drumno5 Posted September 10, 2008 Share Posted September 10, 2008 I have tuned individual snares, it's not as refined as a guitar or violin... My point exactly. Yeah, you can "tune" them - but the refinement (that's a good word) and consistency are an iffy proposition. Proper gut tuning does make a difference. No argument there. But as to what constitutes "proper" tuning, I'm guessing there are nearly as many different approaches as there are instructors/techs/tuning gurus out there. F#? .0008 lbs. torque @20 degrees celsius? Crank the little screws as tight as you can (or until one of the little retaining gizmos on the end pops off, then remove the busted strand) and then back them off 3/4 of a turn? Gut or synthetic, kevlar or mylar, tuning is quite possibly more art (maybe even a little black magic) than science! Fred O. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dundermifflin Posted September 10, 2008 Share Posted September 10, 2008 My point exactly. Yeah, you can "tune" them - but the refinement (that's a good word) and consistency are an iffy proposition.No argument there. But as to what constitutes "proper" tuning, I'm guessing there are nearly as many different approaches as there are instructors/techs/tuning gurus out there. F#? .0008 lbs. torque @20 degrees celsius? Crank the little screws as tight as you can (or until one of the little retaining gizmos on the end pops off, then remove the busted strand) and then back them off 3/4 of a turn? Gut or synthetic, kevlar or mylar, tuning is quite possibly more art (maybe even a little black magic) than science! Fred O. Exactly. I would bet that SCV (best tuning IMO),Bluecoats,and PR all have their methods that work for them and their given equipment scenarios because they seem to maintain that sound consistently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highpitch_83 Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 No disrespect to the guys at Evans, or any of you great drum tuners out there - but I'm still not completely buying into the idea that a snare drum head can be tuned to a "note" with a specific frequency. Drums (snare drums especially, but even tenors and basses, to a certain extent) are instruments of indefinite pitch. I'm betting if you took three experienced drum guys and sent them each to a separate room with instructions to tune a snare drum to top head A/bottom head D, you'd wind up with three different sounding drums. It's not that kind of an exact science.Not trying to incite a riot or anything, just my $.02 worth. peace, Fred O. Preach on brother! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAvery Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Boy has this thread been hijacked! Water spraying out of a garden hose? Thunder? Static when the cable goes out?Sigh, here we go... Yes, they all have a pitch. A sound is created by something vibrating, i.e. water moving the air (as in the garden hose), electricity moving thorugh the air ( as in thunder), or the speaker moving, which move the air (as in the static). Now what may happen is the pitch varies so rapidly that the human ear cannot detect one pitch. My guess is there is some machine somewhere that can detect a pitch in any sound. "Indefinite pitch percussion instruments emit a musical noise which cannot be identfied as possessing a definite pitch or frequency. these include triangles, drums, tambourines, cymbals, gongs and castnets."from Music, Physics and Engineering By Harry Ferdinand Olson While it is true that triangles are generally not created at a specific pitch, that does not mean they cannot. A tympani is a drum and there are tuned gongs. "In music and hearing, a sound or note of 'definite pitch' is one of which it is possible or relatively easy to discern the pitch or frequency of the fundamental. Sounds with definite pitch have harmonic frequency spectra or close to harmonic spectra.A sound or note of 'indefinite pitch' is one of which it is impossible or relatively difficult to discern the pitch or frequency of the fundamental. Sounds with indefinite pitch do not have harmonic spectra or have altered harmonic spectra. Note that it is still possible for two sounds of indefinite pitch to clearly be higher or lower than one another, for instance, a snare drum invariably sounds higher in pitch than a bass drum because its sound contains higher frequencies. In other words, it is possible and often easy to roughly discern the relative pitches of two sounds of indefinite pitch, but any given sound of indefinite pitch does not neatly correspond to a given definite pitch." (the italics are mine). Huh? You say that a snare drum sounds higher than a bass drum, but they have no pitch? The ability to hear high and low is a characteristic of pitch. In some of these situations you describe it would hard, if not impossible, for the normal human ear to hear a specific pitch, but that does not mean there is no pitch. That being said, there is no "normal" human ear. I can hear much more deviations in pitches now than when I was younger. Then again, that is my profession. More power to the people that have the time and ear to tune heads and snares to a specific note. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumno5 Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Boy has this thread been hijacked!Yes, they all have a pitch. A sound is created by something vibrating, i.e. water moving the air (as in the garden hose), electricity moving thorugh the air ( as in thunder), or the speaker moving, which move the air (as in the static). Now what may happen is the pitch varies so rapidly that the human ear cannot detect one pitch. My guess is there is some machine somewhere that can detect a pitch in any sound. While it is true that triangles are generally not created at a specific pitch, that does not mean they cannot. A tympani is a drum and there are tuned gongs. Huh? You say that a snare drum sounds higher than a bass drum, but they have no pitch? The ability to hear high and low is a characteristic of pitch. In some of these situations you describe it would hard, if not impossible, for the normal human ear to hear a specific pitch, but that does not mean there is no pitch. That being said, there is no "normal" human ear. I can hear much more deviations in pitches now than when I was younger. Then again, that is my profession. More power to the people that have the time and ear to tune heads and snares to a specific note. Yeah, OK - whatever... peace, Fred O. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-Swiss Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 Boy has this thread been hijacked!Yes, they all have a pitch. A sound is created by something vibrating, i.e. water moving the air (as in the garden hose), electricity moving thorugh the air ( as in thunder), or the speaker moving, which move the air (as in the static). Now what may happen is the pitch varies so rapidly that the human ear cannot detect one pitch. My guess is there is some machine somewhere that can detect a pitch in any sound. While it is true that triangles are generally not created at a specific pitch, that does not mean they cannot. A tympani is a drum and there are tuned gongs. Huh? You say that a snare drum sounds higher than a bass drum, but they have no pitch? The ability to hear high and low is a characteristic of pitch. In some of these situations you describe it would hard, if not impossible, for the normal human ear to hear a specific pitch, but that does not mean there is no pitch. That being said, there is no "normal" human ear. I can hear much more deviations in pitches now than when I was younger. Then again, that is my profession. More power to the people that have the time and ear to tune heads and snares to a specific note. Gongs are actually tuned to a specific pitch. the "gongs" you see on the front line at corps shows are actually tam-tams, and have no specific pitch. just a cacophony of many pitches Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorpsLife Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 No disrespect to the guys at Evans, or any of you great drum tuners out there - but I'm still not completely buying into the idea that a snare drum head can be tuned to a "note" with a specific frequency. Drums (snare drums especially, but even tenors and basses, to a certain extent) are instruments of indefinite pitch. I'm betting if you took three experienced drum guys and sent them each to a separate room with instructions to tune a snare drum to top head A/bottom head D, you'd wind up with three different sounding drums. It's not that kind of an exact science.Not trying to incite a riot or anything, just my $.02 worth. peace, Fred O. If i were to punch a guy in the face, it would have a pitch too! Not saying i would punch a guy, just saying that even though the note is short, there is a note in there. I tune my drums to each song when i am recording. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGarrett Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 it would no doubt be a "flat" note, huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumno5 Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 If i were to punch a guy in the face, it would have a pitch too! Not saying i would punch a guy, just saying that even though the note is short, there is a note in there. I tune my drums to each song when i am recording. Yikes, are people still reading this thread? Do you tune your toms to get a "punchy" sound? (lol - terrible I know, but I couldn't resist!) peace, Fred O. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
08Hawkeye Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 Bottom line: I still don't think you can nail down the pitch of a snare drum (much less the individual snare strands, as someone suggested earlier) to a specific note. You sir, have clearly not watched Cavaliers Drumming for a New Millenium DVD -- McIntosh shows exactly how to tune the individual snare strands. I'd even go so far as to say the strands are easier to tune than the tension of the head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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