something else, like marching band (though that hasn't quite happened yet). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EndzoneEric Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 And it certainly doesn't explain why I should continue to call it "drum corps" if it changes completely into something else, like marching band (though that hasn't quite happened yet). I hear what you're saying here and I understand the frustration shared by so many that we are seemingly powerless to stop the powers that be from doing pretty much whatever they want (even though as I've said earlier, to me it's not really about a small group of directors voting for this, it's more about the hundred or so designers and instructors who really drive the creative direction of what we're seeing on the field, imho). After thinking about this for several years now, I can't help but wonder... "does any of this matter?" Does what we call it matter? Does the instrumentation matter? In terms of "making the world a better place," isn't the competitive outcome really insignificant? Does "summer marching musical activities on a football field" really matter at all, regardless of the moniker under which it's marketed? Isn't it more about the way that the "drum corps experience" or in this case, participation in a DCI-brand drum corps, changes the life of the participant? The spectator? The family that supports the performer? Aren't we really upset about the changes because in some cases they may eliminate the things that were special to US, notwithstanding possibilities and opportunities that lie ahead? Maybe as I've gotten older and as I've lost a few people who were significant to me, I've grown more melancholy. When I go to a drum corps contest now, it really isn't about the competition part for me (nor for the many others that leave before the scores are announced). I'm perfectly fine to see the recaps on line the next day, since I quite often don't really understand what the heck they're judging any more anyway. For me, the bottom line is that I'm blown away year after year by what a group of "kids" can accomplish. This "kids" classification might just also include those young men and women who are designing for and instructing the other "kids" on the field. I see how much better the performances are, going all the way to the bottom of Division II and Division III for that matter, than they were when we marched. I watched the kids from SCV unloading their equipment from their truck at a show last year. You could almost see their unbridled GLEE as they began to prepare for the performance. They were still hours from taking the field, but the entire vibe wasn't lost on them... they seemed to be soaking it in and living the true essence of the drum corps experience... and they were doing nothing more than unpacking cases and wheeling around their xylophones. MAN, how I miss those days! Now I'm left to live vicariously through them. We can complain about programming and repertoires. We can complain about "evolution" or "forgetting our roots." We can debate the similarities and differences between the days and now, other activities and ours, soccer vs. rugby, and all the rest. We are allowed to be up-in-arms about the fact that the changes are upon us. We will choose to either support DCI in the future or we won't. To each his own, I guess. Probably the purpose for public discussion forums in the first place. But... thanks to my old band director from way-back-when, I can't help but think about this: If we're not a part of the solution, we're a part of the problem. So... how do we become a part of the solution? What is the solution? I don't think it's about wearing snarky t-shirts, nor do I think it's about boycotting anything or calling for a public lynching. With the amount of passionate discourse spewed forth in this place every day, it seems that there is plenty of brainpower that could be organized to do something positive. I don't have more answers than that at this point, but I will continue to give it some thought. I hope the thing we call drum corps is around in some form in fifty years, and that many more thousands of young people have had the chance to have their lives impacted in a positive way. Although I'm sure it will look different than what it does today, I hope that I can play a role in it. I hope some of you will be there with me, one way or the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 How about honesty?... I don't see how DCI is being dishonest. I believe one thing, you believe another. We will not change each other's minds nor will we come to a meeting of the minds on this. I'm sure that if either of us was in need, either of us would come to the help of the other if we could. To me that's part of the drum corps brotherhood, no matter what else we disagree on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 I'm not disagreeing on that Mike which is why I missed what ever point was being discussed.Since I think it helps to compare DC to other activites maybe you can answer this or at least give some good guesses. Let's pretend some people what to change Tae Kwon Do so that it becomes less of what it used to be (IOW what makes TKD unique from other Martial Arts) and more of another type. Think there would be heated discussion between the purists and evolutionists? Think it would sound like DCP? Don't know if this is even possible but like I said, let's pretend. Well, it is happening. There are different parent organizations in the United States and they don't agree on some of the maneuvers within the basic forms that are taught, and the forms have even changed over time. Go to a competition and you'll see the forms delivered differently depending the school in one was taught. If one doesn't like how one school (or certification agency) is teaching a form, they can transfer to another school that meets their desires. But I still don't understand why DCI needs to change its name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusankusho Posted February 9, 2008 Author Share Posted February 9, 2008 If one doesn't like how one school (or certification agency) is teaching a form, they can transfer to another school that meets their desires. And we have had that "other" school that was DCI that was different enough from band to satisfy that need for difference. Now that the differences are being eliminated, it's all one school. To continue with the martial arts analogy, it's as if the entire world must only practice one form of TaeKwonDo. As a karateka, that would not make me very happy. But I still don't understand why DCI needs to change its name. Because it is no longer drum corps, why call it drum corps? If your master decided that all your TaeKwonDo forms were going out the window, and you were from now on to practice only Hung Gar forms, would you still be able to call your school a TaeKwonDo dojang? No - you'd be a Hung Gar kwoon. To call it a TaeKwonDo school would be dishonest, innaccurate and disrespectful to the TaeKwonDo lineage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EndzoneEric Posted February 9, 2008 Share Posted February 9, 2008 Because it is no longer drum corps, why call it drum corps? Once instruments other than drums were added, it ceased being a drum corps. Therefore, it should have never been called a drum corps. Therefore, DCI never really existed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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