Drum Corps As It Was

[CrunchyTenor]

Drum corps have been moving in instrumentation towards the band world since before I started marching. Drum corps are bands...and have always been bands. It's not turning into something different, it's just continuing down the road started over half a century ago.

One simple response in the form of a question: Does it have to? Can't we take a different route? There is just as much of a chance for drum corps to fail as a marching band clone as there is keeping it unique (as far as the all-brass choir).

As an aside to Cadetsnare: You see Mike as the voice of reason. I'm not surprised since you share the idea that change, at whatever cost, is good. It seems to be the Cadet mindset. But, what if that mindset is wrong? What if the hellbent mindset is a fatal flaw?

Someone earlier used a baseball analogy, which made total sense to me. Someone still has to throw the ball. They haven't changed to automatic pitching machines. Someone still has to stand in a chalk-lined box and try to hit a spherical object with a cylindrical one. To me, the addition of the DH was comparable to the addition of one valve. The distance from the pitcher's mound is the same as it was 100 years ago. So is the distance between the bases. The basic rules of baseball have changed little to none compared to drum corps.

Mike, I see you're still selling that BS about amplification and saving money. Nice try, but pits are still huge and amplifiers and speakers just added to the costs of running a corps. Not one World Class corps has reduced the number of pit members, but they have added the cost to purchase and maintain the amps and speakers.

Here's a reasoned statement: Moratorium on rule changes for a minimum of 5 years. Moratorium on rule changes that reappear year after year. Talk about beating the dead horse until the other directors start feeling sorry for the horse (or get tired of the browbeating) and pass rules just to pacify.

[ussglassman]

This was on th eBlue Rock web site

ODE TO REAL DRUM CORPS

I think that I shall never see,

A drum corps as it used to be.

Where fun and spirit filled the stands,

Instead of DCI marching bands.

When lines were straightened by design,

Else you found a foot in your behind.

And symmetry revealed the skill.

Of poor kids with naught but will.

When heads and bodies marched as one

Instead of playing on the run.

When competition wouldn't yield,

You kicked their ##### OFF the field.

We had practice; they "rehearse";

We got better; they get worse.

Country & flag: not to despise;

Close order drill, NOT jazzercise.

Flamaques and pada-flafla's

Military bearing; not tights with no bras.

Bugles in the key of G

Not saxophones nor calliope.

Not semi-vans, just an old bread truck -

And we could tell our foes, "YOU SUCK!"

When judges ticked to seal your fate,

Not conductors who "adjudicate."

American flag, and proper guards!

Not sidelines looking like junk yards.

Drums rest on legs, like times of old.

And drum majors didn't need a scaffold.

A little effort to raise the knee

Was worth the crowds that came to see

and shout and holler with a beer -

But now, "Be quiet, so we can hear!"

Stadiums are not symphony halls,

And "forte" notes do not have balls!

B-flat major? Gimme a break!

"Blow in plumbing, music make!"

Start on the left; end on the right -

Blow your brains out with all your might!

Athletic "sport?" - no freakin' way -

That's why baseball's here to stay.

And so, my friend, you understand

Why drum corps are nothing more than bands

That take the best and then corrupt it.

So join an alumni corps and just say "f____ it."

Author Unknown

All my ranting and raving....then this...these are like words from the bible AMEN!!!! :cool:

[Scerpella]

Oh, we are all free to like what we like...I have said that many times.

It doesnt come off like that. 12 of the 41 replies in this thread are you. And thats probably duplicated in every thread which yearns for the "old days". You spend alot of time saying everyone else is wrong on this.

Despite all the self congratulation DCI gives itself and the occassional popular winner like PR this year, the facts are that the attendance figues and amount of kids participating in the activity has yet to come back to what it was in the 70's and 80's. And this is when it was still a very unique niche activity.

Now DCI has in its changes of the activity tried to interest the hundreds of thousands of kids and families who already participate in the band world. The results are the same, less kids participating, less people watching.

Most things are much better now than back in the "Golden Era". The musicians are better, the visual presentations are much more complex, the shows are certainly more artistic than they ever were.

Where the rubber meets the road however is the participation and attendance figures. DCI still doesnt get it. They are failing to recreate the diverse passionate fan base of previous years, as a matter of fact it appears they have gone out of their way to alienate those former fans.

I will go back to my usual harangue and say that todays DCI exists to give a handful of people a paying gig and changes that have been made in the past 15-20 years are basically them trying to create further job security and ensure that they retain control over this business. That is all. Its all about the money. And I think that is self evident. Same corps winning and dominating year after year. The financial bars to entry into DCI finals are high and difficult. The Deck is as always stacked towards those handful of people and corps. A Star of Indiana springs fully formed out of the ether about as often as Haleys Comet passes.

That little statistical sleight of hand about there being the equivalent of 40 corps out there now is bogus. The top 12-15 corps are now only 15-25 members larger than they were 25 years ago.

Edited March 1, 2009 by Scerpella

[Piper]

Promoting band instruments into the Drum Corps activity is in the best self interest of band directors and musical equipment providers. That doesn't mean that it's in the best interests of the fans or Drum Corps itself. Most kids switch from band to Drum Corps because of the increased intensity and difficulty level. These aren't kids who want to spend the summer chatting on their cell phones at the local mall. They want a challenge, and Drum Corps is more than happy and able to accomodate them. Change for the sake of change is senseless. Well, that's my two cents on this thread for the day.

[esch]

The bottom line is that drum corps IS different now than BITD.... it used to serve as an activity to get youths off the street and doing something creative, training those kids with little or no experience and giving them goals, skills and a vision of life beyond their street corners. Corps today is designed as a marching music academy for the musical elite... of course it's more demanding because the base skills of the performers involved are at a higher level. While many of us miss much of what old-school drum corps brought to the field (and I, personally, miss the balls-to-the-wall, blowing your whole being through your horn sound of the old lines, even of they were occasionally out of tune or blatty), there is no denying the amazing demands today's shows put on the kids.

But, to me, it's apples and oranges... drum corps has evolved into a total different organism than BITD. Still gives the same "corps experience" as we had (although MUCH refined) but to a different kind of kid.

And because the shows are at such a refined level, the audience has changed, too. But so has life... and the rest of the musical world. I wish there were still bands like The Who or the J.Geils Band to kick me in the butt, but I thank God that Tower of Power is still doing it... and I miss corps like the Muchachos, DeLaSalle, Royal-Aires and the Commodores, but we still have some who still put it out. I don't go to nearly as many corps shows as I used to... don't really care to, frankly... but I know from talking to my students who march that it's doing for them what it did for me in the early '70's.

[MikeD]

It doesnt come off like that. 12 of the 41 replies in this thread are you. And thats probably duplicated in every thread which yearns for the "old days". You spend alot of time saying everyone else is wrong on this.

No, I spend the time giving my own POV. Yes, I think they are wrong, but what I do...as they and you do...is give my opinion. That's a discussion group.

Despite all the self congratulation DCI gives itself and the occassional popular winner like PR this year, the facts are that the attendance figues and amount of kids participating in the activity has yet to come back to what it was in the 70's and 80's. And this is when it was still a very unique niche activity.

Now DCI has in its changes of the activity tried to interest the hundreds of thousands of kids and families who already participate in the band world. The results are the same, less kids participating, less people watching.

They have determined, and IMO correctly, that those people are the best target for their efforts as new audience and membership. Junior drum corps is not expanding in numbers...that hasn't happened in decades. Their job is to manage the activity that exists today...and IMO they are doing that well. You are not going to see the 440 corps that are mentioned as existing just before DCI.

However, you do have 4,000 competitive bands today, to use audiodb's number, so the total number of kids marching and competing is far larger than it was.

Most things are much better now than back in the "Golden Era". The musicians are better, the visual presentations are much more complex, the shows are certainly more artistic than they ever were.

Where the rubber meets the road however is the participation and attendance figures. DCI still doesnt get it. They are failing to recreate the diverse passionate fan base of previous years, as a matter of fact it appears they have gone out of their way to alienate those former fans.

It's not the old days...they have to build their audience for the "new days".

I will go back to my usual harangue and say that todays DCI exists to give a handful of people a paying gig and changes that have been made in the past 15-20 years are basically them trying to create further job security and ensure that they retain control over this business. That is all. Its all about the money. And I think that is self evident. Same corps winning and dominating year after year. The financial bars to entry into DCI finals are high and difficult. The Deck is as always stacked towards those handful of people and corps. A Star of Indiana springs fully formed out of the ether about as often as Haleys Comet passes.

No, I do not think that it is self evident at all.

That little statistical sleight of hand about there being the equivalent of 40 corps out there now is bogus. The top 12-15 corps are now only 15-25 members larger than they were 25 years ago.

Note that I was talking about the pre-DCI era. Not 1984.

[MikeD]

One simple response in the form of a question: Does it have to? Can't we take a different route? There is just as much of a chance for drum corps to fail as a marching band clone as there is keeping it unique (as far as the all-brass choir).

Could it take a different route? Sure. IMO it would be the wrong way to go, but sure..the BOD can make whatever choices it wants.

As an aside to Cadetsnare: You see Mike as the voice of reason. I'm not surprised since you share the idea that change, at whatever cost, is good. It seems to be the Cadet mindset. But, what if that mindset is wrong? What if the hellbent mindset is a fatal flaw?

Hmmm....I think you just gave 69Cadet a heart attack!

What if YOUR mindset is wrong? All people can do is the best they can. I happen to agree with the direction DCI is taking for the most part. Since they are the ones who decide what is and what isn't, it's "on them" to make whatever decisions they think best.

Here's a reasoned statement: Moratorium on rule changes for a minimum of 5 years. Moratorium on rule changes that reappear year after year. Talk about beating the dead horse until the other directors start feeling sorry for the horse (or get tired of the browbeating) and pass rules just to pacify.

Which is a total insult to those who vote their conscience on the changes...and is 100% bogus, IMO.

[drumno5]

<ODE TO REAL DRUM CORPS

<I think that I shall never see,

<A drum corps as it used to be...

Yawn...

Fred O.

Edited March 2, 2009 by drumno5

[LegalEagle50]

i'm a 40 something who finds that poem to be a slap in the face to so many people including those who march alumni corps. IMO it was written by an old fart who still needs to feel relevant.

[Cadetsnare]

As an aside to Cadetsnare: You see Mike as the voice of reason. I'm not surprised since you share the idea that change, at whatever cost, is good. It seems to be the Cadet mindset. But, what if that mindset is wrong? What if the hellbent mindset is a fatal flaw?

Actually, I don't think change for change's sake is good. But, I am for:

Bb instruments. makes financial sense to both the corps and the manufacturers. YES, $ does matter in that case. Also, someone doesn't need to NEEDLESSLY re-learn fingerings in the key of G. The key of G sucks anyways, unless you're playing "All Blues" by Miles!

Amplified pit...yup! Listen to the mallet sounds of the 70s and early 80s. Clanging bells ALL THE TIME! If you think it's okay for xylos and bells to play all the time...you don't hear percussion orchestration the way 99.99% of musicians do. It sounded TERRIBLE! God knows I love me some early 80s 2-7 and SCV, but the pit sounds? Eww.... You can actually hear the colors and nuances of the woods now, and we're now able to hear colors previously inaudible. And kids don't have to play with improper technique to pound the sound out of the key. Sorry...you're not gonna convince me on that one.

Triggered sounds...yup. It's going to be a positive.

Amplified voice? Nope. never thought it was a good idea, and still don't.

I don't care if it moves away from "traditional" drum and bugle corps. I really don't. It's a performance medium, and the change is here to stay. It's more musical now, anyway. Which, tradition or not, is the deciding deal for me. If it's not musical, then to me, it SHOULD go. Like clanging bells and xylos, and G horns that are built poorly and are harder to play in tune.

I am no longer responding to this thread...I have charts to write! Good luck battling it out!