mr_mike09 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Yes.. back in 2008 a good friend put out a show which had a theme of love (falling in love, out of love, etc..) in Ind Open, with the idea of constant motion, like Onyx did and got nailed for it! NAILED! Their drill was very similar to what Onyx did the last two years, yet judges complained that they don't understand why they are doing this kind of drill, etc.. They didnt understand b/c it wasnt a cheesy show about love, it was more abstract, and less stagnant, b/c love is always changing, thus the constant moving.. etc.. One of those kind of shows! Needless to say you cant always try new things unless you have names behind you and are in world. Maybe that is why we keep seeing the same kinds of shows year after year in SA and SO Its possible that the guard that used a similar drill style to onyx wasnt rewarded because the guards execution wasnt as up to par as it is when Onyx does it...and that the judges didnt understand because the performers didnt deliver it strongly enough for the judges to see it...just because they did it...doesnt mean they did it well. Im of course trying to point out a possibility....i dont know of course....just trying to keep the discussion going...its an interesting topic!!! :) I do know of course that there are double standards in WGI...but Onyx was in 6th place in 09, and 8th in 08...they werent a judges favorite...by any means....is it impossible for them to have actually earned the place they have now? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiseUP79 Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Its possible that the guard that used a similar drill style to onyx wasnt rewarded because the guards execution wasnt as up to par as it is when Onyx does it...and that the judges didnt understand because the performers didnt deliver it strongly enough for the judges to see it...just because they did it...doesnt mean they did it well. Im of course trying to point out a possibility....i dont know of course....just trying to keep the discussion going...its an interesting topic!!! :) I do know of course that there are double standards in WGI...but Onyx was in 6th place in 09, and 8th in 08...they werent a judges favorite...by any means....is it impossible for them to have actually earned the place they have now? :-) Now we're discussing! Some interesting points! Although, I personally consider 6th place in IW nothing to shake your head at...it takes many groups years and years to break in that top tier in IW. '09...Onyx...loved that show. One of my favorites of the year. I think they were definitely headed in a unique, interesting, emotionally intriguing direction in 08 and 09 (and getting quite good at being 'them') and then seemed to "switch it up" in '10. 2010 Onyx certainly was one of three guards I think deserved to win (in my opinion). I thought it was very unique and they were good at 'it'. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Jeff maybe in the percussion forum...lol I was referring to there. I read both Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedova Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Its possible that the guard that used a similar drill style to onyx wasnt rewarded because the guards execution wasnt as up to par as it is when Onyx does it...and that the judges didnt understand because the performers didnt deliver it strongly enough for the judges to see it...just because they did it...doesnt mean they did it well. Im of course trying to point out a possibility....i dont know of course....just trying to keep the discussion going...its an interesting topic!!! :) I do know of course that there are double standards in WGI...but Onyx was in 6th place in 09, and 8th in 08...they werent a judges favorite...by any means....is it impossible for them to have actually earned the place they have now? yeah I believe that they worked hard and eventually won Gold, which they deserved.. I loved 09 show, which was 4th in prelims and in my opinion should have stayed in 4th place (i agreed with the prelims placements over the finals placements that year), and I even loved the very different production they put out in 2010. But this year was the fist year I do not agree with the placement. and I do think that the politics helped their placement! A very similar situation happen in 2004. When San Jose Raiders won gold in 2003 I was thrilled, loved the show..so happy I got to see it live, but the following year they put out a less than exciting show which wasn't executed as well as it could have been and they placed 4th, which I think was WAY too high. I just think that when you win Gold, its very rare that you are gonna drop out of the the top 5 or 10! and I think a lot of it has to do with politics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TubaJon Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 (edited) Just curious, who do you all believe truely should have beaten Onyx then. Even though many people didnt enjoy the show I thought the placements were actually right. Thoughts? Edited April 24, 2011 by TubaJon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TKYR_FA1986 Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 I think Braddock and Sac both should have placed higher. I just think that if you are in a Winter Guard competition you should spin equipment. I remember the days when EVERY person had to have a piece of equipment in their hands for an allotted time. I thought those rules were too rigid but having people who don't spin at all is a major MAJOR problem for me. I love Choctawhatchee but I have a problem with their use of those 5 dancing girls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TubaJon Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 (edited) I think Braddock and Sac both should have placed higher. I just think that if you are in a Winter Guard competition you should spin equipment. I remember the days when EVERY person had to have a piece of equipment in their hands for an allotted time. I thought those rules were too rigid but having people who don't spin at all is a major MAJOR problem for me. I love Choctawhatchee but I have a problem with their use of those 5 dancing girls. Given the rules in place, with allowing dance lines and such, would you still place those two ahead of Onyx. Regardless of if you liked the show or not. I do agree with your stance on everyone using equipment though. Edited April 24, 2011 by TubaJon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey joe joe jr Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 I think Braddock and Sac both should have placed higher. I just think that if you are in a Winter Guard competition you should spin equipment. I remember the days when EVERY person had to have a piece of equipment in their hands for an allotted time. I thought those rules were too rigid but having people who don't spin at all is a major MAJOR problem for me. I love Choctawhatchee but I have a problem with their use of those 5 dancing girls. didn't like anything about choctawhatchee and those dancers simply repeated the same five leaps and kicks over and over - i didn't think they added anything to the show at all. i believe another example of big talent wasted on a bad show. (side note: heart my heart that chactawhatchee and miamisburg both were out this year - i 'grew up' with these programs at wgi... ouch) i think the show would have been better and made more sense if the dancers weren't there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TKYR_FA1986 Posted April 24, 2011 Share Posted April 24, 2011 didn't like anything about choctawhatchee and those dancers simply repeated the same five leaps and kicks over and over - i didn't think they added anything to the show at all. i believe another example of big talent wasted on a bad show. (side note: heart my heart that chactawhatchee and miamisburg both were out this year - i 'grew up' with these programs at wgi... ouch) i think the show would have been better and made more sense if the dancers weren't there. I agree, I wasn't saying that I liked them this year. I should have said I have loved Choctwahatchee since the 80s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rochguardguy Posted April 25, 2011 Share Posted April 25, 2011 An intelligent conversation was started...negative comments and personal attacks were not part of it...and you still whine and complain. The topic is Onyx...that is what is being discussed. In a productive manner even. What is the need for a new topic? Might I suggest you stop looking here if you have such issues with (and problems contributing to) an intelligent conversation about 'flags in a gym'...which is what this entire forum is here to discuss. Scott Markham You should go back and read some of your posts...you obviously do not like Mr. Lentz and Onyx, you've made it quite clear through personal attacks and comments. I'm done with this conversation, it is not helping the activity one bit. as you say...best wishes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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