Fran Haring Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 On 8/6/2017 at 1:21 AM, George Dixon said: I know it's crazy - I just heard that yesterday. Heard the same thing, George. A friend with ties there told me Saturday. Our seats were out near the goal line, left side looking at the field.... and I gotta admit, that SCV audio thing was kinda tough to get used to. Made for some rather interesting "is it live or is it Memorex" effects, shall we say. LOL. For me, the jury is still out on this whole situation, but right now I'm not comfortable with brass ensembles, outside of soloists/featured small ensembles (the SCV thing is beyond "featured ensembles") being fed through speakers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 11 minutes ago, Fran Haring said: Made for some rather interesting "is it live or is it Memorex" effects, If you listen close to the Hopkins interview posted in another thread he States emphatically that some corps are now 'recording' their horns and playing those recordings back during the actual show. So your Memorex quip is more true than you think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 On 05/08/2017 at 1:43 PM, Land_Surfer said: Never has there been a time where a drum corps needed to be amplified on the field! A well designed and developed corps can fill any stadium with sound. There is nothing worse than to hear only a few horns amped over the rest of the line as they pass by a mic vs. the entire line playing in unison, and in tune! Amplification makes it hard to judge by both audience and judges, and there is no practical way of mixing sound and do it right when the mixing board is front and center behind the podium. It's counter to all sound mixing logic!!! No corps has the resources to purchase and maintain the technology (and employ the staff to operate it) to ensure that the amplified sound is the same quality as pure acoustic brass and percussion. Amplification and electronic instruments to a drum corps is becoming like steroids to professional sports!!! That said, it wouldn't surprise me if auto-pitch correction technology isn't eventually adopted so that corps don't have to be so picky about the quality of performers they need. Amplification and electronic instruments also widens the gap between corps based on "haves and have nots" vs. the capabilities of the members. There is no way I would pay today's premium dues to play second chair to a keyboard or amped vocalist! It is not educational and should be considered an insult to hardworking musicians. Not long ago, the difference between a good show and great show was proportional to the amount of hard work and training put forth by members and staff. Today, it hinges on a mixing board and power supply. Technical difficulties use to be minor issues - today they can make or break a show. I wasn't going to weigh in on this - just read the thread, but this post pulled me up short. First off - well stated and thought out, good sir. I saw both nights of Allentown via FloMarching and quite honestly, I enjoyed the lower-tier corps more than most of the finalist contenders. On Saturday in particular the fun kind of disappeared for me after Academy, picked up again with BAC and SCV but otherwise, in all honesty, I was bored, and when I wasn't bored, I was shaking my head in disbelief. Do the sound mixer people (who should not be there at all in my opinion, let the kids perform) not hear what everyone else seems to be hearing? Or is it the aim of the mixer to actually drown out the brass and battery? As for singing/narrative, yes - way overdone. I actually yelled "SHUT UP" when Cavies talked over a really tasty bass feature. Words are mundane, a tight bassline is spectacular. Why bury the spectacular with the mundane? The talent level and work ethic of the kids on the field has never been higher, and I give them full respect and admiration. Thank God I was never asked to do what those kids are doing, I would have died! Their hard work is getting buried and disrespected. I'm looking at you, designers and makers of rules - looking right at you... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 4 hours ago, Stu said: If you listen close to the Hopkins interview posted in another thread he States emphatically that some corps are now 'recording' their horns and playing those recordings back during the actual show. So your Memorex quip is more true than you think. I thought that was illegal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Haring Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 Just now, Grandpa said: I thought that was illegal? Me too, unless a brass passage is recorded for playback to create an effect. Like the pitch-bend thing from 2014. Whatever I heard from SCV, it wasn't recorded playing... but it was just, well, odd. To me, at least. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 On 05/08/2017 at 11:34 PM, Cadevilina Crown said: I'm willing to bet that this offseason we will see some significant, conservative changes to the rulebook with regards to electronics and amplification. We may also see some changes to the adjudication system that address these elements. I sure hope you are right. I'm retired now and in the past my wife (also drum corps) and I have talked about hitching up the travel trailer and following the tour around a little. Not sure I'm real motivated to do that given what I'm seeing and hearing this year. DCI needs to consider the audience, and the $$$ they bring in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denverjohn Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 2 hours ago, Fran Haring said: Me too, unless a brass passage is recorded for playback to create an effect. Like the pitch-bend thing from 2014. Whatever I heard from SCV, it wasn't recorded playing... but it was just, well, odd. To me, at least. I don't feel as "tricked" by SCV because they often feature that 12-person group in isolation so I get more of an isolated pit feature vibe from it. The sound is VERY different from the 64 acoustic-only horns. To me, it sounds almost like electrical saxes/woodwinds when they play and I can tell who is who. Odd, yes. Fake or deceived, no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 3 hours ago, Grandpa said: I thought that was illegal? He states that this 'is legal' and being done: Corps are taping and dubbing horns, then playing the recording duplication in the performance in order to layer and to get more sound Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Haring Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 1 hour ago, denverjohn said: I don't feel as "tricked" by SCV because they often feature that 12-person group in isolation so I get more of an isolated pit feature vibe from it. The sound is VERY different from the 64 acoustic-only horns. To me, it sounds almost like electrical saxes/woodwinds when they play and I can tell who is who. Odd, yes. Fake or deceived, no. That's a great way of putting it, and along the lines of how it sounded for us. Almost had a muted effect at times, but we knew it was from a certain section of players... I just didn't know who. Still strange to me, though... and I gotta be honest, for me it's right at the edge of the fine line between "is the horn line playing, or is an audio tech doing the heavy lifting here?" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 7, 2017 Share Posted August 7, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Fran Haring said: ...it's right at the edge of the fine line between "is the horn line playing, or is an audio tech doing the heavy lifting here?" This is SCV which means that the caliber of horn players will always be extremely high. So, when electronic amplification and dubbing is involved no matter if they sound great or poor, no matter if they sound normal or odd and strange, the 'heavy lifting' within that amplification is done by the adult sound engineer manipulating the sound system. Edited August 7, 2017 by Stu 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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