Tapper7

Calling a Corps show a "bando" show = Shows that are essentially weak or stunted in terms of basic execution or overly boring. I call 'em "clown shoes" ... definitely saw some clown shoes this year from a few corps, but I can't put them on blast here because it's in poor taste. Calling a DC an MB is an insult unless it's coming from a casual fan who isn't aware of the difference - seems like normally about a tenth of the audience has never been to a show. I live in SoCal and stopped trying to explain drum corps years ago...if someone wants to know or is a woman I'm dating that I'd like to introduce to the activity, I'll take her to a show where BD and SCV will both play - then it's self-explanatory. Just point and say "That's Drum Corps"

Really...I see you are new so you should know it's considered bad form to trash any corps period on DCP - we constructively criticize. It seems like Garfield is taking a beating in this thread and I wanted you to know the community normally doesn't do that. There are other places on interwebz to bash the Cadets. Im not sure if you are a fan, alumni or what so I'll say what I know about The Cadets in a considerate, respectful manner. The 1st time I saw them live was on tour in 96 at mile high stadium. They opened with Copland's Tenderland and I loved it. I still listen to that show. "The American West" f--- yeah! The following year, a few people I'd marched with were now IN the Cadets. I read through the Lead Baritone part it was no joke. Drill was hardcore too. BD, SCV and Cadets got along really well on tour...At the Night Beat show, George Hopkins threw down big bucks to throw a huge party for all three corps. That was the 1st time I met him and he is a super-chill dude in person. I disagree with nearly ALL of his policies and rule changes from Bb to Amps to Reeds to French Horns to voice-over to this awful keyboard I heard a few corps using... If he's for it im against it - that doesn't mean I dislike The Cadets or George in any way. I always respect the way they double down on degree of difficulty, attention to ensemble detail and the most exposed uniform that shows every mistake every year, that takes guts and I'm down w/ that. They should not have won in 93, but again...not their fault, people don't seem to get that Garfield isn't responsible for that. It's an adjudication issue which also bad form to trash them period. Best practice is just let numbers exists separate from artwork, numbers are only good for gambling - instead it causes endless, unwinnable, needless bickering. This is an online community intended to celebrate drum corps - we party it up in person. Fan, vet, parent, staff any corps any yr. you like drum corps? you can kick it with me. The posters blatantly putting down your corps will naturally find their way to other sites....I'll apologize to you on behalf of them. Tapper is sorry that Garfield is being repeatedly thrown under the bus in this thread. Garfield is the #### and everyone knows that - end of story. Thank you to all who left kind and constructive, thoughtful posts regarding individual drum corps. Please note that saying someone's show past or present is or was "cheesy" is a pretty jacked thing to say. You know the members ditch girlfriends, all their money, jobs, their families, grades, college....pretty much everything under the sun just to march right? I'd hate to think I worked a 1000 hours of bingo--- inhaled enough smoke by 16 it would sicken you, home-schooled myself, shredded my 4.0 GPA got into brawls, tortured by evil viz techs, had my entire collection of Jazz CD's stolen, nearly got myself run-over and stabbed in some BAD neighborhoods, went stranded, hungry and homeless multiple times while on tour and bled on the field of honor for something that could be summed as "cheesy"?? I should hope not - also its a synonym for ######. That was the worst shot at Garfield ive seen in awhile and its right here on THIS page - low blow man.

Canton wins DCI or riot. High Brass Caption too. Dean is making magic happen again as only a genius can. If you havent heard 'em on YT yet....do that. Hit a show if ur w/in 500 mile driving distance, would if I was..... 100 percent chance they take "High Audience" ....as for things we can't control, I only see one way they DONT get their 1st ring. Only one because - Crown proved the club is still open...but it's whatever .... BC's gonna shoot the lights out at DCI and that's going to be a historic moment. I'm not going to touch on design or if "it works" or "has cohesion" or whatver This is the kind of corps that may re-write, revoice, toss the drill and start from scratch for an entire production or two. The kids are at the level they can memorize new parts and learn new drill - insta-clean on the fly--- same-day delivery. These guys are probably on show version 1000 by now ....by DCI they'll be pushing two. Could Make a huge change DAY OF finals, why not? It's been done, it's doable. So I think design will be a better topic POST-Nats. If you are counting them out due to design cuz "the show is done," you don't know the heavies working behind the scenes. I promise you this show ain't done till downbeat on Game Night. Then we'll pick it apart with tweezers. amirite? Yes I can hear the technical problems still, which is troubling, still I think they can get the feet out the sound and cure all the release & phase issues - I'm hearing far worse from corps that in the past were miles ahead of them. Worst case - you can always pull out the hose for degree-of-difficulty for drill or music - it won't come to that. They're primed to peak at finals and that's really what counts. Think of the corps that lost who indisputably peaked on Saturday Night; 87 Vanguard, 1990 Star (4th!) 92 BD, 93 Star...95 Madison....for you old-school cats 1980 Big 27, 1980 Bridgemen for that matter, feelin' me on this? BC's won over countless new fans, from the casual, the snobby hacks like me, to the legit right up to the legendary. Well-deserved, hard-fought and won. COPS:INDIANAPOLIS put it on Fox, I wanna see Garfield get zip tied. On behalf of all SoCal hacks I cast our vote for BC I'm all in--- agree w/ me or dont. It's the right thing to do. I might even donate a tank of diesel to this. Huge shout out to Canton Ohio....Huge shout out directly from Los Angeles. This corps is doing right by all of us, the activity, themselves, keepin' it real ....keeping drum corps smart, tough and hip. I can only think of 3 other corps going way out their way and taking risks with audience-tailored shows -a healthy mix of class, style, fresh ideas, tradition and talent at all levels. They're doin' it old-school with the Gansta-lean....and DCP we need to get behind that. GO BlueCoats!

I can and do. Got a great deal of corps-stories and multimedia content on my site/drum_corps 1st post should be a 1996 judges tape a colleague unearthed and rescued from the hall before it was seized and shut down permanently by a tax-collection agency to remain nameless.

I wish they'd all go back to Kanstuls...or Kings. Yamaha's are ok, same w/ Jupiter, just plz no Degs or Dynastys -blecch!

House Seawright and House Royer. Summer is Coming....

too early...sounds impractical. Like/appreciate an open-minded approach of re-thinking DCA Nats .... yet early Sept. will always be the sweet spot. edit - just noticed this thread has deprecated into veiled NJ Mob references.... "Webistics Christopher - we cold-call retirees and get them to invest --pump and dump"--probably the most hilarious ponzy from The Sopranos (and apropos; natch)

Jack Meehan went to the last camp to scope out the 2015 Devs...that's a massive compliment in itself. it is when the Godfathers crawl out of the woodwork that you know a corps has got some pre-season synergy and momentum. I wonder if the kids know what a massive honor it that Jack was there...Oh wait...I'm sure John indoctrinated any n00bs who didn't know his father practically built the West Coast Horns scene single-handedly. Had Zig design Bugles that resolved all pitch problem, invented all our common warmups and classics like F Tuning, even the marks on the horn, check the wind, temperature and barometer, then assign each section to pull out or push in X number of marks. Peimitive, but it works. Last weekend I was at this "blues festival" where bands that aren't blues bands by any stretch of definition phoned in performance after weaksauce performance. All but Los Lobos...they rocked out. It made me sad cuz BB King had played live on this stage 3x ...I'd seen him every time. King NEVER phoned in a live show. Members of BD and SCV know there will be hell to pay if they ever insult the fans with a half-2$$ed phone-in. As some no name band struggled through "All right now," 12 bar Bb blues, down tempo, no swing, flat w/ a rotten ensemble sound to even the most pedestrian music fan.... I remember wishing I was at Mars, chillin' with Jack and checkin out the 2015 program. Would've been incalculably more fun. Can't wait to hear Concord throw down this summer. Bring back the ball$-out solos with double-C's and all that Jazz, please! Concord's showmanship was on fire last July when I saw them live... Hopefully there weren't too many age-outs. I'd like to see BD kick it up into a higher gear. I know they can do it. I trust they will. Jack was there, what else do I need to know? Looking forward to more granite to reinforce the West Coast Drum Corps Legacy. With out Sr. circuit on life support, Jr's struggling and div2/3 the worst kind of uphill battle (exception: Cadets Corps and BDB) - it's the continued growth and life of these two corps that keeps our shared history alive - and I sleep easy knowing that these Corps ARE HERE, WERE HERE and ain't goin NOWHERE! No matter what happened to drum corps as a whole out here. I'm confident Santa Clara and Concord are immortal...etched in reinforced steel and concrete. They'll fold when the sun rises in West and sets in the East. Terminal Drum Corps. House Royer and House Seawright. Tradition, honor, talent, hard work, sacrifice and a commitment to World Class showmanship. The numbers, medals and rings are merely by-products, thoug they hard-fought and won consistently. But no placement can compare the consistency of class, tradition, glorious visuals blood-boiling, barn-burner shows; designed to get you on your feet, out of your head and into the show. I'll take a five standing O's over a victory concert any day. Ask 95 Madison, 93 Star, 92 VK or 92 SCV. I miss the shows designed for applause, not numbers. If anyone can bring it back old-school; it's the BD/SCV West Coast tradition. I hope all corps (even just one) bust out an old-timey crowd-pleaser. After all, fans ultimately fund it all. Numbers are just that - ink on paper, v/o on tape. A packed stadium of hardcore fans losing their minds and cheering themselves hoarse is crucial to all aspects of the activity. They're the ones who hit the souvie booth, buy more tickets, make pilgrimages to DCI and donate to corps of their choice. If BD is building a show around this old-timey concept; I will be infinitely grateful. 2014 was bad a--, but still many parts of the show seemed overly abstract; presumably to please the Green Shirts. Right on Devst. It's those 80s and 90s tapes that brings the best horns and battery in the world to show up in The Bay Area to fight it out for spots...in a state where most people will look at you like a space alien if you mention "Drum Corps." "huh?" "what's that?" *sigh* Bummer there are only two left...but it's a helluva two. It makes up for all the heavy losses we've had - keeps hope alive for the whole scene. If these corps outlive me I'll die a happy man. Do it up Devs!

Now I'm a bit OT again sorry....Fran & JimFXB I highly recommend it. 80,000 people read my last show rvw...(Glendora-SCV/BD-2014) and 110,000 have stopped by in the last 90 days ----we haven't even hit the season....No not much $ in it, but the satisfaction comes from doing what I love. Happy to help no charge if you guys want to get started. -Much humility, love and respect to all readers. - Tapper

Thx for the info JimFXB...sorry to go OT but #### you n Fran have a lot of posts! ---->Y'all should get blogs if you don't already have them I always enjoy reading content, threads, topics etc et.al. from both of you.

thx Toby! Bump.

I've wondered the same thing...After a long volunteer weekend in SoCal last summer...I had a bit of bus trip to get from Glendora to South Orange County. I was stranded in Huntington Beach and had to wait five hours for the 1 bus to take me home. There were lots of unsavory characters around I remember saying a mantra to myself "DONT FALL ASLEEP DONT FALL ASLEEP (etc)" I knew I'd get jacked if I did. I had my SCV jacket AND my VK jacket in one of two bags. With an hour left to wait...I drifted off for ~15mins. Upon waking, the bag with both jackets (with my original Star - the one I wore on the field @Finals, my 97 Member Shield, My 97 DCI Finals Patch, my original SCV Member Jacket, my VK Jacket AND my prescription glasses -taken right off my face)...GONE! the glasses, though expensive to replace, were. the VK jacket- sucks that it's gone - irreplaceable. Only saving grace is I never affixed any patches to it cuz I thought it looked better that way. the Santa Clara Jacket - My Star, Shield and DCI Patch ....a 4 in 1 - all gone..all irreplaceable. I'm hoping to gain some sort of info in order to ascertain the outside chance that the Hall still has an extra Shield...as for the Star, though....I will be asking very nicely for a new one...the jacket just...isn't right w/o the "badge." (to cover the stitched one that comes w/ an Alumni Jacket). As for the DCI Finals Patch? ....meh. This summer I will inquire in person while cooking or consulting or whatver it is exactly that I do at camps...li'l of everything you know? If anyone can help me in my search - mainly for a 97 Green Shield Patch and a Star (any-plastic-metallic) would be appreciated. spc. thx to OP for posting this topic. Note that I am not interested in DCI patches, but I have a bunch of 96, 97 and 04 ones. They are not for sale but I would trade ALL of them for my Shield and Star.

There doesn't have to be a theme...but if a drum corps show doesn't move the audience in a specific direction...emotionally; towards something tangible...it lacks GE...score suffers...personally I don't care. Here's a sample non-themed show template: -Open with "Folk Song Suite" or "Birdland" -Insert Drum Solo -Insert Ballad -sprinkle entire show with lots of brass solos, small ensembles, CG solos, stick-tosses and sabre/rifle/flag tosses.... -Insert at least one Soprano Screamer Soloist Sparingly -Insert visual feature.... -Insert Drum Solo/Viz feature version2.... -Insert something jazzy ("Channel 1"), funky(ToP, EL&P...) or rockin (BS&T, Chicago, A Latin-Jazz Barn Burner like "A Mis Abuelos" or some other fan-fave like "One More Time") for the 3rd production and .... -Close with a tear-jerker ("Tenderland", "Don't Cry For Me..." "When a Man Loves A Woman" ..."Niner-Two"...u get the idea). There you go. Show done. only problem: not making finals hurts the bottom line BADLY...so whatre ya gonna do? ------->DO IT REALLY REALLY RIDICULOUSLY BAD @$$. Technical superiority and audience approval will probably make up for the drag on GE due to "no clear show direction" or "no theme." Some Director (and/or Board of Directors) just needs the cojones to bust out an old-school show designed to blow the stadium over...not necessarily win...but that would break 90 for sure & get the corps into Finals...everyone who plays on Saturday Night gets the same cut of the ticket sales last time I checked.

I remember Drum Corps West shows were usually DM-only retreats...nice for the performers...weak for the audience. The first real one was at the 1st Regional: Mile High Stadium. Back east we trooped the line at every show (Drum Corps Mid-West and Drum Corps East). We'd guard our ranks fanatically on the way in, during and trooping the line out. We'd form a block, be called to attn. when our score was announced...set-back to parade-rest....play America/OCanada...going for a high F, doubleA or doubleC for the open [concert] Cmaj chord at the end as loud as humanly possible....and if we won...we'd get to perform a victory stand-still on the track which is BEYOND FUN FOR EVERYONE CONSIDERED. They still do a full retreat at DCI...and I haven't been since it became entrenched in Indy...so I guess the answer is no....but would I travel a long distance (say, hop on a plane and book a hotel room...) just for that one extra thing? NO. There's usually a few corps that will do standstill park-and blows for the fans in the lot BEFORE AND AFTER most shows-that makes up for the lack of a legit-retreat in most cases.

If we intend to use Occam's Razor correctly- begin with the following: "All things being equal-the simplest solution is the correct one." In the 90s, if it rained...the show went w/o a front ensemble. Water damages keyboards and marimbas-can't change that! ...if it rained hard...we did standstills under awnings so the fans who've driven hundreds of miles and spent lots of money to see us don't miss out on the music...which is the right thing to do...sometimes shows get rained-out- DCI doesn't obligate corps to even show up when this goes down.... It is dangerous enough to jazz-run and make high -speed direction changes and pass-thrus on a wet field...wet sockets, wires and plugs? Fuggetaboutit! unsafe...even for drum corps. This is clearly going to be a problem moving into the future as technology evolves along with the activity. I recently caught a YT clip of BlueCoats 2014 Closer and yes...there would be a dramatic decrease in General Effect if a transformer or a gennie blew.... Applying Occams Razor again...we can see (above) that a Hall-of-Fame, Grammy-winning Producer and Life-Long Drum Corps Aficionado has taken it upon himself to consider the more complicated aspects of this issue, how to judge it fairly and make it as entertaining as possible. Noting that his recommendations have been adopted by DCI... I consider this issue (while dynamic) ...not a thing to get too worked up about. Level heads will prevail. At a lower technical level...we added trombones to the first big impact in the Santa Clara 2014 program. SCV ALWAYS has a big in-your-face audio-visual moment in the opener that says "We're here...it's on...let's rock." Pre-season the use of tbns got bashed left-and right, after they came down to SoCal we cranked the volume up several notches on that impact point using the 'bones natural ability to be played loud as ####...I was next to the press box at Citrus College....adjutants and fans agreed; tbns became a non-issue. We made it bad-a##...we made it sound awesome-that ended the argument. (For me anyway). I expect something similar to come of the technology and rule changes ...simply...it's going to get better.

For images you may need to host them yourself...do you have a site? As for your recordings, LPs, tapes...whatever you have...you should make a back-up of them digitally before you part with them ...what you listed appears rare, you may even have the ONLY SURVIVING copy of some of those....if you sell 'em to the wrong person...the music (good or not) could be lost forever and NO MATTER WHAT ---that's bad. If you click on "follow this topic" at upper-right, you will get a notification when you login to this site whenever someone bumps this thread. You can follow other threads the same way.

If you're a brass player feel free to question me about DCI auditions. I've arranged lots of exercises and plenty of solos...no charge, but DO Get Arban's and Rochut's method-books if you haven't already. Be able to play all the solos, duets and variations....it can't hurt to memorize a few of these too. As for marching; if there is a Vet at your school; ask 'em to show you how to march and play at high-speed ....6 to 5, 4 to 5 (jazz running) etc...we ALL need to be able to do that. Corps like Star started teaching dance to the battery and hornline in the 80s and 90s...BD, SCV and others followed suit. To my knowledge and experience, all marching members practice and learn dance with a CG-consultant for ~1hr each day at camps and on tour. If you intend to march Rosemont - you'll need to be able to play on the move just-like you were sitting in the band room.---cardio can't hurt.

If you aren't aware mistakes were made at the Naval Yard in 2012. Things have sadly been in-decline since - hence the thread and ponderings....for the record I was NOT THERE and NOT INVOLVED....this is not to say I haven't caused my fair share of mayhem...but it's all anecdotal; not for public consumption as the regrettable incident in 2012 was. Srsly a bummer that initiated more bummers for the West Coast Sr. Scene. As for mixing F, Bb and G....good luck tuning that.... but "Brung what you wrung" seems to make the most financial sense. Ill be brungin a 1991 Kanstul 3v G Bar. Bugle w/ Jack Meehan "tune any note kicker" (and marks) should I decide to bail out of Los Angeles and head east. Heck I'll bring the 1994 Kanstul Custom Class 3v G Mellophone too...you'll need to swear/sign a blood-oath in order to borrow it is all. Re: 1moreTime & tuning..if by "G" you mean a concert D (on top of the staff for Bb Treble or Tenor Clef...two lines up for C Bass Clef) yes, on a Kanstul that WHOLE PARTIAL is sharp. ....this is fine for an "open" "C"major chord....the G (5th) needs to be 5cents sharp anyways. ....If by "A" you mean the next note up...same deal...if played correctly (1 & 2....avoid the false-partial ESPECIALLY on a Kanstul) you need to "kick-out" for that bad-boy too, the PARTIAL however, should match the 8va/b...Bb, B and "high" C should be right in the pocket. Most Kanstuls have an ez-access kicker ....if not...I'd say hose the parts if the player can't hit the G's & A's right down the center of the horn. Or if you have 3 valves, you could tune the 3rd valve JUST for two notes: "A & Ab"-concert E & Eb. PS-the E partial (*sigh*....concert B) below is flat...for "D"....slam that kicker all the way home (a concert A) to get 'er in tune, that's what Zig made 'em for. One More Time is mostly in G...Kanstuls are perfect for (concert) Gmaj/min, Cmaj/min G7, C7, DM/m, BM/m, B9, Amin7/9 etc...oh! and Gmin9...that about wraps up the chords on that one ...the orig. arrangement fits the nuances of Zig's bugles and that's no accident. Edit: I see the Westshoremen Alumni are playing it in Bm...I've played it in Gm and Bbm...interesting interpretation is there a MIDI?

Yeah man Govies were so cool when I met them, what they lacked in size they made up for in class, charisma and talent. I forgot about Bush ...that is a great Corps. Westshoremen too.. they're playin' One More Time "Chuck" Corea eh? I can play the lead barry part in my sleep. I memorized it when I was 14. From what you said I might reach out to them. Thanks for the info...I don't mean to be all LMGTFY on everybody but I wanted to start a thread to get people like yourself to talk it up and get excited about this year. More Corps = More Gooder. Much love to my brothers and sisters in the Midwest, the South, Jersey, Pennsylvania, NY and Bawstun! Yo BigDub...you guys in G?

Planning to do a larger DCI-tour in 2015 as a tech (and volunteer cook) ---should have done that last summer, but I've been thinking- Marching...Shooting the lights out in a stadium....In 2001 This group called The Renegades played...sounded great to my cynical-snobby ear. Gave me hope - small group, mellow drill, crowd went ballistic. - gave others hope- by 2002, friends from high school and college (all BD/SCV vets) were joining-like an internet-forum-hive:"Everyone get in here now". 2003 I wanted to finish college and march Renegades in 2004 as a graduation gift to myself. It seems like we were wall-to-wall ringers... but it was...synergy...and perhaps lightning in a btl. The corps got geometrically better. 100s of years of corps experience between us. Almost like a Fantasy-Drum-Corps where YOU choose the performers and staff...even the show style. I'd choose 66 G King or Kanstul Bugles; I'd have Roland as my soprano and Doug Kenyon as my Barry (RIP). I'd ask John Meehan and Frank D. to consult. I'd want 10 hardcore screamers. >25 tough, loud big-bores; 120 age-outs from top6 corps..... Drum corps is an obscurity and a struggle here in LA/Orange County. hence: 1. Does your corps have fwd momentum? Is there Sr. Corps or Alumni or All Age getting ready to carpet-bomb the audience with talent, style and tradition? (not the judges....the audience) Anyone have a particularly cool show? Some Maynard, Buddy Rich, Bill Chase, Don Ellis,.. a classy broadway/movie theme? A Color Pre? "Malaguena", "One More Time," "Niner-two" "Shaft" ??? anything funky--ToP, EWF....some rock-jazz? 2. If there is....SRsly....I'll relocate if you got it goin on. 3. Is anyone still in G? 4. Which corps would YOU march if real life could be voided? Off the top of my head- MBI, Corpsvets, ....Star Minicorps. Kilties still around or The Governaires? If you had the opportunity to just drop everything and march- would you do it? Free opportunity to sell your corps/show to me...and everyone else who reads this. '.

More corps is more gooder. all my best wishes -Tap.