DCI Minnesota 16 July 2011

[N.E. Brigand]

Am I the only one who really doesn't like Crown's show this year?

I mean... brass sure they're great I guess. But for #### sake, what rock concerts do they go to where all this cheese is considered necessary?

I don't dislike the show, but I don't love it either, at least based on their Akron performance, where I thought Bluecoats were clearly superior to Crown. (I haven't seen them otherwise, apart from watching the Ft. Worth performance on the Fan Network, but only after seeing them live.) I think you're onto something, although the problem may be inherent in the nature of drum corps, whose reliance on a large number of people acting uniformly is at odds with the essence of rock and roll staging. So Crown is overcompensating with the elements some perceive as "cheese". Also, and it pains me to say this because of my feelings generally about synthesizers in drum corps, but they're not making enough of the "Rach Star" pianist, who is rarely the focus of attention and whose solos aren't very interesting. There's no "star" element whatsoever, apart from his entrance, which at Akron was downplayed relative to how it had been handled in Ft. Worth. (He's not given as much star treatment as a piano soloist would receive in the classical world either. The theater where I work will shortly be hosting a major piano competition, where so intent are the audience on seeing the performers' hands that the organizers have arranged for a camera to be placed directly above the keyboard, with projection onto a large screen.) But perhaps things changed in Minnesota, given the high score they earned?

[banddad1]

Great show last night!!! All of the corps are on fire this year. A Lot of surprises but it is still early. I like this type of season.....lots of shake up and tightness between groups. The top 4 groups can all take the title. This is exciting!!

[byline]

You can buy surge suppressors that have a line-in line-out for cable, but most cable connections are grounded by the cable company at the outside just as it comes to your house.

If you have power surges, then a Uninterruptable Power Supply (UPS) costs a hundred bucks and would be a good buy for you. The one thing that will kill computers faster than anything isn't a power outage, but the power going off-on-off-on. A "brown out" (not enough power) is also a PC killer.

We have both of those things. Everything is hooked up to the UPS, but hubby hasn't got around to getting the other gadget hooked up yet. We've seen enough stuff around here that was fried during a storm that we just play it safe.

As for the show, I only got to see the corps from Madison on (and then reviewed the last four that I missed today). I love the sound and emotion of Madison's show! I wonder if there's more to be added to the closer. I still see a full-corps "hat bow" in there somewhere, but that's just the traditionalist in me.

I actually like Blue Devils this year better than last year. Cavaliers, I liked better last year, yet they're winning with this show. Go figure! Crown is good, and for the first time in I don't know how long, I actually like what Cadets are doing. I liked Phantom better last year, though I enjoy this show. I enjoyed both Blue Stars and Boston. Bluecoats, not sure; I need to watch them again. Santa Clara is great visually; not sure about their music. The refreshing thing about Madison is that they actually carry entire musical phrases and melodies throughout the show. Amazing!

I'm glad that unlike last year, this show didn't get shut down by tornado warnings, horizontal sheets of rain, etc. It would've been a shame to have it disrupted by bad weather yet again. It looks like a great venue for a drum corps show.

Edited July 17, 2011 by byline

[the lone ranger]

Hey people! There are lots of people working hard on the field. Having a piano player is one small element of crowns show. He is more meant to be heard than seen.

This forum seems full of bitter people who just trash shows. It's easy to be the devils advocate and pick on any moment of ANYONE'S show. Hence why judging is so free to interpretation. If I want to make a tape that sounds like a certain corps should get a 15 in any caption. I could do that. And vice versa. With a first place score. It's all in your mindset. On how you wish to perceive said performance!

[BDCorno]

I don't dislike the show, but I don't love it either, at least based on their Akron performance, where I thought Bluecoats were clearly superior to Crown. (I haven't seen them otherwise, apart from watching the Ft. Worth performance on the Fan Network, but only after seeing them live.) I think you're onto something, although the problem may be inherent in the nature of drum corps, whose reliance on a large number of people acting uniformly is at odds with the essence of rock and roll staging. So Crown is overcompensating with the elements some perceive as "cheese". Also, and it pains me to say this because of my feelings generally about synthesizers in drum corps, but they're not making enough of the "Rach Star" pianist, who is rarely the focus of attention and whose solos aren't very interesting. There's no "star" element whatsoever, apart from his entrance, which at Akron was downplayed relative to how it had been handled in Ft. Worth. (He's not given as much star treatment as a piano soloist would receive in the classical world either. The theater where I work will shortly be hosting a major piano competition, where so intent are the audience on seeing the performers' hands that the organizers have arranged for a camera to be placed directly above the keyboard, with projection onto a large screen.) But perhaps things changed in Minnesota, given the high score they earned?

For me, I really thought they chopped up Symphonic Dances way too much. It's a fantastic piece, but they really didn't give it much of a chance. The musical show really jumps around too much to get into a flow. Some fun parts, no doubt, but not a cohesive package overall.

[thirdcoast]

It was really hot at the show!

I have the fan network, it is not anything like being there... LIVE! Totally different.

Edited July 18, 2011 by thirdcoast

[BRASSO]

I think you're onto something, although the problem may be inherent in the nature of drum corps, whose reliance on a large number of people acting uniformly is at odds with the essence of rock and roll staging. So Crown is overcompensating with the elements some perceive as "cheese".

I don't know what this means. I have a family member through marriage that is the staging manager for some of the top rock and roll acts in the business. He's been all over the world. He tells me that most rock and rollers are absolute perfectionists about all manner of the staging, ie positioning of lights, props, backdrop particulars, instrument positioning on the stage, backup singers and extra musicians positioning, etc and all these things that go into the concert becoming positively perfect in every way imaginable before their band steps foot onto the stage.

Also, Rock and Rollers are the biggest panderers in show business. They are all.. ALL... about " the cheese " factor. If one act does something that is cheesy that the crowd eats up, they will put it into their act somehow in the future... and without batting an eye. Rock and Rollers are the kings and queens of " the cheese factor". I'd go so far as to state that it would be literally impossible to do a show revolving around a " Rock Music " theme and not have " cheese " in the display. In fact, it is REQUIRED in my opinion in order to be true to the source material and the nature of it's delivery by the typical rock and roll performing artist.

Edited July 18, 2011 by BRASSO

[N.E. Brigand]

I think you're onto something, although the problem may be inherent in the nature of drum corps, whose reliance on a large number of people acting uniformly is at odds with the essence of rock and roll staging. So Crown is overcompensating with the elements some perceive as "cheese".

I don't know what this means. I have a family member through marriage that is the staging manager for some of the top rock and roll acts in the business. He's been all over the world. He tells me that most rock and rollers are absolute perfectionists about all manner of the staging, ie positioning of lights, props, backdrop particulars, instrument positioning on the stage, backup singers and extra musicians positioning, etc and all these things that go into the concert becoming positively perfect in every way imaginable before their band steps foot onto the stage.

Well, I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing. I wasn't questioning the perfectionism of rock performers or their staffs. I have myself in fact worked (once) with a rock and roll manager for a major performer (ten Top 10 hits over a dozen years) who was indeed exceedingly picky about the venue and other conditions for his performer, to such a degree that he would annoy audience members by walking up and down the theater aisle to confer with the sound engineers at the back of the house every thirty seconds. On the other hand, a documentary I saw a couple years ago, The Wrecking Crew, showed how musically weak many bands were in the 1960s, at least, compared to the studio musicians who actually recorded their instrument tracks: one member of the the Byrds, for instance, explained that after their first hit, "Mr. Tambourine Man", which was recorded in a day by session players, went to number one, the band insisted on recording their next song, "Turn Turn Turn" with themselves on the instruments. And it went to number one as well -- but it took two weeks to record.

But let me follow up in a new thread, as I also want to address a point you made in the locked "cheese" thread, and they sort of go together.

[BRASSO]

Well, I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing. I wasn't questioning the perfectionism of rock performers or their staffs. I have myself in fact worked (once) with a rock and roll manager for a major performer (ten Top 10 hits over a dozen years) who was indeed exceedingly picky about the venue and other conditions for his performer, to such a degree that he would annoy audience members by walking up and down the theater aisle to confer with the sound engineers at the back of the house every thirty seconds. On the other hand, a documentary I saw a couple years ago, The Wrecking Crew, showed how musically weak many bands were in the 1960s, at least, compared to the studio musicians who actually recorded their instrument tracks: one member of the the Byrds, for instance, explained that after their first hit, "Mr. Tambourine Man", which was recorded in a day by session players, went to number one, the band insisted on recording their next song, "Turn Turn Turn" with themselves on the instruments. And it went to number one as well -- but it took two weeks to record.

But let me follow up in a new thread, as I also want to address a point you made in the locked "cheese" thread, and they sort of go together.

We don't disagree then if we are talking about typical rockers being unusually picky about " staging " ( which is what you said above ). We also don't disagree that Rockers can sometimes be sloppy ( or slow ) in their quality level of their musicianship on their instruments. Thanks for clarifying your remarks here.

Edited July 18, 2011 by BRASSO