GUARDLING Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Well I don't see the scaffolding keeping them in the front of the field a detriment to their volume, but I do see it as helping to make them louder and more together becasue they are closer to each other and closer to the audience. The problem I see with the scaffolding is that it keeps the whole corps in front of the center X the entire show. there were only a couple of times when any part of the hornline got behind the center X. This is just like last year when the coffins framed the field and stacked the corps thus limiting their use of the field. Sure it will make them sound louder and make it easier to play together since they are keeping the hornline in a tighter area, but visually they will be killed due to the lack of demand and field coverage. Dont have to cover the field anymore and just because a corps chooses not to stretch end to end doesnt mean it's easier. Personally I like the reshaping of a field some corps choose to do. Much more interesting ...JMO 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluecoats88 Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 And like most I am not happy with Coats Drumline dropping 2 points from sat to sun and find it very unrealistic, however I did hear some stuff that didn't sound quite right at the theater, and the collision/fall that happened in the snare line probably didn't help their score either. So I'm not too worried, they have a smoking drum line and will right the ship putting them right in the thick of the hunt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveBari Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 (edited) from watching the show in the theaters: BD - marching was clean & pristine! very proud of the visual accomplishments... the quality of the running technique, the choreography is way above the rest. the show overall didn't wow me, kinda got bored in the middle. the brass is what i expected for this time of the season, in tune, and powerful. Cavaliers- typical cavaliers show. not sure why they won the second show, there were other shows way better. i liked the upside down tenor trick. not sure what their show was about... also got bored in the middle. Crown - i really liked the show! all the different styles were impressive. definitely a contender. cool uniforms for the show. was captivated all the way through the show bluecoats- i wanted to like it, it started out interesting... got bored 2-3 mins in and stayed bored for the rest of the time. DIRTY DIRTY DIRTY. SCV- the same unintelligible drill and bendy marching. bored with it, and DIRTY. blue stars- i liked it, i thought their placement should have def been over SCV & coats. the cadets- GREAT show idea, really interesting to watch :-). hats off to jeff sacktig with the weave of the angel/demon uniform throughout the drill, masterfully done! the marching is WAY DIRTY, typical cadet marching. please get your feet in time and your legs straight and i will appreciate the show way more. phantom regiment- boredom throughout. the show left me empty. i understood the sections with the kiss and the shako, but the rest of it didnt tie in at all. nice low brass as usual, very little choreo as compared to cavies, cadets & devs. my ranking: 1. crown 2. BD 3. cavaliers 4. cadets 5. blue stars 6. bluecoats 7. phantom 8. SCV really corps 1-4 will jockey around for the remainder of the season. if its a matter of cleanliness nobody can beat BD. if cadets get their show clean its DEF a contender over cavaliers and BD. crown will get crowd favorite. the rest dont have a shot at a title IMO. Edited June 21, 2011 by DaveBari 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crownisking Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 from watching the show in the theaters: BD - marching was clean & pristine! very proud of the visual accomplishments... the quality of the running technique, the choreography is way above the rest. the show overall didn't wow me, kinda got bored in the middle. the brass is what i expected for this time of the season, in tune, and powerful. Cavaliers- typical cavaliers show. not sure why they won the second show, there were other shows way better. i liked the upside down tenor trick. not sure what their show was about... also got bored in the middle. Crown - i really liked the show! all the different styles were impressive. definitely a contender. cool uniforms for the show. was captivated all the way through the show bluecoats- i wanted to like it, it started out interesting... got bored 2-3 mins in and stayed bored for the rest of the time. DIRTY DIRTY DIRTY. SCV- the same unintelligible drill and bendy marching. bored with it, and DIRTY. blue stars- i liked it, i thought their placement should have def been over SCV & coats. the cadets- GREAT show idea, really interesting to watch :-). hats off to jeff sacktig with the weave of the angel/demon uniform throughout the drill, masterfully done! the marching is WAY DIRTY, typical cadet marching. please get your feet in time and your legs straight and i will appreciate the show way more. phantom regiment- boredom throughout. the show left me empty. i understood the sections with the kiss and the shako, but the rest of it didnt tie in at all. nice low brass as usual, very little choreo as compared to cavies, cadets & devs. my ranking: 1. crown 2. BD 3. cavaliers 4. cadets 5. blue stars 6. bluecoats 7. phantom 8. SCV really corps 1-4 will jockey around for the remainder of the season. if its a matter of cleanliness nobody can beat BD. if cadets get their show clean its DEF a contender over cavaliers and BD. crown will get crowd favorite. the rest dont have a shot at a title IMO. I definitely respect the fact that you're not afraid to say when a show bores you. That's a word I don't see very often around here. That being said, it's really cool that you found Crown to be entertaining! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crackle Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 i think we have to understand here that this wasn't just any other show, where the corps' in the area would perform. this was the top drum corps from around the nation! of course the competition level is going to be high. also, taking into consideration that it's the beginning of the season and consistency is definetly a factoron performance right now, and escpecially how the weather was the past two days. it's no wonder how the placements fluctuated a lot. if i were you, i wouldn't be worried about the corps' who did change placements drastically. i would watch out for the ones that didn't, and managed to keep it together for both shows, not just one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimedrummer Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Slight differences from night to night can cause large differences in ordinal rankings, especially when we're talking about a tightly bunched group of corps at the top of the game. Relax. I disagree. Slight differences should produce "slight" changes in ordinals. The scenario you present assumes all the performers are in the same competitive "neighborhood". In this case, it was a 10 POINT spread from first to eighth, not 8 tenths. Based on the spreads within the captions, these two judging panels came to two very different conclusions regarding achievement. Did SCV really march THAT much better Saturday night? The spreads and BOX RATINGS have meaning relative to achievement. Sure, you expect to see some differences from two different panels, but this was extreme by any measure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 With all due respect, please criticize something I actually said. I never mentioned the placements. The NUMBERS are all over the place, both in individual captions and in totals. Sheer statistics make the numbers.....troublesome. I'm criticizing the fact that you are talking about numbers, but not what the numbers actually relate to: the performances. This is not a statistical activity, it is a performance-based activity, and if you did not see the performances, at the very least, and do nothing but look at number variations from a statistical sense, then you are only seeing about 1/10th of the total picture (for irony's sake I thought it would be fun to completely make up a fraction such as 1/10th ). Perhaps you are a numbers type of person, and I can understand that; I know plenty of fans/staff members that are as well (as am I FWIW). But two shows do not exactly equal a trend as far as numbers assignments, and discussing numerical inconsistencies assigned via performances but not seeing any of the performances on both nights makes for an uninformed/unsubstantiated argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowtown Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 The change is scores and placement is what should happen, use to happen Corps may have had different runs but even more to the point…a judge won’t catch everything and so on their early reads, a lot depends upon where they are standing and when…and when there is a lot of dirt in the show…if a drum judge is by the pit during a snare feature, well, the line caught a break….in a way a makes sense that Crown did better the first night as they seem to be good at music right now and the guards held back their work due to the wind. I think it’s exciting and in a way, I’m more surprised that some of the corps scored as close as they did 2 nights in a row than by the change in placements It’s early, so much can still happen, some with surge some will fade others will follow on track and then you add in the other corps I welcome the disparity in scores and captions - it feels like they were judged Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyjazz Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 I disagree. Slight differences should produce "slight" changes in ordinals. Not necessarily. I gave an example -- albeit a bit unlikely -- as to how very slight changes in ratings can produce large changes in rankings. You cannot deny it. Does it correlate well with what happened last weekend? Not particularly, but people need to understand just how these things CAN play out. The scenario you present assumes all the performers are in the same competitive "neighborhood". In this case, it was a 10 POINT spread from first to eighth, not 8 tenths. The 3 captions cited (Percussion, Visual Performance, Ensemble Music) all tightened up Sunday as compared to Saturday. I'm not sure I see why it's so preposterous that Bluecoats dropped 13% in Percussion from one night to the next at the beginning of the season, or SCV dropping 3.5% on the field, or CC dropping 11% in Ensemble Music. It's the beginning of the season, we should expect high noise in the data because (a) the corps aren't yet consistent and (b) the judges aren't yet consistent and © the judging panels weren't the same. Sure, you expect to see some differences from two different panels, but this was extreme by any measure. I'm more inclined to believe this might be a truer indication of reality than we've seen in the past, for the exact reasons stated above. Human nature dictates that judges would be pre-disposed to expect more out of (say) CC's music on Sunday when they know their scores from Saturday. What happened this weekend was a step towards the testing protocol known as "blind testing" -- of course, DCI can never be truly blind, because the judges obviously know the corps they are judging, but (presumably) a lack of knowledge by Sunday's panel about Saturday's results provides a peek into the higher variability we might see if human nature is suppressed. I find it fascinating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 I disagree. Slight differences should produce "slight" changes in ordinals. The scenario you present assumes all the performers are in the same competitive "neighborhood". In this case, it was a 10 POINT spread from first to eighth, not 8 tenths. Based on the spreads within the captions, these two judging panels came to two very different conclusions regarding achievement. Did SCV really march THAT much better Saturday night? The spreads and BOX RATINGS have meaning relative to achievement. Sure, you expect to see some differences from two different panels, but this was extreme by any measure. Remember, achievement is only HALF of each caption, with the other half being design. Some judges prefer one style/technique over another, and that can greatly sway rankings from one night (or one judge) to another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.