New study: corps & band => sports injuries

[84BDsop]

Pentathlon

Actually...the fencing component of modern pentathlon DOES have competition....one-touch epee.

And ironically, I'm heading out for Palm Springs tomorrow for 4 days for the US Pentathlon Nationals....where I'm not only the equipment vendor, I'm also the head armorer for the fencing portion!

[Matt_S]

Actually...the fencing component of modern pentathlon DOES have competition....one-touch epee.

And ironically, I'm heading out for Palm Springs tomorrow for 4 days for the US Pentathlon Nationals....where I'm not only the equipment vendor, I'm also the head armorer for the fencing portion!

######. I struck out on one single sport on my lengthy list.

[AzEuph]

My biggest issue with comparing, especially for marching band, is the level of outside training. Sports like football, basketball, baseball, etc. they work out a ton and train very hard and are still tired during the game! I can't say marching band members are as fit as some of these athletes.

With that in mind when these members say they are tired is it because it's really hard physically or because they are out of shape? How many of these kids work so hard for 3hr rehearsal? During band camp or all day rehearsals, sure I can see you getting tired but not night practices. If the football team were to practice as the band there wouldn't be anybody as tired or stiff.......sorry but true (second thought, maybe the kicker).

Are our injuries just as bad? Sure, but we're still wimps when it comes to football/basketball like sports.

[kansasDC]

My biggest issue with comparing, especially for marching band, is the level of outside training. Sports like football, basketball, baseball, etc. they work out a ton and train very hard and are still tired during the game! I can't say marching band members are as fit as some of these athletes.

With that in mind when these members say they are tired is it because it's really hard physically or because they are out of shape? How many of these kids work so hard for 3hr rehearsal? During band camp or all day rehearsals, sure I can see you getting tired but not night practices. If the football team were to practice as the band there wouldn't be anybody as tired or stiff.......sorry but true (second thought, maybe the kicker).

Are our injuries just as bad? Sure, but we're still wimps when it comes to football/basketball like sports.

Completely disagree. My son went to football camp the day after getting home from DCI tour. He was the center and he outran the entire backfield for the two hours they did wind sprints, etc. He said the whole thing wasn't nearly as taxing as one rehearsal block with corps.

As for baseball being tough: Not in this part of the country. Most of them would collapse after a few hours of drum corps spring training. I used to coach baseball here and these guys spend more time scratching their privates than they do running. Baseball players spend very little time doing anything actually aerobic. Even running the bases is only 360 feet. And they aren't hauling a tuba or a set of tenors around!

[AzEuph]

Completely disagree. My son went to football camp the day after getting home from DCI tour. He was the center and he outran the entire backfield for the two hours they did wind sprints, etc. He said the whole thing wasn't nearly as taxing as one rehearsal block with corps.

As for baseball being tough: Not in this part of the country. Most of them would collapse after a few hours of drum corps spring training. I used to coach baseball here and these guys spend more time scratching their privates than they do running. Baseball players spend very little time doing anything actually aerobic. Even running the bases is only 360 feet. And they aren't hauling a tuba or a set of tenors around!

True about baseball, don't know why I included them. They're not athletes, they're baseball players.

Drum corps is different than marching band, which is why I said especially marching band. Trust me I understand how hard a visual block can be and I wouldn't be surprised about him running well. However he is coming off of running all summer and some of those guys weren't.

Regardless, you're not going to be able to convince me that a typical high school band member (not corps) is in better shape than a typical high school football player. Flat out no way. I've had a student run a 20 minute mile, no joke it was more like 21:30. If the band were to do one football practice I'd imagine there'd be a ton more injuries and pain than say their normal band practice.

This article picked Avon, which I'm assuming is one of the hardest working bands out there. I would say majority of bands don't push physically on their members in general, nothing that isn't out of normal HS expectations. Sure there are some that do work hard and I wouldn't disbelieve it, but let's not say "SEE! SEE! I TOLD YOU SO!" off of the study from one of the few extremely hard working bands. Most bands I would say barely push limits unlike Avon and other BOA type bands.

With that said, even comparing corps to HS there is a major difference in being pushed. But how many bands seriously practice/work 1/3 as hard as corps do? MAYBE 5-8%. Yes they are out there, but they are few out of the thousands of bands.

[DCImonkey]

Unless the football team runs through you...

On the flip side of this...people always thinking fencing is dangerous because "they use swords." Never mind that the things aren't sharp and the chances of a high school fencer going to the emergency room due to a fencing injury are 0.09 percent, and those are mostly muscle injuries....football??? 25%....and yet WAT sport is looked at as more dangerous??? When was the last time a fencer was paralyzed after a hard hit??

Oh Sam.....you just don't know how much that fencing, band, and serious injury go together do you? Well here you go from 2007:

"A Jack Britt High School band member was injured when a sword prop used for performances struck him in the eye.

The accident occurred during a practice Oct. 19, said C. Daniel Wyke, the school's band director.

The student was hit by a fake sword which is used in the halftime show, which simulates a bull fight. Wyke would not describe it further.

The student was taken to Duke University Medical Center. <snip>"

They were actually using a real fencing foil which went through the kids eye socket, through his brain, and touched the back of his skull. I heard he has permanent problems to this day, and has very little short term memory, but that's all hear-say.

[OdeToArsenal47]

I'm going to post the same thing that I posted on my friend's note that linked to the same study. I was mostly talking about high school marching band, but the argument's about the same.

I disagree completely. We're nowhere close to the football team, the basketball team, or the cross country team. They condition strenuously. We don't run 250 miles in a year or two, as compared to Cross Country. We don't spend all offseason lifting, like the football team. We don't do either, whereas the basketball team does both.

Are we smarter? I think so. Music exercises the left side of the brain (if you're doing it right), more so than hitting some blocking sleds at full speed. We also have valedictorians every year, unlike the host of sports teams (barring exceptions).

Take it from an ex-linebacker. Marching band can't be compared in the same sentence to football. Sure, I'm out of breath after a show performance. When I played football, I was hurting, out of breath, sore, and a little dazed.

As for a trumpet player using the same air as a wide receiver, I can see that. However, that wide receiver will burn five times as many calories and will be five times as conditioned for all-around athleticism as that trumpet player.

Then a friend in the facebook comments said that corps/band is a bigger adrenaline rush than football.

And as for adrenaline, I'd personally rather catch a football in front of 100,000 screaming fans at Neyland Stadium than play/conduct/dance in front of 50,000 at a DCI Finals.

I think the adrenaline can be comparable on both sides if we look objectively. On one hand, football doesn't have the emotion that marching band does. On the other, football exemplifies the individual, not the group. If you catch a pass, the fans think, "Man, that player is good!" If you play a super technical solo that sounds unbelievably great, the fans think "Man, that band/corps is good!" This is the character of the activity. There's a heisman trophy in football, for the best college football player in the country. There's no best player award in DCI. You stand, and therefore fall, as one. In football, a great player can carry a team to all kinds of success. The adrenaline is different, but the same.

In conclusion, marching band is not as athletic as an actual sport. We are, however, more artistic. Apples and oranges.

[84BDsop]

Oh Sam.....you just don't know how much that fencing, band, and serious injury go together do you? Well here you go from 2007:

"A Jack Britt High School band member was injured when a sword prop used for performances struck him in the eye.

The accident occurred during a practice Oct. 19, said C. Daniel Wyke, the school's band director.

The student was hit by a fake sword which is used in the halftime show, which simulates a bull fight. Wyke would not describe it further.

The student was taken to Duke University Medical Center. <snip>"

They were actually using a real fencing foil which went through the kids eye socket, through his brain, and touched the back of his skull. I heard he has permanent problems to this day, and has very little short term memory, but that's all hear-say.

That was from people attempting stage combat without proper training....not true competitive fencing (where I make my living)...and they must've really hit hard or altered the tip of the weapon...the end of a non-competitive foil looks like the head of a nail and has a rubber bulb tip on it. The COULD'VE used a competitive blade with the electric point removed....they screw on and the bare tip's fairly narrow.

Either way....injury through through stupidity is not the same as injury in the course of competition with all the proper gear worn.

[It's Godzilla!]

I really think most of you are missing the point. Yes, the article mentions that it's just as athletic as football teams and whatnot, but it's really not fair to be comparing the two. Look more at endurance sports like soccer, cross country, marathon running, or even tennis for a more accurate comparison. The article was written so we could finally get some respect from the meathead jock types that told me to go "tute my flute" right before they lost another game.

And to whoever said drum corps doesn't compare to the 250 miles cross country runners run every year, I'd like to see some stats on that. I think I covered at least a mile in every show I performed (if you walk around a track at a quick pace, you can do a mile in about 12 minutes. I was certainly covering more ground at a faster pace than that for 11min.) Throw in the warm-up conditioning and running to and from rehersal, sets, etc. every day for almost 3 months. It might be a close comparison.

[gsksun4]

I really think most of you are missing the point. Yes, the article mentions that it's just as athletic as football teams and whatnot, but it's really not fair to be comparing the two. Look more at endurance sports like soccer, cross country, marathon running, or even tennis for a more accurate comparison. The article was written so we could finally get some respect from the meathead jock types that told me to go "tute my flute" right before they lost another game.

And to whoever said drum corps doesn't compare to the 250 miles cross country runners run every year, I'd like to see some stats on that. I think I covered at least a mile in every show I performed (if you walk around a track at a quick pace, you can do a mile in about 12 minutes. I was certainly covering more ground at a faster pace than that for 11min.) Throw in the warm-up conditioning and running to and from rehersal, sets, etc. every day for almost 3 months. It might be a close comparison.

Not to mention carrying around a drum or contra and doing this in a heavy uniform................

Edited June 4, 2009 by gsksun4