DCISuperfan Posted February 21, 2011 Author Share Posted February 21, 2011 My favorite show depends on the year. But it's fun to list favorite corps in order of preference sometimes. The topic isnt necessarilly "preference" as much as it is where you think certain corps should have placed. If it was preference, I would have put crown, scouts, cavaliers, blue knights and phantom in the top 5. Some of those corps were just not nearly good enough to actually be in the top 5 though, the thread is more about any disagreements anyone had with where corps placed rather than their favorite shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFZFAN Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 (edited) Pio @ 19th? Now I see, you are a Pio fan. Academy@ 22? That's just plain nuts! BD @ 4. No way, although I am no scatter drill fan, BD was clearly the best corps in 2010. No corps was even a close second. X- Men @ 13th, sorry but they were not that good. Blue Knights over Blue Stars, ah...no. PC over Spirit...nope. Howdy, Thanks for clearing that up for me. I have become quite a Pioneer fan starting in 2010. Somehow their brass sound got much better in 2010 . I have really begun to value your input. cough cough Edited February 21, 2011 by SFZFAN 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hook'emCavies Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 It's hard to put my finger on it but I really didn't enjoy the show in 2010. They just looked terrible in those uniforms, and I couldn't get into the music. Their trademark "Dancing Hornline" didn't help either. I agree, I wasn't a huge fan of the new uniforms either. I just don't like them, I hope that they do something more like there 09 show again. (I have also heard a few things from a friend that went to a camp... it concerns me. However, I refuse to post anything on here about what I have heard until the season start) that being said I really hope that Carolina Crown has a great upcoming season! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skewerz Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Pio @ 19th? Now I see, you are a Pio fan. Academy@ 22? That's just plain nuts! BD @ 4. No way, although I am no scatter drill fan, BD was clearly the best corps in 2010. No corps was even a close second. X- Men @ 13th, sorry but they were not that good. Blue Knights over Blue Stars, ah...no. PC over Spirit...nope. perhaps he was ranking them using his personal judging values...which, is, by the way, what this topic calls for. I would have had BD last, and SVC in 21st or 22nd, but my judging criteria is different than DCI's... My top twelve would look like... 1. Madison 2. Crown 3. Bloo 4. Cavies 5. Jersey Surf 6. Cadets 7. Blue Knights 8. Colts 9. Boston 10. Spirit 11. Pioneer 12. Academy My judging criteria is how I was personally entertained. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hostrauser Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 (edited) Chalk me up as one who "was there", as meaningless as that may be since one person cannot possibly comprehend and judge all the elements that go into a drum corps show with only one or two viewings. I only attended Semis (way up high) and Finals (Row 1, front and center), so I'll only comment on the Top 17, and provide my "scores." Also, I'm a brass player, so my more detailed comments are apt to be brass-heavy. 1. Cavaliers - 98.60 For me, they had the best "total package" of the night. Terrific blend of music and visual, great design and performances across the board. Unapproachable presentation and communication of theme, musically and visually. 2. Blue Devils - 98.30 At least their horn book wasn't junior high simple like in 2009. But every time I re-watch or re-listen I find a new flaw. Too much scatter drill. Too many unison jazz-runs from point A to point B (not much above scatter drill in difficulty level). Too much individual horn writing with not enough demand on ensemble sound. Too many visuals un-synched, especially at the opening with guard and corps running across the mirrors not quite in unison. Nearly every bit of hard drill performed while not playing. The drum line dug up more dirt than a backhoe. Were the Blue Devils' the cleanest corps on the field? No contest (even with that drum line). But cleanliness isn't everything, and (once again) I felt they had one of if not the least-demanding show design of the Top 5. That said, the horn runs about 5:00-5:30 into the show are just preposterous. Inhuman. I could listen to that 10-15 seconds of their show 100 times in a row and never tire of it. 3. Carolina Crown - 96.85 Hardest show on the field. Too hard, in fact. Khachaturian's 2nd, one of my favorites of the composer and a piece I'm pretty familiar with, was scored very, very thin in the brass. The articulations weren't clean enough. Intonation varied too much over the course of the show. That said, Crown was playing the hardest horn book on the field and freakin' RUNNING while doing it. Put the Blue Devils to shame in terms of difficulty attempted. Scale back on difficulty about 10% and put that 10% towards cleanliness and this show wins. Before they got worn down during the course of this beast, Crown's brass sound (Mahler's 2nd, pre-show) was EASILY the best of the night. Gorgeous, gorgeous, gorgeous. 4. Bluecoats - 96.60 This is easily the best the Coats have ever performed, but I can't say it's my favorite Bluecoats show. The design just left me wanting more. To me it never made up its mind if it wanted to be a really-dark, Orwellian kind of show, or a kind-of-dark, generically mild dystopian show, and kind of bounced back and forth between the two. 5. The Cadets - 96.25 Loved the show, my favorite Cadets show since 2005. That said, the post-Aungst drumline is really struggling. Well, by "Cadet" standards. The Cadets used to have an absolutely BEAST battery, year in, year out. Now? Five straight seasons their drumline hasn't reached 19.1 at Finals. EIGHTEEN corps have done so in those five seasons, but the Cadets not once. 7. Blue Stars - 93.40 Best Blue Stars show ever, IMO. Loved this show from top to bottom, and it had tons of effect. Design and performance wise, however, there's a big gulf between the Top 5 and the rest, IMO. Blue Stars just seemed a little off compared to Semis, so I couldn't put them ahead of SCV at Finals. 7. Santa Clara Vanguard - 93.40 Show has really, really grown on me. Love the show design, and the musical and visual interplay. But there were still too many performance ticks for me to place them ahead of the Blue Stars. 8. Phantom Regiment - 92.85 Pains me to put them here, but I was really, really looking forward to "Into the Light" and was pretty disappointed. Show has a lot of wonderful musical "moments" but the whole is not equal to the sum of its parts. Also, I look back on my twitter feed and I quote "I can't believe I'm saying this, but I'm not impressed with Phantom's brass sound. Both Vanguard and Blue Stars were better." Visually the show was a mess, and aside from the entrance/exit gimmick the show had absolutely zero visual "Wow!" moments. 9. Madison Scouts - 90.40 Yep, this show had its performance flaws, but it seems to me the GE judges simply don't account for ENERGY any more. I'm not talking about crowd response, but the fuel the corps brings to the performance. Scouts had that in spades over Boston, BK, the GMen, and even Phantom and Vanguard. 10. Boston Crusaders - 89.60 I still love the little hop/skip drill moves, I don't care what you say. Wasn't too thrilled with the show design, though, and it didn't seem to "fit" the corps very well. They didn't score very high in Musical GE with me, the overpowering "thunderous goo" from the synth didn't help. And now, because I have to get back to work, comments from my Friday night Semifinals twitter feed... 11. Blue Knights - 87.20 Wow, I can hear why BK's brass was beating SCV earlier this season. Their guard is having ISSUES tonight, however. Snares, I can hear your "DUT" from the upper deck. Shut. Up. Blue Knights have a very pretty show, both musically and visually. 12. Glassmen - 85.45 I'm unimpressed with fancy for the sake of fancy, which the Glassmen have a lot of. They're so clean I don't see how they miss Finals, tho. (side note: I was much more impressed with their Finals performance) 13. Colts - 82.00 Nice brass licks to start the Colts' show, but too much thunderous goo from the synth and the opening pit runs were inaudible. Colts guard guy in blue is annoying, not funny. How did Little Jeffrey get into this show. I love ya, Colts, but that show bored the hell out of me. And you're flagrant offenders of the unwritten thunderous goo rule. 14. Academy - 81.55 Percussion (both battery and pit) way overpowering the brass except during big chords. Honestly, I'm a little disappointed in The Academy. Drill design is muddy and unfocused, and the corps only sounds balanced when playing FF. 15. Spirit - 80.70 The progress of drum corps amazes me. This show would have been Top 10 7-8 yrs ago. Tonight it enters in 16th. Spirit: killer drumline, a few ensemble blend issues, but very impressive. The point of the screens was... what? 16. Troopers - 80.50 I hereby anoint the Troopers opening visual set "the Giant Moustache of Power." Not sure about those new unis, though: too generic. Better visual design, but musically I think both Spirit and Crossmen were better than Troop. 17. Crossmen - 79.85 First corps of the night: Crossmen. Their ensemble forms are terrible but they sound better than any 17th place corps I've ever heard. The more I hear Bb horns and amped pit, the more I like them. Really, who actually likes the harsh tone of those old G's? They're horrid. (edited to correct horrid massacre of its/it's usage and other grammatical pentimenti) Edited February 21, 2011 by hostrauser 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFZFAN Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 perhaps he was ranking them using his personal judging values...which, is, by the way, what this topic calls for. I would have had BD last, and SVC in 21st or 22nd, but my judging criteria is different than DCI's... My top twelve would look like... 1. Madison 2. Crown 3. Bloo 4. Cavies 5. Jersey Surf 6. Cadets 7. Blue Knights 8. Colts 9. Boston 10. Spirit 11. Pioneer 12. Academy My judging criteria is how I was personally entertained. I called it exactly as I felt it. I'm not an expert like Howdy though so I can't be taken seriously. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Here are the 2nd place finishing corps in DCI, and the first year they made it: Blue Stars 1972 Troopers 1973 Madison 1974 SCV 1975 Phantom 1977 27th Lancers 1980 BD 1981 Cavies 1990 Cadets 1992 Star 1993 Crown 2009 granted, some of those corps actually WON before they placed 2nd (But CI shows that they must have come in 3rd or 2nd before winning). Anyway, my goal was get the list of 2nd place winners, and to show that from 1993 to 2008 (16 years), not a single new corps made it to 2nd, until Crown in 2009. Furthermore, only 27th Lancers is "gone by circumstance." Star is gone by choice. Blue Stars, Troop and Scouts have gone away and come back, hardly "also-rans." Crown finished 4th in a year where a new corp joined the fray, Bluecoats. Crown has been at this for 20+ years, with a very tight organization, and strong CI within the DCI community. Conclusion: Crown is not going anywhere. They will be in the championship mix for years to come. The corps that needs to watch out is Bluecoats. It can be argued that Bloo's ascension to medal status was more a function of Crown "blowing it" than Bloo "earning it." As another poster pointed out, Crown's 2010 hornline was not up to snuff. Furthermore (and more importantly to design-oriented judges), Crown's show was so harmonically simple, it couldn't be taken seriously as a championship design. EVERY SINGLE HIT WAS IN B-FLAT, except one, which was A!--half step lower, lol. Bloo, Cavies and BD had harmonic languages light years ahead of Crown (and everyone else for that matter). Crown's idea of harmonic complexity is adding a flat 9 to a Gustav Mahler-handed-on-a-silver-platter Bb minor chord. In that regard, Crown "blew it" in 2010, making it "possible" for Bloo's excellence to be recognized, especially percussion. Don't get me wrong, Bloo's Guard was 1000% improved, and the perennially-excellent hornline stepped it up another notch as well. Some even think Bloo should've finished higher! Remember when Crown was undefeated? I think it was 11-0. Then they traded with Bloo for a bit, and then Bloo never lost to them. That happens because it takes time for judges to figure out how musically simple a show really is. That happens when "things become so obvious" that it overcomes CI. (Crown had all the pre-season CI; Bloo had 0) Bloo had a far superior show, and performed it a level higher than Crown! It was obvious, and the judges knew it, so they couldn't continue to keep handing it to Crown. Finally, now Bloo has some CI: They've medalled. They've learned some very important parts of "the formula." The question is: Will they continue to hone/learn the skills of the formula? Or will they "play it safe" like Crown did in 2010? Cuz if Bloo plays it safe, they'll be smacked in 2011 WAY HARDER than Crown was in 2010. I'd like to see your take on 3rd place 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan9 Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 perhaps he was ranking them using his personal judging values...which, is, by the way, what this topic calls for. I would have had BD last, and SVC in 21st or 22nd, but my judging criteria is different than DCI's... My top twelve would look like... 1. Madison 2. Crown 3. Bloo 4. Cavies 5. Jersey Surf 6. Cadets 7. Blue Knights 8. Colts 9. Boston 10. Spirit 11. Pioneer 12. Academy My judging criteria is how I was personally entertained. Admit it...you wish they all could be California Gurlz! Me thinks your judging criteria is a bit skewerzed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hostrauser Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I'd like to see your take on 3rd place 1972 Santa Clara Vanguard (next year: Champs) 1973 Blue Stars (next year: 12th) 1974 Anaheim Kingsmen (next year: inactive) 1975 Blue Devils (next year: Champs) 1980 Bridgemen (next year: 6th) 1981 Madison Scouts (next year: 5th) 1982 The Cadets (next year: Champs) 1986 Cavaliers (next year: 3rd) 1990 Star of Indiana (next year: Champs) 1991 Phantom Regiment (next year: 8th) 2010 Bluecoats (next year: ???) Some interesting numerical oddities. FOUR corps went on to win their first DCI Title the year after placing 3rd for the first time. Four corps also had finished 1st or 2nd before ever placing 3rd (Scouts and Kingsmen, 1st; Blue Stars and Phantom, 2nd). 11 different corps have finished 3rd, 11 different corps have finished 2nd, but only 8 make both lists. And there was a longer span between new bronze medalists than between new silver medalists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skewerz Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Admit it...you wish they all could be California Gurlz! Me thinks your judging criteria is a bit skewerzed! I like what I like...BD and SCV used to be my favorite corps...not so much now. I'm not a homer... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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