Dear Mr. Acheson...

[HollywoodNeoCon]

Ok...let's start with this:

Using the Blackhawks as an example is extremely flawed

You say they have had sell outs the past 4 seasons. Well, the won 2 cups in the past 4 season, more than anything that would be the key

So, assuming you're either from Chicago or are otherwise a Blackhawks fan, you're aware that the team was regarded as one of the least successful sports franchises in the country until after Bill died in 2007, correct? My point was that increasing ticket sales and ad revenue allowed for a higher payroll, translating into the Empire of Toews and Kane. That's all.

Also, hockey is consider one of the big four American sports – it’s established, raising a teams profile in an established sport is much different then creating a market for a sports

Agreed, and I believe I mentioned that in my first post.

Wirtz corporation has gone under several drastic changes since the ole man died , to put it on a TV deal ignores how they run their other businesses and the interplay of them

The Wirtz corporation runs each of its interests in the same fashion as the Pritzkers, Trumps, etc: Differently, and for different reasons.

They did fire all their ticketing staff and move them to the United Center to change the culture

You may be right about the ticketing staff, but the move to the United Center was kinda necessary, considering the Chicago Stadium was demolished in 1995.

Oh, and the Blackhawks are losing money (think interplay of business again)

Of course they are. Return of the Jedi has also never made a dime. However, if you're claiming that the Wirtz Corp. is losing money on the Blackhawks, I'd say you weren't very well-versed in corporate economics and accounting practices.

I’ve worked with Wirtz on some stuff for more than 10 years, even a Blackhawks gig during the cup series – I’m not an expert but your view is a bit shocking and I’m not sure why you would try to make your point and then get it so wrong

For someone who acknowledges they're not an expert, you seem awfully well-versed on their business model. Congrats.

Didn’t you make a documentary movie of drum corps? Where is that? Where has it played? With your professed business acumen, I’d be curious of the actual results you achieved

No, the project never got underway, because the particular corps HBO Films had shown interest in pulled out after being told by the university hosting them that no release would be given for shooting on location. The corps had to leave on tour, and the delay meant that the money allocated for pre-production was spent elsewhere. The timing sucked. Period.

There is, however, a project in development for Logo (the LGBT-oriented cable network), which would be a reality mini-series with the working title, "The Guard." Make of that what you will. Until there is a sea change in how DCI deals with the myriad interest from the entertainment industry, I doubt it will get much further than development.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/prishe/2013/06/25/chicago-blackhawks-win-2013-stanley-cup-but-franchise-still-losing-money-by-undervaluing-ticket-prices/

Addressed above.

Thanks for your input, though.

EDIT: Look, cowtown, I apologize if my fisking came off as snarky, but c'mon, man...

I'm not claiming omniscience here. If I were, I'd be "that Oscar-winning producer who happens to have been involved in drum corps." I'm simply saying that the status quo is an exercise in redundant suckage, and that it shouldn't be so, considering that each and every person I've ever introduced to this activity first sees it on my TV, followed by a live show, and boom - it's in their blood. Doesn't it therefore follow that perhaps we should take advantage of the present lack of arts education in this country to bring this enduring activity to as wide an audience is possible? What's to dispute about that, I ask you???

Only in drum corps can a guy stand up and say, "You know what? I think millions more should see this," and be ridiculed as some modern-day Henry Hill.

Take that however you want. I'll be the one selling La Musica Cosa Nostra until I see as many people in the stands at Finals as I did when I first marched Finals in 1980, if not more so.

Edited July 1, 2013 by HollywoodNeoCon

[cowtown]

Ok...let's start with this:

So, assuming you're either from Chicago or are otherwise a Blackhawks fan, you're aware that the team was regarded as one of the least successful sports franchises in the country until after Bill died in 2007, correct? My point was that increasing ticket sales and ad revenue allowed for a higher payroll, translating into the Empire of Toews and Kane. That's all.

Except which came first...the players or the revenue? And then that salary cap thing that they are graduating in, pay roll is less now than in 2010

It was more a change of priorities with in Wirtz corp. as far as the Blackhawks role in their business model

You may be right about the ticketing staff, but the move to the United Center was kinda necessary, considering the Chicago Stadium was demolished in 1995.

Oh I am right, I know some that were let go except they were not working out of the Chicago Stadium in 2007, not sure why you would think they were? Silly

The Wirtz corporation runs each of its interests in the same fashion as the Pritzkers, Trumps, etc: Differently, and for different reasons.

Of course they are. Return of the Jedi has also never made a dime. However, if you're claiming that the Wirtz Corp. is losing money on the Blackhawks, I'd say you weren't very well-versed in corporate economics and accounting practices.

Those 2 statements of yours go better together, now add in my quip about Wirtz corp priorities - are you beginning to get the picture?

For someone who acknowledges they're not an expert, you seem awfully well-versed on their business model. Congrats..

Because I’ve worked on some things with them for over 10 years, through the Bill and Rockey years. I’ve seen some of the changes and the effects but I have not seen their books or sat in on their meetings, that is not my business

I’m not here to pop your bubble and I would like to see drum corps on TV again but your premise...I can't get past how poorly researched or how sloppy it is, it ruins it for me

[HollywoodNeoCon]

Except which came first...the players or the revenue? And then that salary cap thing that they are graduating in, pay roll is less now than in 2010

It was more a change of priorities with in Wirtz corp. as far as the Blackhawks role in their business model

Cow, I'm not sure where you're going with this...

The added revenue came from increased exposure. I'm not sure if you're debating that, but if you are, I don't know why.

Oh I am right, I know some that were let go except they were not working out of the Chicago Stadium in 2007, not sure why you would think they were? Silly

I was being polite in saying, "You may be right." I wasn't trying to impugn that you might not be. Secondly, when you mentioned the move to United Center as part of a change of culture, I was of course assuming that you meant the team, as well as the organization. If you were only referring to the ticketing staff, then I have no idea how that bears on what I'm saying.

I’m not here to pop your bubble and I would like to see drum corps on TV again but your premise...I can't get past how poorly researched or how sloppy it is, it ruins it for me

Wait, are you saying you're all for getting it back on the air, but because you don't like how I put together my argument, you're against it? That just doesn't make any sense!!!

Again, thanks for the input.

Edited July 1, 2013 by HollywoodNeoCon

[trh]

[N.E. Brigand]

Drumline Battle (despite the

)

I was holding my breath hoping that this didn't come to the fore, but I suppose it was only a matter of time and was not just my perception.

I mean ... if your audience is primarily composed of teenaged boys, probably a good idea to run it by a few before launching it. My students were giggling about it for about half a rehearsal when they saw it.

Oh, my. I hadn't paid any attention to that logo before. Dear oh dear oh dear.

[cowtown]

Ok...let's start with this:

So, assuming you're either from Chicago or are otherwise a Blackhawks fan, you're aware that the team was regarded as one of the least successful sports franchises in the country until after Bill died in 2007, correct? My point was that increasing ticket sales and ad revenue allowed for a higher payroll, translating into the Empire of Toews and Kane. That's all.

My fault for not being clear, let me try again then

Towes was a draft pick in 2006 and Kane was a draft pick in 2007

Wait, are you saying you're all for getting it back on the air, but because you don't like how I put together my argument, you're against it? That just doesn't make any sense!!!

You undermine the entire argument by presenting it so poorly, it works against our shared goal

add in a Blue Devil and Cadet alumni, Lords of the G7, attacking the ‘business’ of DCI and I smell sour grapes

There was another thread about this and it did a better job of making a case

[HollywoodNeoCon]

You undermine the entire argument by presenting it so poorly, it works against our shared goal

add in a Blue Devil and Cadet alumni, Lords of the G7, attacking the ‘business’ of DCI and I smell sour grapes

There was another thread about this and it did a better job of making a case

Ok, now I understand. The first casualty of the internet? Context. LOL

Fair enough. I fully respect that you don't dig how I got there, but I'm there nonetheless.

Now lets quit screwing around and start marketing this thing in the manner in which it deserves.

Edited July 1, 2013 by HollywoodNeoCon

[AlexL]

Beyond TV matters, i would say that DCI is shortsighted in its mis (non) use of youtube in favor of its niche (and outdated) fan network platform. For the gains it gets from a small number of people at $60 a pop (minus the costs of the platform) it loses a lot of exposure opportunity that could be getting a lot more people to show up in person. Yet some have this odd view that if they can see it on youtube they wont bother going to shows... which i think is exactly the opposite.

[danielray]

Embarrassing.

Well... best I can figure is that they somehow missed something, misunderstood or didn't read through the whole thing (I don't really have a habit of being brief).

[JimF-LowBari]

Yet some have this odd view that if they can see it on youtube they wont bother going to shows... which i think is exactly the opposite.

To keep this thread in the hockey spirit, this was the worry when a team (Toronto?) wanted to radio broadcast games in the 30s or so. So only the third period was broadcast until the "powers that be" realized it was drawing in more fans than losing.