Pioneer What Next?

[JimF-LowBari]

5 minutes ago, ouooga said:

Purely curious, what does everyone want/expect DCI to do?

I'm constantly advocating that DCI needs to take a larger role in the business of drum corps, from negotiating collective buying opportunities at big box retailers or specific gas stations in exchange for discounts, to coordinating a more regulated tour that involves all corps being near each other all season, to ongoing marketing and public relations efforts throughout the summer that utilize the corps for promotional reasons. At all phases of this, I'm told routinely that the corps are separate entities from DCI, and want to remain separate in all of these aspects.

If the corps are so separate from DCI, what is the expectation from DCI in this situation? From everything I've gathered, the corps are so separate from DCI that there really isn't much DCI can do, other than maybe revoking status or barring from competition, which doesn't actually help anyone.

Think you hit the nail on the head for me. What I’d like to know is what DCI thinks it can do in these situations. Lot of good talk about protecting the youth but then something hits the fan and DCIs hands are tied due to legalities or DCI/Corps roles with each other 

Edited August 16, 2018 by JimF-LowBari

[Tony Flores]

1 minute ago, JimF-LowBari said:

Think you hit the nail on the head for me. What I’d like to know is what DCI thinks it can do in these situations. Lot of good talk about protecting the youth but then something hits the fan and DCIs hands are tied due to legalities or DCI/Corps roles with each other 

this is where the culture, the operations need to change. it is time for the entire org to change, w/r to health and safety of the performers. the inamtes cant run t he asylum anymore, they've proven they are not up to the job anymore

[garfield]

14 minutes ago, JimF-LowBari said:

Ok enlighten us. Besides the meetings, putting policy together and contract with agency to handle calls what else has been done? Remember I work for Uncle Sam and too many times have seen great sounding policies put together and then just wither due to lack of action. 

I know Pioneer is not a sexual harassment case but just haven’t seen that DCI has done anything including check on the allegations. That lack of action worries me with the SA/SH cases. Not trying to be a hard case but just don’t see action and wonder if DCI has the knowledge to know how to take action 

Your employment with Uncle Sam both explains why you're sensitive to policies with no follow-through and makes me concerned that your definition of "right" is NOT what you must see on a daily basis.  I can't think of any system/structure more imperfect for DCI than a governmental agency-think of job-justification and, useless policy and report writing, and little-to-no results.  Your grand experience in that arena is certainly useful in establishing what NOT to do!

But, it seems to me of the reading I've done on the Pio situation, their issue STARTS with their leadership and staff.  That it sounds like it's failed (allegedly, and in one documented user experience in this discussion) might make one ask to get "DCI" involved, but to do what, exactly?  There is, under current policy, a series of "qualification" standards that a corps much attain in order to be a part of the DCI tour and performance opportunities of a season.  Should that be a high bar or a low one?  Was it performed in the Pio case?

Also, for "DCI" to have the power to shut down a corps during the season, should that be a high bar or a low bar?  Do we know that DCI followed the protocol power authorized it by its board to inquire and, if necessary, take action in the Pio case?  Has anyone asked Dan's office?  

What if DCI did everything required of it and, after conclusion, determined that Roman and his Board had the final decision to continue their season?  Then where does the resolution come from?  It's still ROMAN.  Even if you disagree with this process, in the end, unless DCI determines that kids are at risk, the corps and its director retain the right to make the decision.

This is, currently and by voice and action, the way DCI's member corps want it to be.  And, as TerriScher stated in her Reddit response, it likely won't change until a complete housecleaning and restructuring takes place.  And, as I said yesterday, THAT will not happen until "the corps" of DCI have regained trust and respect for "the executives" of DCI.

IMO, and in the opinion of many, very directly involved and influential members of the leadership of the member corps.

 

 

 

[garfield]

13 minutes ago, ouooga said:

Purely curious, what does everyone want/expect DCI to do?

I'm constantly advocating that DCI needs to take a larger role in the business of drum corps, from negotiating collective buying opportunities at big box retailers or specific gas stations in exchange for discounts, to coordinating a more regulated tour that involves all corps being near each other all season, to ongoing marketing and public relations efforts throughout the summer that utilize the corps for promotional reasons. At all phases of this, I'm told routinely that the corps are separate entities from DCI, and want to remain separate in all of these aspects.

If the corps are so separate from DCI, what is the expectation from DCI in this situation? From everything I've gathered, the corps are so separate from DCI that there really isn't much DCI can do, other than maybe revoking status or barring from competition, which doesn't actually help anyone.

Plan and execute the tour to generate performance opportunities and generate gate revenue.

Advance and be a proponent of the activity.

That is all, mostly.

[ouooga]

4 minutes ago, Tony Flores said:

this is where the culture, the operations need to change. it is time for the entire org to change, w/r to health and safety of the performers. the inamtes cant run t he asylum anymore, they've proven they are not up to the job anymore

Obviously I don't know everything about every corps, but that just doesn't seem true at all levels. There's definitely some corps that 'get it' and they do it really, really well.

What absolutely baffles me is how other corps just ignore what their peers are doing. I said before on here, Blue Devils seem like the smartest run drum corps, and the members seem to resonate with what they're doing extremely well. I cannot fathom how there are corps like Pioneer who can look at the activity and how the Blue Devils run their organization, and then simply think "meh, my way's better."

(Purely just one example)

[Rileydog]

7 minutes ago, Tony Flores said:

this is where the culture, the operations need to change. it is time for the entire org to change, w/r to health and safety of the performers. the inamtes cant run t he asylum anymore, they've proven they are not up to the job anymore

Change the culture of DCI or Pioneer? To change DCI would require the corps to give up their own autonomy to a reorganized charter and board of directors. (I.e. NCAA, NASCAR,etc)

[JimF-LowBari]

Oh there are a lot of similarities between DCI and DoD and Tony hit it above. Starts with human nature and goes from there.

As for Pioneer all I ask is was DCI aware of the allegations and what if anything was done. This includes picking up the phone and saying wtf?

And nice insult to govt employees. It’s gotten a lot better over the decades but still have to hear sad stereotypes like the one you just have. But I’m sure you have first hand knowledge of the subject

[garfield]

1 minute ago, Rileydog said:

Change the culture of DCI or Pioneer? To change DCI would require the corps to give up their own autonomy to a reorganized charter and board of directors. (I.e. NCAA, NASCAR,etc)

You've just identified the hill to climb.

 

[Rileydog]

So much about the way DCI operates is based on trust. Trust has been lost. How will it be regained?

[Tony Flores]

1 minute ago, Rileydog said:

Change the culture of DCI or Pioneer? To change DCI would require the corps to give up their own autonomy to a reorganized charter and board of directors. (I.e. NCAA, NASCAR,etc)

DCI. We have seen and will see in the coming weeks or months that this isn't an isolated incident. DCI needs more control over health...not full control of every corps, but control and enforcement of targeted policies to prevent things like this in  the future.