Why do the Judges matter?

[anniem]

Last year there was a People's Choice Award. Crown won it. I don't know if it was both online and text or just one or the other. I also don't know how many people knew about it... I was a Crown parent and I didn't even know about it until it was announced at finals.

I think it would be great to continue such efforts at fan input and expand the possibility of audience input on the scores. Leave much of the scoring to the judges BUT include the fans to a smaller degree. Think of how that might change the mindset of those designing and implementing shows as well as possibly maintaining and increasing the drum corp fanbase. We have so much technology at our thumbtips that adding the fans to the mix seems like an easy proposition.

[AlexL]

any audience appreciation award should be separate from what judges are paid to do with assigning numbers as the behest of the member corps who give them the judging criteria and tell them how to interpret it in the first place.

the amount of anger over what the corps, themselves, choose to be rated on is truly baffling.

judging is ridiculous.

The corps would be wise to set those judging criteria in a way that rewards what entertains their paying audiences, lest they be left entertaining empty stadiums

[BRASSO]

We are forgetting the third and probably most important group that the corps must make their shows appeal to....... the current and future members.

Yes, it is important to make the shows appeal to the fans..... they provide a great deal of the money and after all, the activity is a form of entertainment.

Yes, it is important to make the shows appeal to the judges..... that's how you win..... and winning attracts more talent, more money, more fans, etc.....

But I think it is most important to make the shows appeal to the members..... they also provide a significant amount of money... plus they actually are the activity itself. A lot of times we forget that what appeals to legacy fans may not always appeal to current marching members, and vice versa. I always point to BD and SCV having shows that this year seem to be not as popular among fans.... but to my music major friends (which let's face... music majors make up the vast majority of the top corps), these are probably the two hippest shows out there.

Apparently not hip enough though to want to come out and buy tickets to Finals to see these shows they think are "hip". The numbers of current college music majors not afiliated currrently with any corps that come out to DCI Finals is probably about on par ( or less ) with the number of non music majors.

Edited August 8, 2010 by BRASSO

[Lance]

The corps would be wise to set those judging criteria in a way that rewards what entertains their paying audiences, lest they be left entertaining empty stadiums

we'll see what happens. it's 100% up to the member corps themselves to determine the direction of judging.

in the meantime, people who don't care about thinking things through will focus their anger on the specific corps they just hate. lol.

[sassy1]

The judges matter and scores matter because its a competitive activity. Pleasing the crowd is important but, just like scores and judging, its far from the only thing. I loved the aspect of busting tail and working hard to perfect a show and be the best I could with other members. Yes, pleaseing the crowd is fun, but it should be the result of what is being done...........not the reason for what is being done.

G

I think it is unacceptable what happened to the pacific crest scores last night in Allentown because of the "missing judge" this score was crucial, and it should not have been handled the way it was.

Judges: the scores matter to the "little guys" too, not just the big l0

[Tez]

Apparently not hip enough though to want to come out and buy tickets to Finals to see these shows they think are "hip". The numbers of current college music majors not afiliated currrently with any corps that come out to DCI Finals is probably about on par ( or less ) with the number of non music majors.

I would think far, far less. I know of a few college music majors who want to or even have marched World Class drum corps (like championship-winning shows) that would never in their life pay to see a contest. They are a little interested when they see videos and they love participating, but before or after..... they don't take it so seriously. Believe me, many current marching members are no where near the level of fanaticism that most of us DCP'ers are at.

[megadrive]

I think it is unacceptable what happened to the pacific crest scores last night in Allentown because of the "missing judge" this score was crucial, and it should not have been handled the way it was.

Judges: the scores matter to the "little guys" too, not just the big l0

Yup, and it only affected Pacific Crest. /sarcasm

So they double the other GE Music Score. Big Whoop.

#### happens.

[Tez]

I think it is unacceptable what happened to the pacific crest scores last night in Allentown because of the "missing judge" this score was crucial, and it should not have been handled the way it was.

Judges: the scores matter to the "little guys" too, not just the big l0

What happened?

[jwillis35]

With so much attention and focus drawn to the scores and judging of drum corps, its hardly a wonder why so many corps create programs that FIRSTLY appeal to judges and then secondly charm the crowd. My question is why do scores matter so much? Shouldnt was as fans and ticket buyers be the first priority? When a corps creates a show their goal should be to win the crowd over as much as possible because excitement and enjoyment of their programs (and ultimately all corps programs) is what is going to fill up seats, sell tickets, and make DCI a bigger organization am I right? Who cares if a handful of "judges" say that one show is better or worse than another one, when the judges are not what is making DCI a more successful organization? This is not to say that judging is not important, but to me, if DCI wants to get bigger, they need to get their corps to create mind blowing, amazing shows that have the crowd throwing babies. A show like this is what is going to get people that are not familiar to DCI at all, interested in the activity.

Do you guys think that DCI needs to switch its focus from "and the 2010 world champion is" to more of "that quadruple block rotation while blasting a perfectly tuned chord that will have your ears and eyes in ecstasy is arguably the coolest thing I have ever seen or heard"?

Oh and btw, I have only been on DCP since the start of this season, so I dont know if this has kind of topic has been beaten into the gound lol if so, forgive me!

It's a good question, and one that comes up from time to time (more fan input in scoring/placement, less judging input).

It's natural to feel that the more democratic process would be to let fans have their vote, but in reality it's a mistake. I'm in favor of something like the Fan's Award for Entertainment, or something like that. When it comes to judging music, ensemble, balance and blend, intonation, issues of articulation, release, and phrasing it is much wiser to allow professionals to do this.

Yes, our judges get beat on over the summer by many on this board (and that includes me at times), but by and large most of us also feel the judges are good and very qualified (for the most part). Typically they get it right. There are too many opinions in the stands (fans) and nothing conclusive would come from that method except chaos and fan bickering. At least now the fans can blame the judges, and that's a whole lot better than the fans killing each other.

Also, competition is GOOD! We need it. I get tired of all the smarmy, soft, "We're all good and special" jargon than gets rammed down our kids' throats in school. Of course they are special, but I still need them to learn, to work, to compete for jobs, a living, a career, and to develop tough-minded ability to never give up and push as hard as they can as they try for success in all that they do. Drum corps competition helps kids establish these types of work ethics without necessarily beating the "you're a loser" mind set over their head.

Edited August 8, 2010 by jwillis35

[BRASSO]

I would think far, far less. I know of a few college music majors who want to or even have marched World Class drum corps (like championship-winning shows) that would never in their life pay to see a contest. They are a little interested when they see videos and they love participating, but before or after..... they don't take it so seriously. Believe me, many current marching members are no where near the level of fanaticism that most of us DCP'ers are at.

And I agree with you too Tez on this point. We oftentimes hear on here that a show appealed to a college music major. But if they don't support the actvity long term, then that's the same as telling me that Nursing Majors like such and such shows. Who cares ?

Out of sight, out of mind, as far as I'm concerned.

Edited August 8, 2010 by BRASSO