MarimbaManiac Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 I don't understand how people are coming here with the idea that it could be more dangerous to stop a show during the middle of a performance than to let the corps finish..... HUH? Corps staff stop run throughs every day of the week and believe or not performing members do actually look at the DMs. When someone goes down during a performance and is unable to get back up every effort should be made the get them out of the way or to get assistance to them. There could have been something far worse than a twisted ankle or sprain. This is not football where a really long play rarely exceeds a few seconds. Last night during Academy's show we saw the way guard equipment was being blown yards away from it's release point. That show should have been stopped. I noticed that video is not on the Fan Network today. I wonder why. It is DEFINITELY dangerous to stop a show in mid motion. DEFINITELY. That isn't really a debatable issue. This is one of the reasons staff are so insistent that members stop exactly when they are supposed to and not go on, because at these tempos, if only a few members don't catch that they are stopping, there WILL be collisions. Seen it happen a million times, and it can lead disastrous consequences. The fact is that no matter how well a corps is trained, the odds of all 150 members stopping at exactly the same time mid show are very low. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piper Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 This isn't football. When you're wounded in action a professional trainer doesn't come out there to stroke your butt or your ego and give you their shoulder to lean on. If you're still conscience your primary mission is to get back up and recover asap or crawl off the the field so your corpsmates can carry on without having to step on you. "The Corps and the Corps and the Corps". All for one and one for all. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 ... But how would we know that going into the future? No offense, but that is a rather absurd question. Is there any oversight or data collected on injuries? (I actually don't know the answer to that question - just asking) njthundrrd answered this quite well and I have nothing to add to that response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musclebud Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) It is DEFINITELY dangerous to stop a show in mid motion. DEFINITELY. That isn't really a debatable issue. This is one of the reasons staff are so insistent that members stop exactly when they are supposed to and not go on, because at these tempos, if only a few members don't catch that they are stopping, there WILL be collisions. Seen it happen a million times, and it can lead disastrous consequences. The fact is that no matter how well a corps is trained, the odds of all 150 members stopping at exactly the same time mid show are very low. [/quo Who said anything about 150 MEMBERS STOPPING AT THE SAME TIME? You did not get that from my post so please don't use that on me. Yes people are moving in every conceivable direction at very high tempos but there are judges, staff, DMs all on the sidelines who are able to make a determination when and if a show has to be stopped due to injury or weather. Can you just imagine how a trial lawyer could use something like that to make a case regarding a serious injury or worse. Edited July 28, 2012 by musclebud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 It is DEFINITELY dangerous to stop a show in mid motion. DEFINITELY. That isn't really a debatable issue. This is one of the reasons staff are so insistent that members stop exactly when they are supposed to and not go on, because at these tempos, if only a few members don't catch that they are stopping, there WILL be collisions. Seen it happen a million times, and it can lead disastrous consequences. The fact is that no matter how well a corps is trained, the odds of all 150 members stopping at exactly the same time mid show are very low. Agree. It's all about the situation. During a practice performer's are mentally prepared for an e- stop. During a performance they are not. When 100 people catch the e-stop and 20 or 30 don't, a LOT of bad things can and do happen. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 I would go ballistic if my son were left lying on the field...in pain...with no attention whatsoever. And I would not be filing any law suits. Then you, sir, are a rarity; because in the culture of today if a non-qualified person exacerbated an injury to a youth, even if they were being altruistic, many people would see the millions of dollars DCI corps collect every year and envision themselves getting a new house, boat, car, dream vacation, ... So, the risk of being the proverbial "Good Samaritan" in today's culture is very, very, very high. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fsubone Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 As a recently marching member, I honestly do think it would have been much more dangerous if they had stopped the show in order to attend to the member. When we do visual rehearsals, there are always very clear instructions about starts and stops, so that no one can get hurt. I've had people go on, and hurt other members, I've been hurt because someone else didn't stop when they were supposed to. During a show situation, a lot of the time you go pretty much on auto-pilot, so stopping would be hard to either get directions for, or to get everyone to stop at once. Anyone else remember when the kid in Magic went down in 2002? No one helped him out, and he was down for awhile. It happens much more rarely in shows than rehearsals (says the kid who ended his season with a rehearsal injury). I've seen many more kids go down or get hurt during a practice than during a show. Someone else mentioned it, aren't there EMTs at shows? Would they be the most qualified to get the person instead of the staff? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockyGranite Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 As a recently marching member, I honestly do think it would have been much more dangerous if they had stopped the show in order to attend to the member. When we do visual rehearsals, there are always very clear instructions about starts and stops, so that no one can get hurt. I've had people go on, and hurt other members, I've been hurt because someone else didn't stop when they were supposed to. During a show situation, a lot of the time you go pretty much on auto-pilot, so stopping would be hard to either get directions for, or to get everyone to stop at once. Anyone else remember when the kid in Magic went down in 2002? No one helped him out, and he was down for awhile. It happens much more rarely in shows than rehearsals (says the kid who ended his season with a rehearsal injury). I've seen many more kids go down or get hurt during a practice than during a show. Someone else mentioned it, aren't there EMTs at shows? Would they be the most qualified to get the person instead of the staff? I understand and appreciate your remarks and I really don't think it was necessary to stop the show in this situation. But there was at least a full minute from the time he fell when the rest of his Corps was quite some distance from him. He did his best to get out of their way when they maneuvered toward him and nobody stumbled over him. It was then almost another minute with nobody in the Corps near him and finally two guys ran out and got him and his tuba off the field. If there had been EMT people at, say the other endzone, they would have had ample time to get him off the field during that first minute. It was obvious by the time 10 seconds passed that he wasn't going anywhere on his own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13strokeroll Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) This isn't football. When you're wounded in action a professional trainer doesn't come out there to stroke your butt or your ego and give you their shoulder to lean on. If you're still conscience your primary mission is to get back up and recover asap or crawl off the the field so your corpsmates can carry on without having to step on you. "The Corps and the Corps and the Corps". All for one and one for all. Please tell me you didn't just equate a blown knee to wounded pride?!? Have you no conscious - or is it conscience? You just irrepairably smeared any logical discourse that might have shared the notion to keep things moving and clear the member when best expeidient. Edited July 28, 2012 by 13strokeroll 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstar Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) Its a sign of our times when we put winning ahead of helping somoene . The people that say the show must go on are the same people that keep going when someone is hurt on the street. I find it funny that we find the killing of 12 people in a movie theatre so upseting but the injury of a young adult less then important then a musical show? As a firefighter I've seen dozens of memebrs stop fighting a fire to help another brother or sister in service. I have to add that the people who write that stopping a show is dangerous to the other performers.....really. How?, they might hurt their lips stopping mid note. Blow a knee coming to a slow stop....if the activity is so dangerous why don't they wear protective gear like yellow vest and hard hats....sheeeeeesh. Its beating drums, thowing flags and blowing horns for Gods sake. Stop the show and help the member. How would people have felt if God forbid that member of Crown had fractured the leg and the bone puncture a blood vessal? Can't happen, think again. Every second is important in a medical emergency, especially if you don't know the nature of the injury. Edited July 28, 2012 by Blackstar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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