DCI's Next Director

[TOC]

1 hour ago, DAL-27 said:

With all that said, I hope the new director can figure out ways to change the model to reduce costs and/or figure out ways to increase funding so corps can better afford the costs associated with the activity.

I believe it's been brought up before, but where does many corps possibly buying together with a food supplier stand currently?  Companies like SYSCO might be interested.     

[DAL-27]

1 hour ago, cixelsyd said:

Here we go again.

I am sorry, but being stuck with an expensive line item A is not a valid excuse to splurge on unnecessary line item B. 

This is hilarious.  I just got through pointing out that it is unlikely that the next DCI CEO will have the opportunity to introduce a cost-cutting agenda.  That actually makes it off-topic for this thread... and still, people have to jump in here and argue over props, of all things.

I know.  That is why I only addressed "cosmetic changes", not necessary things like member safety, food and insurance.

I wasn’t arguing for or against props or as you put it ‘luxury’ items (or cosmetic changes).  I was merely pointing out that if completely eliminated, the activity is still very expensive on a per member basis.  Or as you put it, eliminate line item B and it’s still costly.  These ‘luxury’ items are not as big a part of the budget as most people think. I was simply trying to put forth an example (using realistic numbers) how much a budget would need to be cut (props and then much more) to get to where things would need to be to address your (and others) point on inclusion.

I’m pretty sure the next director will have this (or related topics) on their agenda.  The tour model needs to be looked at as it not sustainable long term.  I’d expect some changes.

[DAL-27]

51 minutes ago, TOC said:

I believe it's been brought up before, but where does many corps possibly buying together with a food supplier stand currently?  Companies like SYSCO might be interested.     

I believe this has been looked into.  As big as DCI is I don’t think there’s enough critical mass for SYSCO (or others) to be interested in a deal.

However, I thought there was an arrangement for pricing on tractor rentals.

[Jeff Ream]

5 hours ago, LabMaster said:

Not quite how it was meant.  It was a simple example.  Props costs are controllable because corps decide on the design, number, use, construction and so forth.  Food, fuel and housing are not as controllable because of market fluctuations and yearly economic changes.  Corps can’t really control market cost increases for those items.  But if you wish to be right then be right.  I wasn’t arguing with you.

yes they can control the cost to build props. and the more they have, the more they have to control the costs of transporting them...meaning extra vehicles, and people to transport them...and feed and house those people. oh and the fuel to move them.

 

so sure say $50k to build. but you don't take into account the other costs that $50k leads to

[Jeff Ream]

1 hour ago, TOC said:

I believe it's been brought up before, but where does many corps possibly buying together with a food supplier stand currently?  Companies like SYSCO might be interested.     

if i recall the hang up was on when and where deliveries could be made and the timing of deliveries being accurate

[Keith Hall]

A corps needs to do an experiment....

 

     Do a show with brass, percussion and guard. NO electronics (mics, keyboards, guitar and bass guitar, amps, etc), NO props for an entire year. Compare finances (from previous year or another corps). Also, cut back on staff for the year.

[TOC]

4 minutes ago, Keith Hall said:

A corps needs to do an experiment....     Do a show with brass, percussion and guard. NO electronics (mics, keyboards, guitar and bass guitar, amps, etc), NO props for an entire year. Compare finances (from previous year or another corps). Also, cut back on staff for the year.

Might be hard getting a corps to volunteer.  

[GUARDLING]

1 hour ago, TOC said:

Might be hard getting a corps to volunteer.  

AS hard as telling someone ( especially young ) no cell phones for 3 months, no computers and social media, etc. in 2023

[cixelsyd]

8 hours ago, DAL-27 said:

I wasn’t arguing for or against props or as you put it ‘luxury’ items (or cosmetic changes).  I was merely pointing out that if completely eliminated, the activity is still very expensive on a per member basis.  

... which is just a way of dismissing the idea of cutting costs.

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Or as you put it, eliminate line item B and it’s still costly.  

If you refer back to earlier posts, it is far more than just "line item B".  There are a number of non-essential changes that have inflated the cost of drum corps over time, such as two-month tours, truckloads of pit percussion, the complete catalog of band brass instrumentation, unlimited electronics, props, etc.  Without those costs, drum corps was far more inclusive, not just by cost-per-member, but at the level of having diverse corps in diverse communities, and many many more of them.

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These ‘luxury’ items are not as big a part of the budget as most people think.

Nor are they as small as they appear on the line item budget.  As we keep pointing out, it is not just the purchase price of the equipment, but also the costs of transporting, maintaining, insuring, and accommodating it at venues not designed for props, tarps, gigantic percussion pit arrays, or the vehicles carting them on/off the field.

If we refuse to address the costs we CAN control, we are really just dismissing the whole idea of controlling costs.  

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I was simply trying to put forth an example (using realistic numbers) how much a budget would need to be cut (props and then much more) to get to where things would need to be to address your (and others) point on inclusion.

That is why I included many more non-essential items in my list, which you did not address.  The big one is what I called out as the "two-month tour" in oversimplified terms.  In greater detail, WC corps spend 10-11 weeks in spring training and tour, both of which require all the expenses of operation except for the possibility of reduced fuel and vehicle needs during spring training.  Options are limited by membership requirements to tour from San Antonio on, competitive incentives to enter earlier contests to get judging input, and a plethora of other factors.  

Yes, there is still one way that a corps can opt to do a shorter season and still compete against all comers on Thursday of DCI week (and Friday/Saturday if you qualify).  But it is called "open-class", it is excluded from membership and governance, and it operates under purposefully harsher financial conditions imposed by DCI operations (i.e. many shows with no appearance fees).

We have seen a bit of de-segregation between OC and WC in show lineups in the past couple of seasons.  It is an incremental, but positive change.  If I could speak to the next DCI CEO, I would ask for more of that, please.

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I’m pretty sure the next director will have this (or related topics) on their agenda.  The tour model needs to be looked at as it not sustainable long term.  I’d expect some changes.

I am convinced the next DCI CEO will not have this on their agenda, unless a sweeping change of mission, bylaws and BOD composition brings a permanent end to the DCI dynamic of top corps setting the agenda for everyone else.  World-class is still full speed ahead.  Genesis cut their 2022 tour back as far as DCI protocol would allow.  Jersey Surf cut their 2023 back farther than that, but appear to have made a deal to retain WC status in the process.  SCV cut their whole 2023 season.  And DCI sails on.

[Jeff Ream]

2 hours ago, Keith Hall said:

A corps needs to do an experiment....

 

     Do a show with brass, percussion and guard. NO electronics (mics, keyboards, guitar and bass guitar, amps, etc), NO props for an entire year. Compare finances (from previous year or another corps). Also, cut back on staff for the year.

the lack of equipment costs for electronics won't be much. props will help. finding  qualified staff that commit for a longer period of time will be a monster challenge in todays world.

so costs may go down, but so may quality