DCA is "filling a void" left by DCI's Super Corps Model

[Tom Brace]

DCA also has a region called DCA-South that host their own shows, and soon will have DCA-West once there is another California corps to make the trip out to finals. Until then, DCA corps out west have exhibitions or do DCI shows on DCA sheets.

While I don't know the attendance, since these shows are yearly, I'd have to imagine that the corps that host them are making some profit out of them somehow.

I would expect that a combined DCA/DCI show would make a profit. I'll give you that.

[Tom Brace]

I have no idea about attendance.

But, since we are talking about corps participation, I don't know how relevant audience participation is. I think that the corps exist first, then the audience comes along later. The non-NE all-age corps started up, then they put on all-age shows afterward.

But audience participation is of prime importance, for without an audience, it's really just musical masturbation.

My term.

[Dale Bari]

But audience participation is of prime importance, for without an audience, it's really just musical masturbation.

My term.

OK, so what about the rest of what I posted, or are you more interested in showing off your verbal prowess?

Of course, we all would love to have an audience to perform for, otherwise it's just practice. However, the corps had to be created first, then sponsors found to put on shows, then audiences to show up. You can't invert or scramble that order. How can an audience attend a show without corps? How can an audience attend a show that doesn't exist yet?

If you want actual attendance figures, go ask the individual sponsors. I did try to note for you how many of the shows were more than mere one-offs, which I think would've headed off some obvious follow-up questions. Was I not specific or thorough enough for you?

A simple acknowledgement that you checked out my info (and for everyone else who offered up some more) would've sufficed. (Even silence would've been preferable to a quick quip that seems awfully dismissive.)

[MikeM]

Just waiting for some open class corps to take you up on the idea.

But, if most of the DCA shows are in the East...doesn't that limit the whole weekedn only thing unless I move out east?

The majority of the shows are currently in the East. That has been the traditional home of DCA for many years. The explosion of non-eastern DCA corps only started recently, and DCA has a reqirement that 3 DCA corps need to attend a show for it to be sanctioned.

I expect that you'll see more non-Northeast shows as the next couple of years move along.

That said, looking at the list showed, it's a 17/10 split NE/Non-NE for 2008 (Counting DCA Finals as 1 big show, but I could have miscounted)

[monoemono]

Corps like Arizona Academy throw water all over this argument (it will be a year before they can choose to throw water on the field). They heaped TONS of criticism on DCP for doing much less than a full tour last season. They stayed out of extended tours, most likely cut their costs and still finished 13th. Not bad for a regional touring corps.

They did earn a large amount of criticism last year, but I'm not sure why--I think a lot more groups should operate this way. Trouble is, they are not going to be able to do this in the long run, are they? Maybe I'm wrong, but I seem to remember as part of that discussion that they will not be able to skip regional competitions this year like they did last year.

I disagree. Last year, the decision to go to an Open Corps format was lauded as a revolutionary change by most of DCP. I saw it as nothing more than combining them all and changing a name, but I was told to wait to see the additional developments. Well, now I understand there is a better pay structure with revenues coming from the Fab 5 ticket promotions and I'm guessing that adjudication changes will also be made to give fairer consideration for the former IIIs to the former IIs. Just a guess.

Well, here's to hoping I'm wrong. I would hope that DCI would make changes to encourage the growth of corps of all sizes. I haven't seen it so far, so I'm skeptical. It seems like these smaller groups have been an afterthought for a long time.

The small corps circuit is not in the summer, but in gyms in the spring. I don't see it as filling any voids. Please educate me more. And has it offered any competitions as of yet? I saw one announcement about it and then nothing. How many small corps are ready to go for this spring? As far as new ideas, how do you take these small corps (most under a hundred members) who in this niche, few people support, few people want to pay money to see (in shows by themselves) and make it viable? DCI has decided to subsidize it from fans who want the best seats at World Class Finals. What's the better idea that everyone else has?

It hasn't done anything yet, so of course it isn't filling a void. But perhaps it will someday. I just like the idea that people are out there trying something. I never thought I would have any interest in DCA, but lately they have caught my attention. I was pessimistic about the possible disappearance of drum corps until I realized that what I was really lamenting was the loss of a DCI that I can really get into. When I decided to expand MY definition of drum corps to include all-age groups, alumni groups, parade corps, mini-corps, or 30 kids on a basketball court, I realized that the future of DRUM CORPS is potentially very bright.

As to how you make a new, small, unheard of group viable, I think others here have already touched on this. You play at the mall. You play in the park at the Home Days celebration. You play the national anthem at the AAA ball park. You sign up for the 4th of July parade. You make yourself so visible in the community that people can't avoid you if they tried.

[Fran Haring]

Well, it's settled for me. If Tom Brace ain't going to DCA, then neither am I!!!!

Me, neither. And I'm burning all my shirts.

Wait a minute..... a lot of folks probably think that's a good thing.

Fran

[Tom Brace]

Well Tom, here is the tentative 2008 DCA Schedule:

June 21 - Wildwood NJ

June 28 - Biridgeport CT

June 28 - Denton, TX

July 5 - Manassas VA

July 5 - Rochester NY

July 12 - Clifton NJ

July 12 - Buffalo NY

July 19 - Lewisburg PA

July 19 - Endicott NY

July 26 - Chambersburg PA

July 26 - Boston MA

July 26 - Houston TX

July 26 - South Milwaukee WI

July 27 - Lake Geneva WI

August 2 - Syracuse NY

August 2 - Millersville PA

August 2 - Hendersonville TN

August 9 - Kingston NY

August 15 - Alpharetta GA

August 16 - Scranton PA (DCA Regional)

August 16 - St Peter MN

August 16 - Douglasville GA

August 17 - St Paul MN

August 23 - Reading PA

August 23 - West Haven CT

August 29 - WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS (I&E, Mini Corps)-Rochester NY

August 30 - WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS (Prelims) - Rochester NY

August 31 - WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS (Finals) - Rochester NY

So, to answer your first question.. yes, there are shows outside the NE (and I did not even count the PA shows, which technically are not the Northeast, but we will consider them part of the NE "network" if you will)

Now I cannot speak to crowd sizes. I know that when I marched DCA in 2004 (Heat Wave) we took part in 3 Southern shows (Our own show, Rockmart GA and Winston Salem NC) None of the crowds were huge by any means, although this was a time when there were only ~ 4 "Southern" corps competing (Heat Wave, Carolina Gold, CorpsVets and Shenandoah Sound, unless I am missing someone...) and 2 of them were Class A corps. I have not attended a show outside the NE since 04 (having moved to CT in 05) so maybe someone else can provide that info.

great information. which corps are slated for the South Milwaukee and Lake Geneva show? Also, the Minnesota shows? I'm planning a trip back to the Midwest this summer and I might be able to catch one of the shows.

[Tom Brace]

Here is some data you might find interesting:

1990 - 20 DCA shows: 19 in NE, 1 not (95/5 percentage-wise)

1995 - 16 shows: 15 in NE, 1 not (94/6)

2000 - 17 shows: 17 in NE, 0 not (100/0)

2005 - 21 shows: 14 in NE, 7 not (66/33)

2007 - 20 shows: 13 in NE, 7 not (65/35)

OK...you are picking random years here...were their no shows in 2006? Or did that year not fit your argument?

So, number of performance opportunities are flat at best. Most years you show have fewer than 20 shows for the entire season and of the figures you present, 79.5% of the shows are in the NE historically. The trend since 2005 is to having roughly 1/3 of the shows outside the NE. Noted. Can you compare attendance/$$$ earned at the non-NE shows versus the NE shows. Also, I'd like to know the average number of DCA corps at the NE versus the non-NE shows. One more thing...of the 20 total shows, how many of them have DCI corps in them?

1990 - 17 corps in DCA Championships: 14 from NE, 3 not (82/18)

1995 - 15 corps: 14 from NE, 1 not (93/7)

2000 - 16 corps: 12 from NE, 4 not (75/25)

2005 - 26 corps: 12 from NE, 14 not (46/54)

2007 - 22 corps: 10 from NE, 12 not (45/55)

Random years again...the numbers looked to be on a nice trend and then you lost 4 this past year. That's over 15% of the corps not marching. DCI lost Southwind and Cascades, that's only 9.5%. And that's just considering World Class. So, who has the void?

Interesting stuff. Thanks for making me look deeper. I look forward to your answers about the apparent demise of DCI at the hands of DCI.

[Kyle B]

Compare this...compare that...compare this.

Basically, we can give you 99 great answers, but all you want is that 1 bad answer to say your right about everything.

You want answers about 2006, go to DCA's website and find out and do some research on your own.

[Kyle B]

Oh, btw....the 15% drop as you put it is over 2 years, where as your # is only one. You are forgetting other corps, but hey...feel free to lie about the numbers to show us how right you are about everything.