TV Can’t Save Drum Corps

[Slingerland]

Excellent sentence. And if there were as much infighting and dissention among the ranks of any of their corps as there has been among the directors themselves, they'd likely shut the darn thing down and hope that they could restart with a new crew next year.

Agreed.

[cixelsyd]

So you think that DCI should invest hundreds of thousands of dollars on advertising in hopes that they reap a landfall of profits?! That is a lot of money to spend with the "hopefully this works" mindset. What folks say things like that's at best speculation, and at worst fairly naive hope. You can't run a non-profit based on hope: especially when it comes to hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It's my understanding that ANY corps can advertise themselves anyway they want to. There is nothing stopping, say, Carolina Crown from buying local TV ad space, or billboard space, etc to advertise their products and/or DCI products, right?

Do you think it's possible that DCI and/or its member corps have explored this pretty fully and come to the conclusion that it's probably futile, or at the very least the dollars needed for mass-market, broad advertising with nothing but hopefully speculation when it comes to financial returns/profits benefitting from the extra advertising, could be much better spent/utilized elsewhere.

Good point. Of all the things various corps directors suggest, I never hear them saying "if only we could get back on PBS". And of all the ideas corps actually pursue on their own, I never see them splurging on public outreach as cost-intensive as a television broadcast. A same-day, local TV commercial for a drum corps show might have a more reasonable cost/benefit, and I think there may still be a show sponsor out there somewhere that does that - but we have no TV programs in the works.

For that matter, the other marching arts do not seem to be pursuing TV broadcast time either. WGI had TV exposure in the 1980s, but not now. BOA is not on TV. What these two circuits are doing is a Fan Network platform, powered by DCI. Meantime, the YEA! marching band circuit does neither TV nor Fan Network, promoting through more of a constant-contact style.

[perc2100]

Yes. Everyone knows that part of running a professional, active, growing enterprise involves investing nothing at all in marketing or promotion, and that hiring marketing and promotions people with proven backgrounds in their field is a huge waste of money.

There's a difference between running a marketing program & dumping hundreds of thousands of dollars on what would likely be a low-return investment, like TV commercials.

Also, people misconstrue DCI & its members corps as a business enterprise: they are a non-profit. Yes, non-profits are allowed to make money to invest back into their venture. But their goal is not to make money. In DCI's case, their 'mission' is to funnel as much money back to the member corps, so member corps can use the money as they see fit for their own organizations.

Should DCI radically change philosophy and become a full-on for-profit business? That's a different debate, and one that DCI seemingly is not interested in seriously entertaining (that I know of: they certainly don't seem to be headed in that direction publicly). As of right now DCI is a non-profit organization whose mission is to take as munch money as possible from profits made from shows, merchandising, etc. and distribute it back to its member corps. If that is their mission, I can 100% understand why they want to go the more conservative route with their marketing "department," spend as little possible on marketing, doing only things they know work, etc. I suspect financially they are not in the position to drop hundreds of thousands of dollars on TV advertising in the hopes that it will yield the amount of casual interest from non-fans who will spend enough money on DCI to pay for the TV advertising. I would bet their research has led them to believe their best bet for drawing fans are people who are already interested and participating in the marching arts, either through WGI, college music, or high school band: if that's the case they don't need to spend as much money to draw in the core audience base as it would take to draw in a substantial amount of non-known casual fans.

I think part of the problem here is that too many people in drum corps expect perfection from the kids who march, but accept mediocrity from the adults who run the activity.

Maybe. I think a bigger part of the problem is that too many people want to play 'armchair quarterback,' where they have just enough experience to lead them to believe they know more than the folks actually doing this for a living. People who think DCI is in a position where they should bypass the most logical step of "strengthen your base first" and jump right into "drop lots of money to bring in mainstream, non-bando fans who have little/no current rooted interest in the marching arts." These people seemingly would've thought cavemen should skip fire and go right to inventing central heating & electricity: who want to not only put the cart before the horse, but want to put the cart several miles before the horse.

DCI HAS to strengthen their base audience before even entertaining the idea of drawing a mainstream audience. They need to have finals attendance consistently in the 24-30 thousand annual attendance (for Saturday night, not just Thursday - Saturday). They need to literally exhaust their current efforts to the point where they can seriously say, "we've drawn as many fans as we could possibly draw with our current marketing strategy; it's time to take it to the next level." DCI is not there yet. They are improving (if their press releases are accurate), but they are no where near the point yet to start spending more money to market to the mainstream audience. It literally boggles my mind to hear people who present themselves to be business gurus who can't fathom that logical, obvious step of marketing (to strengthen your base before you try to branch out to get new customers). That strategy is similar to me taking a middle school beginning band class, have them play a tuning note & Bb scale in half notes, and then expecting them to succeed playing Holst Suit.

There is a logical progression that has to happen, and bypassing crucial steps in that progression will ONLY lead to failure (and in this case, a very costly one for DCI and its member corps).

[perc2100]

Good point. Of all the things various corps directors suggest, I never hear them saying "if only we could get back on PBS". And of all the ideas corps actually pursue on their own, I never see them splurging on public outreach as cost-intensive as a television broadcast. A same-day, local TV commercial for a drum corps show might have a more reasonable cost/benefit, and I think there may still be a show sponsor out there somewhere that does that - but we have no TV programs in the works.

For that matter, the other marching arts do not seem to be pursuing TV broadcast time either. WGI had TV exposure in the 1980s, but not now. BOA is not on TV. What these two circuits are doing is a Fan Network platform, powered by DCI. Meantime, the YEA! marching band circuit does neither TV nor Fan Network, promoting through more of a constant-contact style.

On one hand, it is fascinating to me that WGI seems to have more success & popularity than DCI does, while seemingly "trying" less (by that I mean with bare minimum marketing). But on the other hand, its obvious why: hundreds of scholastic groups. Parents like to support their kids, schools often like to support their performing groups, etc. It's a much easier 'market' to break into, if you're catering to school kids.

[garfield]

There's a difference between running a marketing program & dumping hundreds of thousands of dollars on what would likely be a low-return investment, like TV commercials.

Also, people misconstrue DCI & its members corps as a business enterprise: they are a non-profit. Yes, non-profits are allowed to make money to invest back into their venture. But their goal is not to make money. In DCI's case, their 'mission' is to funnel as much money back to the member corps, so member corps can use the money as they see fit for their own organizations.

Should DCI radically change philosophy and become a full-on for-profit business? That's a different debate, and one that DCI seemingly is not interested in seriously entertaining (that I know of: they certainly don't seem to be headed in that direction publicly). As of right now DCI is a non-profit organization whose mission is to take as munch money as possible from profits made from shows, merchandising, etc. and distribute it back to its member corps. If that is their mission, I can 100% understand why they want to go the more conservative route with their marketing "department," spend as little possible on marketing, doing only things they know work, etc. I suspect financially they are not in the position to drop hundreds of thousands of dollars on TV advertising in the hopes that it will yield the amount of casual interest from non-fans who will spend enough money on DCI to pay for the TV advertising. I would bet their research has led them to believe their best bet for drawing fans are people who are already interested and participating in the marching arts, either through WGI, college music, or high school band: if that's the case they don't need to spend as much money to draw in the core audience base as it would take to draw in a substantial amount of non-known casual fans.

Maybe. I think a bigger part of the problem is that too many people want to play 'armchair quarterback,' where they have just enough experience to lead them to believe they know more than the folks actually doing this for a living. People who think DCI is in a position where they should bypass the most logical step of "strengthen your base first" and jump right into "drop lots of money to bring in mainstream, non-bando fans who have little/no current rooted interest in the marching arts." These people seemingly would've thought cavemen should skip fire and go right to inventing central heating & electricity: who want to not only put the cart before the horse, but want to put the cart several miles before the horse.

DCI HAS to strengthen their base audience before even entertaining the idea of drawing a mainstream audience. They need to have finals attendance consistently in the 24-30 thousand annual attendance (for Saturday night, not just Thursday - Saturday). They need to literally exhaust their current efforts to the point where they can seriously say, "we've drawn as many fans as we could possibly draw with our current marketing strategy; it's time to take it to the next level." DCI is not there yet. They are improving (if their press releases are accurate), but they are no where near the point yet to start spending more money to market to the mainstream audience. It literally boggles my mind to hear people who present themselves to be business gurus who can't fathom that logical, obvious step of marketing (to strengthen your base before you try to branch out to get new customers). That strategy is similar to me taking a middle school beginning band class, have them play a tuning note & Bb scale in half notes, and then expecting them to succeed playing Holst Suit.

There is a logical progression that has to happen, and bypassing crucial steps in that progression will ONLY lead to failure (and in this case, a very costly one for DCI and its member corps).

The red above connotes that you believe that "business enterprise" and non-profit are mutually exclusive. They aren't. DCI's sole purpose is to make money. The By-laws, however, specify that "profits" are calculated and paid out "above the line", i.e. before DCI expenses for promotion and growth. This is azz-backwards and delineates DCI's practices from a "normal" business model where "profit" (what's available to be paid out to corps, or "shareholders") is calculated AFTER expenses of running and growing the business. In DCI, however, some directors believe and promote that DCI's executive staff is inept and that they, the corps, are better at marketing than DCI and, therefor, nearly ALL of DCI's earnings should be paid to them to promote and grow the activity. This argument is perverted and is the ultimate unfunded mandate, because the BOD can set the amount to paid out to themselves while they simultaneously charge DCI's executive staff with mandates, and then sit back and complain that DCI is ineffectual at meeting growth and promotion goals even as they complain that DCI needs to pay out more to them.

Not until these things happen will this situation be rectified:

1. Corps payouts should ONLY be calculated "below the line", i.e. AFTER promotion and growth expenses

2. BOD must agree to fund DCI sufficiently to actually meet the growth/promotion goals that the BOD charges them with

3. An INDEPENDENT oversight body must be established to judge the business practices of the executive committee (ideally, the entire BOD should be non-affiliated persons with only minimal representation by the corps themselves)

DCI's "base" is dying off even as they represent the greatest portion of current support dollars. The actual "base" that DCI should be focused on is organic growth of participation, then retaining those participants to become the "base" of tomorrow. Not coincidentally, and for the same reasons you correctly say that parents support the WGI model, the parents of new DCI participants will help support the current-day "base" of support. Current financial supporters among the old-line base should be treated as kings and queens and the benefits of financial support should be increased to attract other financial supporters (disclaimer: I am one of those financial supporters).

These are not "armchair" business practices. They are tried and true and completely workable inside the confines of DCI's "non-profit" structure. TV is not a medium of entertainment for DCI, even with today's hi-def or theater experience. TV should ONLY be a medium to introduce prospetive marching member participants and their parents to the activity. Spending any money to provide entertainment to the existing fan base is wasted if it doesn't draw organic growth of the participant base.

The presumption that "those doing it" in drum corps have a better knowledge base than those who are not "doing it" - as if current staff have ALL the answers and the best ones to boot - is flawed. Any unbiased observer would look at DCI's current problems and rightfully ask "Why do they continue to do things that have brought the activity to its current position?". My expectation is that outside, un-affiliated, input as a replacement to the current BOD (director)-led decision process is precisely what the activity needs now.

The hubris that "only the directors are best-equipped to lead the activity" is just a narcissistic part of the problem that has brought the activity to the point where we "armchair" participants (and business people) are discussing how to save it.

IMO, of course.

[Jeff Ream]

Sort of throwing this out there: It is a matter of percentage pay out vs. revenue collected combined with risk vs. reward. Let's say that to return as much money as possible to the corps DCI decides to pay out an 80% return of collected revenue to the corps with only 5% going to salaries and 15% to marketing. Let's also say that in this scenario $1 mil is collected; thus $800k is paid out to the corps. Sounds reasonable, right? However let's say that DCI decides to pay out just a 50% return to the corps, and 15% goes to salaries and 35% goes to strategic marketing; and let's say due to securing higher caliber staff through higher salaries, along with more than doubling the strategic marketing, $3mil is collected; the corps in that scenario, though receiving a lower percentage pay out, would actually receive $1.5mil.

You're talking business sense 101. corps directors are talking right now 101. The biggest issue is how long til the move pays off? Too many corps would be hurt if the wait is too long. A few would be hurt if there was any wait.

[Jeff Ream]

Probably a director that knows something about running a business, advertising, and generating revenue. Unfortunately, there aren't many that do, so they will continue to live in their shoe box.

If they did, we would not see corps like the Glassmen have to take a year off.

If they did, you would see these things.

It's hard to "grow drum corps" as seems to be the big push without making a little investment in the process financially.

It's 1st year business school, and most can't seem to use that logic, oh well.

Let's hope the activity grows itself then. Forget using tactics that work and relying on grassroots word of mouth systems, those must be working.

that's why the BOD needs to be occupied by far fewer directors and more real world business people

[Jeff Ream]

Yes. Everyone knows that part of running a professional, active, growing enterprise involves investing nothing at all in marketing or promotion, and that hiring marketing and promotions people with proven backgrounds in their field is a huge waste of money.

I think part of the problem here is that too many people in drum corps expect perfection from the kids who march, but accept mediocrity from the adults who run the activity.

:worthy:/>

[Jeff Ream]

On one hand, it is fascinating to me that WGI seems to have more success & popularity than DCI does, while seemingly "trying" less (by that I mean with bare minimum marketing). But on the other hand, its obvious why: hundreds of scholastic groups. Parents like to support their kids, schools often like to support their performing groups, etc. It's a much easier 'market' to break into, if you're catering to school kids.

and despite the hoopla since the late 90's, DCI's outreach to schools has really been eh. Having taught at a highly successful program in our area for several years, i can tell you what was received was bare bones flyers/posters. This was a school that has sent several kids to march both DCI and DCA, with successful WGI groups for indoor

[Stu]

You're talking business sense 101. corps directors are talking right now 101. The biggest issue is how long til the move pays off? Too many corps would be hurt if the wait is too long. A few would be hurt if there was any wait.

And therein is one of the business flaw issues concerning why the activity cannot grow. The corps directors/boards who have become dependent on competitive payouts to 'survive' cannot grasp the fact that by continuing to rely on a very high percentage payout it actually yields small/no activity growth and continuously paltry revenue streams. We can banter about the true definition of what is or is not a true Major League, but one thing all Major Leagues have in common is that the teams are not survival-dependent on payouts from the sanctioning bodies, they have many other revenue streams to prop them up during competitive lull periods.