jwillis35 Posted August 22, 2019 Share Posted August 22, 2019 16 hours ago, N.E. Brigand said: In all seriousness, garfield had a very thoughtful post in the middle of one of the G7 blowups in the early years of this decade in which he went to great lengths to try to see the big picture from the view of those corps. But really no one was able to make a strong As for other corps improving dramatically, I don't see it. Look at the "best of the 2010s" poll questions. Right now, the 10th place and 12th place favorites, i.e., those corps that are now seen as the ideal at those levels, are shows from 2011 and 2012, respectively. Other regular non-G7 finalist corps like BK and BS have yet to beat their pre-2010 best placements in the years since. The one big exception is BAC (although even they have yet to place higher than fifth), and yes, they did seem to be motivated in part by outrage at the G7 -- but they also appear to have been saving up for some time to buy the talent needed to move up. In the meantime, two of the G7, Cadets and Phantom, have been overtaken less because other corps are delivering better shows than Cadets and Phantom did in the early 2010s but because Cadets and Phantom are producing notably worse shows than they did before. I would agree with this. I do not think the 7th to 12th place corps are better today than say from 2000 to 2010. The Bluecoats 7th place show from 2007 (which was often beating some top 3 corps that year, is a far better and more competitive show than BK from this past summer. That's just one example. Your point about Cadets and Phantom is valid. They are not getting beat now days because BK, BS, Crossmen, Mandarins, etc., are better than what Cadets and Phantom used to be. Neither of these corps has approached the level that Cadets and Phantom were at years ago, but they are better than the present incarnation of Cadets and Phantom in large part due to upheaval, funds, etc. Boston made huge leaps because they picked up some of the Cadets music staff and Crown's visual staff -- and therefore are getting better recruits. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted August 22, 2019 Share Posted August 22, 2019 This post is silly even by DCP off-season standards 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted August 22, 2019 Share Posted August 22, 2019 21 hours ago, N.E. Brigand said: New era, new era, new, new, new, new era. Not just SCV has cited that phrase during recent seasons. In fact at least two finalist corps have that mantra listed with their 2020 audition material, yes Phantom? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted August 22, 2019 Share Posted August 22, 2019 9 minutes ago, Cappybara said: This post is silly even by DCP off-season standards If you are finished polishing "your" rings already, time for you to go back to school, ha, ha. Have a nice semester. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeRapp Posted August 22, 2019 Share Posted August 22, 2019 5 hours ago, garfield said: I'm obviously (I hope) no G7 apologist, but I firmly believe that the primary motivation for the G7 was the impression that no, or few, other corps were demonstrating a willingness or ability to "Get Better" and the Seven were tired of sharing resources with freeloaders. It's somewhat incongruous, therefor, to state that they believed they would always and only be the G7. Your point is valid, though, and factual and, ironically, the end result that I think many or most of the Seven were hoping to attain from the outset. I found that whole argument to be largely disingenuous, frankly, because the system DCI uses for scoring, and de facto open recruiting away from lower tier corps, effectively makes it almost impossible to be more competitive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2muchcoffeeman Posted August 23, 2019 Share Posted August 23, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, jwillis35 said: I would agree with this. I do not think the 7th to 12th place corps are better today than say from 2000 to 2010. The Bluecoats 7th place show from 2007 (which was often beating some top 3 corps that year, is a far better and more competitive show than BK from this past summer. That's just one example. Your point about Cadets and Phantom is valid. They are not getting beat now days because BK, BS, Crossmen, Mandarins, etc., are better than what Cadets and Phantom used to be. Neither of these corps has approached the level that Cadets and Phantom were at years ago, but they are better than the present incarnation of Cadets and Phantom in large part due to upheaval, funds, etc. Boston made huge leaps because they picked up some of the Cadets music staff and Crown's visual staff -- and therefore are getting better recruits. This is an argument that, top to bottom, DCI 2019 is of lesser quality than G7 2000. That's a hard sell. 4 hours ago, Cappybara said: This post is silly even by DCP off-season standards Yup. Edited August 23, 2019 by 2muchcoffeeman 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted August 23, 2019 Share Posted August 23, 2019 12 hours ago, jwillis35 said: I would agree with this. I do not think the 7th to 12th place corps are better today than say from 2000 to 2010. The Bluecoats 7th place show from 2007 (which was often beating some top 3 corps that year, is a far better and more competitive show than BK from this past summer. That's just one example. Your point about Cadets and Phantom is valid. They are not getting beat now days because BK, BS, Crossmen, Mandarins, etc., are better than what Cadets and Phantom used to be. Neither of these corps has approached the level that Cadets and Phantom were at years ago, but they are better than the present incarnation of Cadets and Phantom in large part due to upheaval, funds, etc. Boston made huge leaps because they picked up some of the Cadets music staff and Crown's visual staff -- and therefore are getting better recruits. I do believe 7-12 are better than ever. the key is 1-6 are better than ever and tighter than ever. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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