Need help with BD Chop and Paste, Walk and Stand approach to design

[Stu]

22 minutes ago, Cappybara said:

Gotcha. Well the answer is complicated isn't it? It's hard to describe difficulty because there's so many ways to go about it as you just demonstrated in the post I'm quoting. 

True, but for the last ten years or so many shows seem to have been just designed for the fast changing fast paced fast notes fast movement throughout 100% of the 11.5 min for the enjoyment of those with ADD, with no time in that 11.5 min for the rest of us to drink in the beauty of some lush sounds and quiet respets.

Edited July 28, 2017 by Stu

[Cappybara]

5 minutes ago, Stu said:

True, but for the last ten years or so many shows seem to have been just designed for the fast changing fast paced fast notes fast movement throughout 100% of the 11.5 min for the enjoyment of those with ADD, with no time in that 11.5 min for the rest of us to drink in the beauty of some lush sounds and quiet respets.

Hmm i somewhat agree and disagree. 

I do agree that the shows of today aren't like what we had in 80s. One piece of music evolving for a whole movement IS rare

However, I do think that there is enough variety from corps to corps for me to say that your description above is over-generalizing as a whole. 

Edited July 28, 2017 by Cappybara

[3PoC]

46 minutes ago, Stu said:

Yes, but the charts over the past few years or so were not arranged as music to reflect the original compositions, but we're chopped, bopped, cut, and pasted at the direction and pleasure of the almighty visual staff.

The chopping of arrangements is an attempt to hold the attention of short attention span general audiences (and keep the GE on rapid fire for judges) by cutting out the spaces between the big moments and impacts. Not because they are trying to be artsy (with some exceptions). Some groups I think are still doing well with staying true to longer, more coherent stretches of the original material (Bloo's opener and closer, BD's ballad for example). Hopefully the success of these efforts will encourage more fully developed musical phrases and arrangements in the future.

[Cappybara]

19 minutes ago, 3PoC said:

The chopping of arrangements is an attempt to hold the attention of short attention span general audiences (and keep the GE on rapid fire for judges) by cutting out the spaces between the big moments and impacts. Not because they are trying to be artsy (with some exceptions). Some groups I think are still doing well with staying true to longer, more coherent stretches of the original material (Bloo's opener and closer, BD's ballad for example). Hopefully the success of these efforts will encourage more fully developed musical phrases and arrangements in the future.

Yup!! I will admit that as a member of the generation labeled as "ADD," I do enjoy the stimulation from seeing and hearing many things at one time. Of course, I do also enjoy hearing full length pieces so it is not some mutually exclusive thing. I can be a fan of both styles. 

I'm just not vehemently against the chopping of music as the older fans are. The way I see it, the chopped up arrangements are like a puzzle. I enjoy seeing the creative ways designers can come up with linking one piece of music to another. As an example, even though I'm not much of a fan of the show overall, I loved the way Crown linked Somewhere and Somwhere over the rainbow in 2009. So creative.

The more traditional fans can yell and scream about these chopped up arrangements as much as they want, but there's no denying that for the younger fans, there's an appeal to today's style of show design. 

Edited July 28, 2017 by Cappybara

[Stu]

1 hour ago, 3PoC said:

The chopping of arrangements is an attempt to hold the attention of short attention span general audiences (and keep the GE on rapid fire for judges) by cutting out the spaces between the big moments and impacts. Not because they are trying to be artsy (with some exceptions). Some groups I think are still doing well with staying true to longer, more coherent stretches of the original material (Bloo's opener and closer, BD's ballad for example). Hopefully the success of these efforts will encourage more fully developed musical phrases and arrangements in the future.

Placating those with ADD, how lovely.

[3PoC]

20 minutes ago, Cappybara said:

Yup!! I will admit that as a member of the generation labeled as "ADD," I do enjoy the stimulation from seeing and hearing many things at one time. Of course, I do also enjoy hearing full length pieces so it is not some mutually exclusive thing. I can be a fan of both styles. 

I'm just not vehemently against the chopping of music as the older fans are. The way I see it, the chopped up arrangements are like a puzzle. I enjoy seeing the creative ways designers can come up with linking one piece of music to another. As an example, even though I'm not much of a fan of the show overall, I loved the way Crown linked Somewhere and Somwhere over the rainbow in 2009. So creative.

The more traditional fans can yell and scream about these chopped up arrangements as much as they want, but there's no denying that for the younger fans, there's an appeal to today's style of show design. 

Today's younger generations have been immersed in post-modern culture most of their lives - particularly when it comes to music and visual aesthetics. Think of vj's, dj's, hip-hop producers (let alone internet culture) and the creative remixing of small but signifying bits from anywhere into a new creative form that largely disregards the intent of the originators of those bits. The younger you are, the less likely you are to find this aesthetic jarring or un-natural. Many of the older folks would just like to remind the whippersnappers to not entirely abandon the beauty of longer, more fully developed thoughts in musical expression.

[Fred Windish]

3 minutes ago, 3PoC said:

Today's younger generations have been immersed in post-modern culture most of their lives - particularly when it comes to music and visual aesthetics. Think of vj's, dj's, hip-hop producers (let alone internet culture) and the creative remixing of small but signifying bits from anywhere into a new creative form that largely disregards the intent of the originators of those bits. The younger you are, the less likely you are to find this aesthetic jarring or un-natural. Many of the older folks would just like to remind the whippersnappers to not entirely abandon the beauty of longer, more fully developed thoughts in musical expression.

Perhaps . . .  one reason why certain music rights holders are reluctant to put their demonstrated successful compositions in the hands of modern drum corps arrangers!

[c mor]

checking in.   50 pages - any resolutions yet?

[Jeff Ream]

20 hours ago, Stu said:

Ahhhh…. that explains it then.  Since the design concepts are apparently so deep that the likes of Carlson, Howell, Rothe, Bell, Wernhoff, Stone, Jones, Davis, Gray, Kelly, Waymire, and Fugett are required to be educated and enlightened by the design teams to gain understanding, that sure as shootin’ explains the massive disconnect most corps have had with the paying public in the stands!  So, thank you.

that disconnect is less and less every year for the last 4 years. stop being so 2012

[Jeff Ream]

12 hours ago, Stu said:

For the last few years DCI has mandated the Visual GE judges to take into account how Music GE ties in with Visual and adjust their evaluations accordingly. And since that is the case, the dots I connected with the postings by you and Mello prompted me to ask why would a GE evaluation of the Black Page automatically trump a GE evaluation of Adagio based solely on difficulty if both were performed equally well.

audio to visual coordination has been a part of GE for eons