mobrien Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 (edited) The whole concept of this kind of thread is a little self-serving. There are some Cadets fans who want to pretend that their corps is being persecuted for being so 'cutting edge', when in fact most people are either saying that they like or don't like some of what they do on the field. "Let the Cadets be the Cadets" - I'm sorry, is there a citizens with pitchforks movement out there to guard the field against them? Not that I've seen, and I've seen Garfield literally dozens of times over the last 32 years. Guys, if you're doing something that has already been done before, it's not 'cutting edge' anymore. If you have 'characters' on the field, it's only cutting edge if you're Madison or Cavaliers circa 1971. If you use mic'd vocals, you're only doing what's been done dozens of times in both bands and drum corps. If you use tables, etc, well, I've seen THAT dozens of times too. So if Cadets' show does it for you, great. If it doesn't, fine. But if you like it and others find parts of it silly or ineffective, it's a little presumptuous to assume it's because those who don't care for it are close-minded or "anti-art." Maybe it's just not their taste. It's a big world, and there's plenty to pick from... Edited June 26, 2006 by mobrien Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geneva Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 I posted this on the Powder Springs review thread then noticed this thread where it would be more in line with the thread's mainstream. Concerning the Cadets vocals and overall show design of the past two seasons, I am not totally averse to vocals (I actually liked their drumspeak), but... I feel sorry for the judges. How do you compare this type of performance to a more conventional drum corps show? As a proud alumnus of drum corps' "stone age", I believe that as drum corps progress down the path of "symphonic" sound they are losing sight of the type of sound that first identified drum corps as a unique musical genre. Drum corps will never be able to emulate the sound or sight of a symphonic band/orchestra or a broadway-style musical production. I know that I am left feeling a little empty when I watch this pursuit that only the handful few can even come close to pulling off and which leads to far more dismally bland performances. I buy tickets to a drum corps show hoping to experience a passionate brass and percussion performance elevated by stunning visual display which is best exhibited on a football field. I am hoping to witness a performance which brings out the best aspects of the characteristics of that instrumentation and not a performance which reminds me of how much it misses the mark achieved by a symphonic orchestra/band or stage production. In a word, I come to a drum corps show for that unique visceral sound that ONLY a drum corps can create, blemishes and all. If I want to hear a complete and near-perfect performance, I go to the concert hall or stage. I have often heard George Hopkins iterate that they are going down the path of what type of production their performers want to do instead of conforming to the pre-conceived notion of what a drum corps is. I disagree with this laissez-faire attitude which flys in the face of what the activity has collectively learned over the years about the idiom. Sure, part of drum corps has always been to experiment, but I believe there should be limits to this process or the end result will be surreal and enigmatic productions which satisfy only the designers and some of the participants and dismiss the rest of us. If George Hopkins thinks this is best for his organization, take the big step and go "pro" like Star of Indiana or develop a concert/stage show instead of trying to compete on a drum corps field with a product which is barely recognizable as part of the genre. It is sad for me to witness a dilution of the inherent strength of a performance by elements which really don't belong out there on a drum corps field. Just my opinion, of course. Thanks for letting me get it off my chest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxwellNotes Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 It is no longer" Drum and bugle corps : Tradition, history, repetitivness" This doesnt make any sense and is obviously stated by someone who has no respect for the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 It is no longer" Drum and bugle corps : Tradition, history, repetitivness"This doesnt make any sense and is obviously stated by someone who has no respect for the past. I think the original poster was just making a comment about what the front page of DCI.ORG says now (the Major League stuff) as opposed to before the latest change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madscout96 Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 All that said, I believe there needs to be a place where you can voice your displeasure with design and maybe even performance. Just realize you can't insulate the performer from your comments about the design. Doesn't mean you shouldn't make them but the two are intimately connected. You can't separate the performer from what is being performed. That place you speak of, where you can voice your displeasure with design, is not only DCP, but www.yea.org! Did you see the "hate letters"? I'll post the link even though someone already did. http://www.yea.org/site/News2?page=NewsArt...ws_iv_ctrl=1002 Hop may be alot of things, but dumb isn't one of them. I'm sure he's well aware of what he's getting is corps, its members, and designers into. He knows that there are lots of people who didn't like what they did last year and don't like what they're doing this year. I'm sure that he and the staff talked to the kids to prep them for negative feedback, even negative crowd reactions. "You know guys, there are some drum corps fans who will be quite vocal about how they don't like what you're doing." Maybe he told them to disregard it, that it's criticism for HIM and the staff, NOT for the kids. Perhaps it was a similar talk that Jim Mason had with Star of Indiana members in 1993. Those kids knew they were going to be booed. And some of them actually hyped on the boos like they were Barry Bonds! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greggmanX-Kingsmen Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 WW are not legal elements of DCI drum corps...amps and singing are. Who is this 'We' you refer to? I started in 64, yet I disagree with you 100%. We = The faction who marched drum corps in the 60's, 70's whom believe woodwinds, amps and singing belong in marching bands, not drum corps. And I never claimed everybody holds my opinion.........but, I believe you already knew that. Also, I don't care "the rules" allow singing & amps. It still does not belong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 True. But they are a tiny, insignificant minority, not unlike you and your opinions to the opposite. Hmmm....look at the shows...check out the Cadets souvie booth. Lots of fans there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbc03 Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 (edited) True. But they are a tiny, insignificant minority, not unlike you and your opinions to the opposite. I think that at the average drum corps show you'll find that the tiny insignificant minority are those that really care either way about whether or not amps are legal in DCI. I would even say that if you polled the entire audience 50% or more wouldn't know that amps used to be illegal. Edited June 26, 2006 by dbc03 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patrickzampetti Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 Nice post Tim. In my mind, the alternative to creating "entertaining" shows is to create non-entertaining shows. A dead end for the activity that not even the straightest company fronts and loudest brass whole notes could remedy. Somehow, I have found a way to respect and admire the tradition, applaud the performers, be impressed by the creativity of the show designers, and still be proud to have marched in a corps who's motto could well be "the tradition is innovation". It is not so hard to do. As far as the Cadets go, they seem to be stuck in the rut of innovation and what a lovely rut it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMichael1230 Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 you're only off by a syllable.. should be 5 - 7 - 5.Here's one of my own, completely off the top of my head: People should relax. Drum Corps is far from dead, folks... Wait and see what's next! Stef Music sounds so good love to hear it every day please dont use no amps ~G~ (I dont know why, but yours got me excited ! ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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