fsubone Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Why would well executed flag & rifle work, including being tossed around to each other (and caught), be dated? OK, throw some dance moves in too, but just because it is from 30 yrs ago doesn't mean it is not effective. I really don't understand. Probably because an entire section would have to be created just so the guard can line up and do that. At the speed and fluidity of today's shows, would take a lot of work to design in a moment for the guard to do a 70s-esque flag feature. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 (edited) Why would well executed flag & rifle work, including being tossed around to each other (and caught), be dated? OK, throw some dance moves in too, but just because it is from 30 yrs ago doesn't mean it is not effective. I really don't understand. because..its been done over and over for decades....although some moves are coming back and made new and fresh again.....tossing and throwing is only a part of the guard activity now...there is way more to it than it used to be..and its just not adding a dance move or 2............effect bitd was created by tossing mostly and throwing..today effect is much more than that...sure it could be a part of it BUT there are much more ways today to create effect and after a while a toss is a toss is a toss...it actually become Un efffective..its like seeing a guard toss a 7 ok impressive...then within the next 2 min. they toss a doz more 7s...ahhh ok so what then.we have gone way past that. again i will say 27, PR were the best of the best bitd..its not taking anything away from them ..AT ALL.... we can go back to many company fronts, squad turns, color pre's, signature songs like in the past year after year, to the rear marches....they were all impressive and done very well bitd...doesnt mean we should or need to go back to it Edited March 10, 2014 by GUARDLING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 (edited) no dated just means dated...noone today would create a show like a show was BITD, .. Of course they wouldn't. The instrumentation utilized and allowed in competition was different.. The show on field judged times were different( Corps timed shows longer in competition BITD ). Judging system today totally unlike BITD ( nothing in common between a tick system and a build up system ). Numbers of competitors allowed on the field in competition different. It would be like comparing todays rugby with 1970's NFL football. Crown, BD, of last season would not have finished in the top 12 in ( for eample ) 1980. Theres not much diasgreement on this assessment it would seem to me. ( both Corps would have been penalized out of the top 12 in 1980 for using band instruments, for overtiming, for 20 other things). You are asking a corps like the 27th Lancers to be compared with today, so naturally we can say with confidence as well that todays Corps would be buried on the judging system utilized in 1980. But you asked for the comparison, so thats where 2013 BD , Crown would have finished in 1980. Out of the TOP 12 at Finals in 1980, Not much doubt about. ( but thats why, imo, these comparisons of dissimilar musical groups under different judging systems, rules of competition, instrumentation, numbers allowed on the field, etc is sort oif silly, imo ) Edited March 10, 2014 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 (edited) Of course they wouldn't. The instrumentation utilized and allowed in competition was different.. The show on field judged times were different( Corps timed shows longer in competition BITD ). Judging system today totally unlike BITD ( nothing in common between a tick system and a build up system ). Numbers of competitors allowed on the field in competition different. It would be like comparing todays rugby with 1970's NFL football. Crown, BD, of last season would not have finished in the top 12 in ( for eample ) 1980. Theres not much diasgreement on this assessment it would seem to me. ( both Corps would have been penalized out of the top 12 in 1980 for using band instruments, for overtiming, for 20 other things). You are asking a corps like the 27th Lancers to be compared with today, so naturally we can say with confidence as well that todays Corps would be buried on the judging system utilized in 1980. But you asked for the comparison, so thats where 2013 BD , Crown would have finished in 1980. Out of the TOP 12 at Finals in 1980, Not much doubt about. ( but thats why, imo, these comparisons of dissimilar musical groups under different judging systems, rules of competition, instrumentation, numbers allowed on the field, etc is sort oif silly, imo ) NO...you didnt read back enough to see where it came from I didnt ask for any comparison at all. The other poster wanted to know WHY work like 27 wasnt done now when shown to some HS kids and designers just moved on and changed the subject....so I told him why..thats it................not sure where you got alll what you wrote BUT thats how my statement came to be i know it happens alot here BUT one cant take one line from and entire paragraph and expect the context to be correct.............but its all good...im sure you understand Edited March 10, 2014 by GUARDLING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RContra Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 (edited) Guardling knows what's up. The books that were done in the 70s and 80s would be considered child's play by modern guards. Trust me--I teach groups like that. It's nothing to them to pull that stuff off. They'd rather go outside their comfort zone in terms of movement, dancing, spinning, tossing and catching instead of doing what is safe and easily achievable. It's all about taking things to another level. Edited March 10, 2014 by RContra 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Guardling knows what's up. The books that were done in the 70s and 80s would be considered child's play by modern guards. Trust me--I teach groups like that. It's nothing to them to pull that stuff off. They'd rather go outside their comfort zone in terms of movement, dancing, spinning, tossing and catching instead of doing what is safe and easily achievable. It's all about taking things to another level. Maybe they could take it to another level by being, say, 30 yards apart as they heave them to each other (& just as important, catch them). I thank the Good Lord daily for the Legacy DVDs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euph2008 Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Musically, I think that PR 2004 is one of the most challenging books I've ever heard. It may not be as clean as Crown 13, but holy cow there's a lot going on in that one, especially the Euph part in the opener! Blows me away every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 (edited) Maybe they could take it to another level by being, say, 30 yards apart as they heave them to each other (& just as important, catch them). I thank the Good Lord daily for the Legacy DVDs. you are assuming that I didnt love what was done back then...i was part of it and it was also the reason I went from playing horn to going to the visual side of the activity..It was the best and even still IF I go back and watch things...which I really don t much....it still is wonderful....wonderful in 2014.?.not so much BUT the 70s 80s or 90s isn't 2014..thats pretty much it...again throwing stuff can be cool BUT a guard of today MUST create other forms of excitement and NOT rely on throwing and tossing....its like making a skater jump for 4 min....how much efffect is it after a while......................its not. Edited March 10, 2014 by GUARDLING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 you are assuming that I didnt love what was done back then...i was part of it and it was also the reason I went from playing horn to going to the visual side of the activity..It was the best and even still IF I go back and watch things...which I really don t much....it still is wonderful....wonderful in 2014.?.not so much BUT the 70s 80s or 90s isn't 2014..thats pretty much it...again throwing stuff can be cool BUT a guard of today MUST create other forms of excitement and NOT rely on throwing and tossing....its like making a skater jump for 4 min....how much efffect is it after a while......................its not. depends on whether there are streamers on each end of the weapons! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 depends on whether there are streamers on each end of the weapons! OMGGGGG..LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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