soccerguy315 Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 I should preface this with: I haven't seen them yet. That said: On July 21st last year, Crossmen were 3 points behind Spirit. At Allentown, Crossmen were 2 points behind Spirit. At Finals Crossmen were .4 behind Spirit. Also, Crossmen were 1 point behind Blue Stars at Allentown. It is important to remember that Crossmen were only the 12th place corps on the last Friday and Saturday of the season last year. IMO, Crossmen are "slotted" to start the season where they were the previous year, which is not the 12th place corps. The gap from Crossmen to Blue Stars, in 2 shows (very limited sample, especially this early in the season) went from 1.5 to .9 Regarding Spirit specifically, some people on DCP that have seen the show have tossed out the idea that they are ahead of the game right now, but that their show doesn't have enough difficulty and for that reason might start to plateau in the last couple weeks (this would happen if the shows is "maxed out") IMO, one of the things that could decide whether Crossmen will be comfortably in finals or fighting for the 12th spot the whole season will be how well the "protest" theme is visible and ties the show together. I assume they will be adding things throughout the season that might be very small individual changes, but help bring the show together. This would result in increasing GE scores (and, as GE goes, so go the rankings, most of the time) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayfallon Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 (edited) I should preface this with: I haven't seen them yet. That said: On July 21st last year, Crossmen were 3 points behind Spirit. At Allentown, Crossmen were 2 points behind Spirit. At Finals Crossmen were .4 behind Spirit. Also, Crossmen were 1 point behind Blue Stars at Allentown. It is important to remember that Crossmen were only the 12th place corps on the last Friday and Saturday of the season last year. IMO, Crossmen are "slotted" to start the season where they were the previous year, which is not the 12th place corps. The gap from Crossmen to Blue Stars, in 2 shows (very limited sample, especially this early in the season) went from 1.5 to .9 Regarding Spirit specifically, some people on DCP that have seen the show have tossed out the idea that they are ahead of the game right now, but that their show doesn't have enough difficulty and for that reason might start to plateau in the last couple weeks (this would happen if the shows is "maxed out") IMO, one of the things that could decide whether Crossmen will be comfortably in finals or fighting for the 12th spot the whole season will be how well the "protest" theme is visible and ties the show together. I assume they will be adding things throughout the season that might be very small individual changes, but help bring the show together. This would result in increasing GE scores (and, as GE goes, so go the rankings, most of the time) While I don't agree with your proposition that Crossmen are "slotted" I do think that you've hit the essence of where they're at - Blue Star and even Spirit are doing much more accessible shows and therefore more successful early in the season. My worry throughout this off-season was whether Crossmen could make the "protest" theme meaningful to a DCI audience (including judges). It's a simple concept intellectually, but crazy difficult to sell on a football field. You might as well be presenting a migraine headache in 10 minutes of music and movement. That being said, the show is well thought out, and more and more well performed. It's noteworthy that during their "Save the Earth" years 92 - 94 they struggled early on to convey the show, but brought it home magnificently by the end, including ending in a giant question mark at the end of 92 to show how truly difficult the concept was. Only time would tell, but I won't bet against them being out there on Saturday night. It's a worthy show, and a worthy bunch of kids. Hopefully the staff can interpret well enough to get it across. Edited June 25, 2013 by rayfallon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barigirl78 Posted June 25, 2013 Author Share Posted June 25, 2013 I want to add something to my commentary in regards to most people mentioning Spirit as the corps to compare Crossmen to. Spirit's been in the lower portion of the top 12 for several season and are making their jump. They also started last year very impressively. Before I make the following observation, I want to say that I love Spirit's show and it will probably be one of my favorites of the season. But, there is a design difference as it relates to the Crossmen and Spirit hornlines that is important to note and may become more important as the season progresses. Spirit is blowing people away with their brass line, but I noticed that during their most important sections of the music, the drill design has them standing still("park and blow"). In Crossmen's show, the drill has the hornline moving during some important hits. As a result, the hits are currentlynot as strong as they are when the corps is playing them in a standstill. But, if they can learn to march that drill AND perform the music, the ultimate impact will be spectacular and, I believe, they'll get credit for doing it. It's one of those things I'll be looking out for the next time I see them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 (edited) They're going to have better protest signs by the end of the season, right? Ones that don't look prefabricated and carry less anodyne slogans? (For instance, who exactly is attempting to criminalize thought?) Edited June 25, 2013 by N.E. Brigand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barigirl78 Posted June 25, 2013 Author Share Posted June 25, 2013 (For instance, who exactly is attempting to criminalize thought?) I think the sign you are referring to may be a variation on this: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Free-Thought-is-Not-a-Crime/265507950218149 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbones7480 Posted June 26, 2013 Share Posted June 26, 2013 (edited) They're going to have better protest signs by the end of the season, right? Ones that don't look prefabricated and carry less anodyne slogans? (For instance, who exactly is attempting to criminalize thought?) If you can read their signs from the stands, they must be doing their job. Edited June 26, 2013 by xbones7480 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanitape Posted June 26, 2013 Share Posted June 26, 2013 Spirit is blowing people away with their brass line, but I noticed that during their most important sections of the music, the drill design has them standing still("park and blow"). In Crossmen's show, the drill has the hornline moving during some important hits. As a result, the hits are currentlynot as strong as they are when the corps is playing them in a standstill. But, if they can learn to march that drill AND perform the music, the ultimate impact will be spectacular and, I believe, they'll get credit for doing it. It's one of those things I'll be looking out for the next time I see them. This is something I too am hoping will help. I know the Crossmen have a park-n-bark section, and I'm not complaining, but it has so much effect when a hornline is moving AND playing loud and proud. I think it will be a really positive thing for them GE-wise once they go through their "get louder" cycle. As of now, they're getting there. Some say their show has no where to go, but this right here is one example of why those who say that are wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted June 26, 2013 Share Posted June 26, 2013 I think the sign you are referring to may be a variation on this: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Free-Thought-is-Not-a-Crime/265507950218149 Even so, it's still a dumb slogan, and the Crossmen can do better. And presumably will do better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted June 26, 2013 Share Posted June 26, 2013 If you can read their signs from the stands, they must be doing their job. I disagree. Legibility is necessary but not sufficient. Setting aside the uncompelling slogans, the signs look too slick, as if the protesters had corporate backing. The Crossmen can do better. And I'm sure they will by season's end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFAN Posted June 26, 2013 Share Posted June 26, 2013 If the Crossmen are going to start making a move tonight Is it. They go on late and after colts , troopers , and stars. I am not sure what the issues are but their old nemeses VISUALS. I know they have great talent but if they are driving a volkswagen they will not win the race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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