N.E. Brigand Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 It would probably be helpful to see charts of how old the active DCI corps were in, say, 2003, 1993, 1983, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camel lips Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 Actually there's lots of design and performance that's not being judged even today. It just comes at the beginning rather than the end of the show. (See, for instance, the first 90 seconds of this year's show by the Cadets.) And here lays the problem with that from my seat. . Designers are setting up the mood for the show and/or experimenting with avantgarde type of nuances. Not exactly setting the stands on fire with that stuff.They also don't want to burn the corps chops off in the first 30 seconds knowing they got another 13 min of high intensity drill ahead of them. Put that at the end of the Judged portion of the show where the kids can really let loose and have nothing left to lose and no telling where that could lead. Imagine a corps that has been hated for several years with all the esoterical stuff. Just a Example. Blue Devils. They continue to go that route and shove that stuff down our throats and everyone is tired of seeing that. But for the last 30 seconds of the show they pull off something really magical for the fans that reach their "heart" rather than their "intellect" then perhaps the previous 12 1/2 minutes might be forgiven. Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted December 9, 2013 Author Share Posted December 9, 2013 And here lays the problem with that from my seat. . Designers are setting up the mood for the show and/or experimenting with avantgarde type of nuances. Not exactly setting the stands on fire with that stuff.They also don't want to burn the corps chops off in the first 30 seconds knowing they got another 13 min of high intensity drill ahead of them. Put that at the end of the Judged portion of the show where the kids can really let loose and have nothing left to lose and no telling where that could lead. Imagine a corps that has been hated for several years with all the esoterical stuff. Just a Example. Blue Devils. They continue to go that route and shove that stuff down our throats and everyone is tired of seeing that. But for the last 30 seconds of the show they pull off something really magical for the fans that reach their "heart" rather than their "intellect" then perhaps the previous 12 1/2 minutes might be forgiven. Just a thought. todays sheets would have to be totally re-vamped. see, GE isn't just for the paying customers. Ge is for the intended audience, aka the judge. But in this scenario.,...so say a corps like madison, who gives you jump up moments start to end, goes against BD who goes esoteric for 12 minutes, then goes nuts the last minute. Who wins? odds are BD, because of the esoteric, depth of design with the hidden meanings etc Going back to old school GE judging isn't the answer. I do think the revamp of the sheets, while a good idea, hasn't been as much of a game changer as people thought. Why? because the people that control what the judges do are the ones putting the shows out there. the biggest issue DCI faces is, as I've said hundreds of times before...it's that "business" people run the business. People that compete against each other 3 months of the year control the business. They are too consumed by their own corps goals and needs and wants to truly do justice for the activity as a whole. I mean Hop complaining about DCI's overhead is a joke....I just saw someone post on a facebook group that he makes more than the governor of PA. Really?? Per guidestar it's no secret YEA employs more people than DCI does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slingerland Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 Point of order - George Hopkins never had a seat on the DCI Board. The YEA organization did. If he's decided to hand it over to a member of his Board or someone else from his organization, YEA will continue to have a seat. If he DID step away completely and take his organization with him, then it means that there's an opening for someone else (is there a Bluecoats, Regiment, or Cavaliers interest in that position, if it really exists?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 And here lays the problem with that from my seat. . Designers are setting up the mood for the show and/or experimenting with avantgarde type of nuances. Not exactly setting the stands on fire with that stuff.They also don't want to burn the corps chops off in the first 30 seconds knowing they got another 13 min of high intensity drill ahead of them. Put that at the end of the Judged portion of the show where the kids can really let loose and have nothing left to lose and no telling where that could lead. Imagine a corps that has been hated for several years with all the esoterical stuff. Just a Example. Blue Devils. They continue to go that route and shove that stuff down our throats and everyone is tired of seeing that. But for the last 30 seconds of the show they pull off something really magical for the fans that reach their "heart" rather than their "intellect" then perhaps the previous 12 1/2 minutes might be forgiven. Just a thought. GE bitd as well as today is all an opinion BUT you also assume that todays drum corps person or the kid coming up and eventually taking over isnt into the more esoteric show verses the toe tapping, company front, high leg lift production. ANd dont go by what you hear on this forum or any other for that matter or any polls.......................I laugh when I see fox or other news stations with all their polls...1st polls are only as good as those who are being polled and its only a sampling of people never majority , although people ( some ) believe so GE is also about how well someone has done something and if it came across. You can have a get off your seat production and still be a hot mess. BUT if you want that to succeed because although it was " entertaining " (subjective word ) then you get rid of the competition aspect totally because at that point it becomes NOT who has the better product its about who gets you to stand or is more popular at a given moment. NOW, this would change our activity as we know it.......................................I am part of the activity today as well as BITD and sometimes I want to laugh when I hear my own piers from BITD saying how much more entertaining it was then. In some respects ONLY because of my own likes and dislikes ( like everyone ) I can agree, many shows I love and miss from BITD BUT...except for a few corps ( very few ) shows were picked, music played and COMPETITION no matter what level it was top or bottom was a huge factor...people went to shows to see a competition......so has this changed today ? maybe BUT as much as there are so many who want to take away or say competition doesnt matter , including many who are members today no one breaks their BUTTS for months and strives for 2nd place ( just a number as an example )..now this also doesnt mean that 2nd place, 10th place or 22nd place wasn't a successful year..just depends on ones personal goals and wanted results...........................i 'm sure I dove more into this than was needed....sorry to all....JMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camel lips Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 todays sheets would have to be totally re-vamped. I am totally for that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snaredude08 Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 Good gosh. George Hopkins is one of the most unprofessional leaders in the activity, and he's an embarassment. Slam me with strawman arguments about how I just don't like woodwinds or something, but it's true. I couldn't care less about what happens to instrumentation or amps or whatnot, but if he's so passionate about DCI expanding and being taken seriously, as a CEO and mascot for one of the most prominent organizations in the activity, he can't make his internet prescence read like a 12-year-old's Livejournal. The lack of professionalism he shows over and over and over in how he deals with the public is well-documented and, as far as public relations go, his retirement from Cadets cannot come soon enough. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camel lips Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 Good gosh. George Hopkins is one of the most unprofessional leaders in the activity, and he's an embarassment. Slam me with strawman arguments about how I just don't like woodwinds or something, but it's true. I couldn't care less about what happens to instrumentation or amps or whatnot, but if he's so passionate about DCI expanding and being taken seriously, as a CEO and mascot for one of the most prominent organizations in the activity, he can't make his internet prescence read like a 12-year-old's Livejournal. The lack of professionalism he shows over and over and over in how he deals with the public is well-documented and, as far as public relations go, his retirement from Cadets cannot come soon enough. Do I detect a hint of sarcasm? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 (edited) Good gosh. George Hopkins is one of the most unprofessional leaders in the activity, and he's an embarassment. Slam me with strawman arguments about how I just don't like woodwinds or something, but it's true. I couldn't care less about what happens to instrumentation or amps or whatnot, but if he's so passionate about DCI expanding and being taken seriously, as a CEO and mascot for one of the most prominent organizations in the activity, he can't make his internet prescence read like a 12-year-old's Livejournal. The lack of professionalism he shows over and over and over in how he deals with the public is well-documented and, as far as public relations go, his retirement from Cadets cannot come soon enough. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm..yet one of the most successful................omg did i just defend him,,,,,,,,ewwwwww...............lol :not me: question: why aren't personal attack's allowed? seems like it's ok for some but not others........ok maybe some deserve it more than others...lol.....just seems like the rule doesnt apply to some but does for others. kinda like the government I guess....lol Edited December 10, 2013 by GUARDLING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaos001 Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 todays sheets would have to be totally re-vamped. see, GE isn't just for the paying customers. Ge is for the intended audience, aka the judge. But in this scenario.,...so say a corps like madison, who gives you jump up moments start to end, goes against BD who goes esoteric for 12 minutes, then goes nuts the last minute. Who wins? odds are BD, because of the esoteric, depth of design with the hidden meanings etc Going back to old school GE judging isn't the answer. I do think the revamp of the sheets, while a good idea, hasn't been as much of a game changer as people thought. Why? because the people that control what the judges do are the ones putting the shows out there. the biggest issue DCI faces is, as I've said hundreds of times before...it's that "business" people run the business. People that compete against each other 3 months of the year control the business. They are too consumed by their own corps goals and needs and wants to truly do justice for the activity as a whole. I mean Hop complaining about DCI's overhead is a joke....I just saw someone post on a facebook group that he makes more than the governor of PA. Really?? Per guidestar it's no secret YEA employs more people than DCI does. For crying out loud. The CORPS decide what is GE. They put it on the sheets. The judges adjudicate based on the parameters set up by the corps! This nonsense needs to stop. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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